V2 of Sierra-1?

[SunByrne]

Because Dave doesn't already have enough to do...

I was looking at the Sierra series main page and noticed that every Sierra-line speaker now is either post-Klippel (the LX) or has a post-Klippel V2 crossover, except one:

The venerable Sierra-1.

This speaker will always be near and dear to my heart because this was my first Ascend speaker back in like 2010. And despite the plethora of other Ascend speakers that I own, I do still own and regularly use a pair of Sierra-1s and a pair of Sierra-1 NrTs. (Listening to the S1s as I type this, in fact.) Still a very good speaker for the price, but doesn't seem to get much attention here anymore, I think because of its age.

So I'm wondering if it couldn't also benefit from a Klippel-optimized crossover, a V2. The V2 is a really nice improvement for the EX and a game-changer for the Duo. How much better could the humble S1 be?

Swapping out the crossovers is a pretty easy upgrade and if such a thing existed for the S1 at the modest price point of the EX or Duo V2, I know I'd do it in a heartbeat.

Am I the only one?

This of course assumes such a thing is actually sensible, which of course only Dave really knows for sure. But now that I've thought about it, I can't help but wonder.

[rdkusher]

you're definitely not the only one.i would very much like to be able to upgrade my sierra 1's also.i actually emailed dave a while back about this but don't remember his exact reply.i could check and see if i still have it but it is probably better to wait for him to answer as things may have changed since then.

[racrawford65]

I guess it depends alot on how well the S1 is still selling and whether or not they want to keep inventory of the original or NrT tweeters.

[billy p]

I guess it depends alot on how well the S1 is still selling and whether or not they want to keep inventory of the original or NrT tweeters.

I think it was mentioned prior here on the forum the S1...will remain with the original tweeter theS1 upgrade to NrT will be/or is replaced by the LX....iirc.

[davef]

This one is complicated... I want the Sierra-1 to remain a sub $1000/pair of speakers. Changes / updates will most certainly bring the retail cost of the pair to above $1000, and likely to within a few hundred of our LX.

Chances are these will remain the same but I will reevaluate this for 2024.

[SunByrne]

This one is complicated... I want the Sierra-1 to remain a sub $1000/pair of speakers.

Of course. That's a magic budget number for a lot of people so that makes perfect sense. I'm sure it's no accident that the LX is just under $1500.

Changes / updates will most certainly bring the retail cost of the pair to above $1000, and likely to within a few hundred of our LX.

Oh! I'm surprised by that. I figured with the same drivers and the relatively nominal fees for the V2 crossover upgrades for the Duo and EX that the price difference wouldn't be that big. But of course if the price difference is that much then it indeed might not make much sense.

Chances are these will remain the same but I will reevaluate this for 2024.

Of course. As noted, you've got a plate that's more than full enough as it is. I still can't believe how many new things you did in 2022--like I said, everything on the Sierra page has something new, plus the new 340s, plus the ELXs aren't even on that page yet, and all of that was 2022. Crazy busy.


But having said all that, I still can't help but speculate. I have to imagine you've put an S1 on the Klippel at some point, right? If not to publish it, just for the sake of your own curiosity. I mean, I know that if I were you, I'd want to know. Heck, I'm not you and I'm still curious.

And then, armed with that information, I bet you've at least thought about what an improved crossover would look like. But given how busy you've been, it's easy to think you've not gotten around to actually building them. Maybe someday when you get caught up, though, you might, right?

So, how about we just go with "if you ever do get around to building S-1 V2 crossovers, I'd be interested in them, even if you choose not to make that a part of your permanent product line."

[MDinno]

The Sierra 1 measurements look like they dig as deep as the LX with it's bass extension. How do they actually compare??

[racrawford65]

Based on the published specs, the LX in-room is 11 Hz lower then the S1 (28 vs 39). I've not heard the S1, but do have a pair of LX and they do put out a tremendous amount of bass.

[SunByrne]

While the anechoic numbers are only different by 1Hz, the in-room is very different, and as someone who owns both, I can say the in-room numbers better reflect the reality: it's no contest. The LX has much better extension. The LXs are bass monsters, particularly for a bookshelf speaker.

[davef]

The Sierra 1 measurements look like they dig as deep as the LX with it's bass extension. How do they actually compare??

It is difficult to do this comparison because the bass response on the Sierra-1, like nearly all bass measurements out there, was performed using close mic techniques. This is not nearly as accurate as Klippel NFS measurements, which are true anechoic measurements.

Here is a comparison of the bass response between the LX and Sierra-1. Besides being more linear and a more natural roll-off, you will note that the there is quite a bit more output from the LX from about 60Hz down to 40Hz. And significantly more output from the LX from about 35Hz and below. The Sierra-1, as good as it is, starts to struggle a bit at frequencies below 35Hz where the bass roll-off rate starts to increase. at 25Hz, the LX has 10dB more output in comparison, that is a very significant difference.

LXvsS1 compare.png

As far as how the Sierra-1 and LX compare to each other overall. The LX is like Sierra-1 on steroids - it does everything better.