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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Blingleberry
Is there any benefit to using the 2EX cross over on an S2 and it's original woofer?
If I upgrade to V2, I can give the old crossovers to my brother, who I gave a pair of original S2's to.
Thx
The mid-woofer is also different.
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
sliang
I use my 2EX with a SVS SB2000 Pro sub crossed over at 80 Hz. I listen to rock, some jazz and pop, and classical. I also use it for movies/video in a 2.1 configuration. Will I see a benefit with the V2 upgrade?
I think so, but with your listening preferences you would benefit more with the LX upgrade.
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Blingleberry
That's what I'm hoping!
Oh, so he will buy the woofers and you give him the crossovers.
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
sliang
I use my 2EX with a SVS SB2000 Pro sub crossed over at 80 Hz. I listen to rock, some jazz and pop, and classical. I also use it for movies/video in a 2.1 configuration. Will I see a benefit with the V2 upgrade?
The most audible difference between V1 and V2 is that V2 has more linear "smoother" horizontal dispersion. It isn't "wider" - just more linear at off-axis angles. This makes the speaker sound more spacious in most rooms. That and the V2 is a bit warmer with just a small bit more midbass compared to V1. It doesn't matter if using with or without a subwoofer, the differences are not in that frequency range.
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Blingleberry
I thought LX's were a totally different series with different cabinets but just realized that's wrong and there are two choices to upgrade an S2.
Probably this is a Dave question but why would someone upgrade a S2 or S2EX to an LX? What's the criteria for deciding to go from an S2EX to an LX instead of a V2?
Same reason why someone would go from say a Lamborghini Huracan to a BMW M8... Different use. The LX sounds like a large tower speaker when fed enough power, it has great detail and is very spacious, with shocking dynamics. However, it doesn't quite reach the levels of detail or intimacy that Sierra-2EX V1/V2 can deliver with certain types of music.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Blingleberry
FWIW, I'll try the V2 upgrade because a) I'm already invested in the S2EX and b) I'm somewhat skeptical. Also, if the V2 crossovers are of value to an original S2, then I can give the old crossovers to my brother.
EX crossovers are designed to match with our EX woofers. If your brother has Sierra-2's (not Sierra-2EX), it is best to stick with the original Sierra-2 crossover - which uses a very different woofer.
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
N Boros
Or will the LX also be fine as far as not giving me listening fatigue? I'm not sure what is wrong with my ears, but the Sierra 2's have seemed to fix the problem and I don't want to upgrade and end up with listening fatigue all the time.
LX will definitely NOT cause you any listening fatigue. While the Titan dome is a metal dome tweeter, it is an Aluminum / Magnesium alloy. The addition of Magnesium, which is extremely stiff and light, pushes the breakup modes (ringing) to nearly 30kHz, well out of the range of human hearing. This characteristic is what makes Beryllium tweeters so popular (a true Be dome pushes the resonance mode to about 35kHz).
Combining that characteristic with its extremely wide dispersion - this tweeter sounds more like a RAAL ribbon than even other brand ribbon tweeters. If you don't experience listening fatigue with your Sierra-2, you definitely won't with LX :)
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
natetg57
I currently have S2EX up front and Luna's as surrounds and am considering either V2 or LX. I listen to everything from classical to Porcupine Tree. I can only use my Denon X4500H to power all five speakers. Would that be enough power at 10 feet away to experience the benefits of the LX? I only listen at moderate to loud volumes, nothing crazy. Whereas before it seemed almost everyone preferred the LX, does the V2 close the gap some?
Absolutely enough power for LX or Sierra-2EX V2 :)
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Wow, I’m happy I decided to swing by and see if anything was new on the forum. I was about to purchase LX upgrade kits for my EX V1s, but now think I’ll just upgrade them to EX V2s. I already have a pair of LXs, and variety is the spice of life, right?
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
davef
LX will definitely NOT cause you any listening fatigue. While the Titan dome is a metal dome tweeter, it is an Aluminum / Magnesium alloy. The addition of Magnesium, which is extremely stiff and light, pushes the breakup modes (ringing) to nearly 30kHz, well out of the range of human hearing. This characteristic is what makes Beryllium tweeters so popular (a true Be dome pushes the resonance mode to about 35kHz).
Combining that characteristic with its extremely wide dispersion - this tweeter sounds more like a RAAL ribbon than even other brand ribbon tweeters. If you don't experience listening fatigue with your Sierra-2, you definitely won't with LX :)
This was not the answer I was expecting. Now I have a more difficult decision. :) Following your suggestions though, since I use them mostly for home theater and rock music I think the LXs might be the best for me. Thank you.
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1 Attachment(s)
Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
davef
Absolutely enough power for LX or Sierra-2EX V2 :)
Thanks Dave. Right now I'm leaning towards three LX upgrade kits but I wondered, are there any situations where a 2EX V2 center would be recommended along with LX left and rights? Attachment 2410
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
natetg57
Thanks Dave. Right now I'm leaning towards three LX upgrade kits but I wondered, are there any situations where a 2EX V2 center would be recommended along with LX left and rights?
With Dave's post:
Quote:
Originally Posted by
davef
It very much depends on listening habits and music genres. The S2EX V2 is the more detailed speaker and is best for acoustic music, jazz, most classical. The LX has way more "slam" and much deeper bass and with enough power, can play much louder without strain. The LX is better for rock, dynamic home theater and is the better choice for those who "listen to everything".
For the center channel, I would think it if you played multichannel acoustic, jazz, and classical music, then S2EXv2 center would the better choice.
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
I finished installing the Sierra 2 EX V2 upgrade yesterday. The box and crossovers were well packaged. The V2 NFS optimized labels were missing, but I'll reach out to Dina to get the labels. Since I previously worked on the Luna V2 upgrade, it was actually a much easier process than the Lunas as the cabinet is larger.
Overall, I'd say the Sierra 2 EX V2 is definitely a bit warmer and there was a little bit more of a mid-bass presence. I never considered the Sierra 2 EX overly bright....lively, but not harsh. For my comparison, I switched out my Luna V2 pair for the Sierra 2 EXs, & then the EX V2s for a listening session using a Sonos Amp. The Sierra 2 EX V2 upgrade was subtle, but worth the price of the upgrade. All-in-all, the upgrade took about 1.5hrs on the first speaker and then an hour to perform on the 2nd speaker. It was a straightforward process.
However, for those that prefer to rock out and go loud, the comparisons that people have made between the LX & EX still stand, even with the new EX V2. If you love your existing pair of Sierra 2 EX speakers, the V2 upgrade will make you love them a little bit more. Overall, I'm happy and am looking forward to seeing what sort of upgrades are next.
A suggestion for Dave:
For all speaker upgrades listed on the website, add a download link for the instructions. I used the LX upgrade instructions as an initial reference point. I ordered an adjustable magnetic 8-in-1 Klein Tools stubby screwdriver. It was the perfect tool for the job as I could adjust the height to work around adjacent components when attaching the crossover to the cabinet. Having the instructions available ahead of time is helpful for planning.
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Thanks Robert. Were the EX v2 in their surround locations or were you able to place them as if they were the main speakers? I'm assuming you were feeding them as large mains vs their normal surround signals from your receiver. Room Interactions and speaker placements will have an impact on incremental differences and improvements.
I'm also interested in the directivity and if they give a more spacial feel.
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
davef
EX crossovers are designed to match with our EX woofers. If your brother has Sierra-2's (not Sierra-2EX), it is best to stick with the original Sierra-2 crossover - which uses a very different woofer.
That's the case, he has original S2s. Do you sell just the woofers only? Are they available elsewhere?
Thx!
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
rifmon
Thanks Robert. Were the EX v2 in their surround locations or were you able to place them as if they were the main speakers? I'm assuming you were feeding them as large mains vs their normal surround signals from your receiver. Room Interactions and speaker placements will have an impact on incremental differences and improvements.
I'm also interested in the directivity and if they give a more spacial feel.
Correct - when installed on my Sonos Amp, they see the full range with no EQ. I actually did both, installed as surrounds on my main home theater, and also as mains on my Sonos bedroom setup. Times like this make me wish that I could try a pair of the original Sierra 2 EXs with the EX V2s and perform a quick "blind" comparison. I'll save that for the more "die hard" speaker fans out there. :)
From a horizontal dispersion standpoint, they performed well when I was moving around the room. The main takeaway that I can honestly say is the general performance was a tad "warmer" with a little more "punch". It was more subtle than what I experienced with the Luna to the Luna V2 upgrade. The Sierra 2 EX already measured well before, the V2 has been optimized with Dave's NFS research. They should sound even more transparent and true to the source material.
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Blingleberry
That's the case, he has original S2s. Do you sell just the woofers only? Are they available elsewhere?
Thx!
The EX woofers are custom made and we own the both the design and tooling. They better not be available anywhere else ;)
You can purchase the EX woofers from us but please note, they are quite expensive. Give us a call and speak with Dina.
Thanks!
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Robert
A suggestion for Dave:
For all speaker upgrades listed on the website, add a download link for the instructions. I used the LX upgrade instructions as an initial reference point. I ordered an adjustable magnetic 8-in-1 Klein Tools stubby screwdriver. It was the perfect tool for the job as I could adjust the height to work around adjacent components when attaching the crossover to the cabinet. Having the instructions available ahead of time is helpful for planning.
Hi Robert,
My sincere apologies. I believe yours were the very first V2 crossovers shipped so things on Dina's end were a bit confusing. All V2 crossovers have been shipping with instructions and V2 labels. Yes, please reach out to Dina so we can send you the V2 labels.
That's funny about the Klein Tools stubby scredwdriver, that is what we use in the shop, ours is the ratcheting model as it makes it even easier.
Here is a link to it:
https://www.amazon.com/Ratcheting-Sc...dp/B01I2KTKR8/
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
davef
Hi Robert,
My sincere apologies. I believe yours were the very first V2 crossovers shipped so things on Dina's end were a bit confusing. All V2 crossovers have been shipping with instructions and V2 labels. Yes, please reach out to Dina so we can send you the V2 labels.
That's funny about the Klein Tools stubby scredwdriver, that is what we use in the shop, ours is the ratcheting model as it makes it even easier.
Here is a link to it:
https://www.amazon.com/Ratcheting-Sc...dp/B01I2KTKR8/
No problem, I reached out to Dina and she has it covered. I'm looking forward to adding the additional "flair" to the cabinet! :)
I use the bigger brother ratchet screwdriver from Klein Tools. Great stuff. I'm now all set for any future Ascend upgrades!
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
natetg57
Thanks Dave. Right now I'm leaning towards three LX upgrade kits but I wondered, are there any situations where a 2EX V2 center would be recommended along with LX left and rights?
Attachment 2410
If you closely examine the measurements, the Sierra-2EX center has slightly wider dispersion along with higher efficiency. Honestly, you can't go wrong with either of them in your room and they both match up well with Sierra-LX left/right.
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
I just upgraded the Sierra 2 EX to the V2 version. The improvements are apparent, not huge, but well worth the cost of $135 per speaker. It's more linear with better in-room response and off-axis behavior. Subjectively, it seems warmer with more spaciousness than the EX, which was already a fine speaker, itself. Having an NFS during the speaker's developmental phase is a game changer for Ascend. Well done.
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
goldark
I just upgraded the Sierra 2 EX to the V2 version. The improvements are apparent, not huge, but well worth the cost of $135 per speaker. It's more linear with better in-room response and off-axis behavior. Subjectively, it seems warmer with more spaciousness than the EX, which was already a fine speaker, itself. Having an NFS during the speaker's developmental phase is a game changer for Ascend. Well done.
Cool... Your subjective impressions mirror my own. Thanks for posting!
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
I've now done my V2 conversions on a pair of S2EX and a pair of Lunas. Due to the circumstances, I can't add anything significant to what has been said about the audio results, other than that the S2EXV2 do seem a tad warmer.
My question is what to do with the replaced XOs!
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
How difficult is it to do one of these upgrades to the 2EX? I’ve never assembled or swapped out parts on a speaker before.
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
uniquepicture
How difficult is it to do one of these upgrades to the 2EX? I’ve never assembled or swapped out parts on a speaker before.
If you can handle a screwdriver and take your time, than it's not difficult at all. Here is a post with detailed instructions and links to videos http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/sho...ons-with-video!
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
My front 3 are 2ex. I’m curious if it would be worth to upgrade all 3 speakers or if I should just do the front L/R. Seems like it would mostly just benefit music or should I do all 3 for a seamless soundstage?
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
I received the V2 crossovers Monday, and promptly installed them. It went rather smoothly after reading the included instructions and watching the videos. I would recommend taking your time, and using a Phillips screw driver that fits the screws securely. Dave has recommended this one which works great, especially when working inside the cabinet.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01I2KTKR8...roduct_details
I also used a garden knelling pad that has a carrying handle cut out that the speaker binding posts fit into rather well, and protected the speaker while working on it.
https://www.acehardware.com/departme...e-pads/7005751
Swapping out the crossovers gave me an appreciation of how well built these speakers are. I had seen the pictures of the internals before, but seeing them with my own eyes and holding the components in my hands really impressed me.
I've only a few hours with the new crossover, but I'm already impressed. The new crossovers make the 2EX sound more refined with greater definition. The RAAL and the woofer seem even better integrated than before, the whole presentation more coherent.
Strings seem similar as before, but piano sound has improved greatly. Well recorded vocals are scary good now. Vocals were good before, but now they float in space between the speakers in a manner that reminds me of my old Virgo 2's which were very good at this. Besides the greater definition, tonal balance seems more accurate/pleasing.
I do not find this upgrade subtle at all. I think that it elevates the 2EX from a very good speaker to an excellent speaker.
I'll post an update after the new crossovers have had time to to settle in, but I can tell you already that this upgrade is well worth it.
Thanks for your hard work, Dave! We're all reaping the benefits!
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
I'd say that's one heck of a first post!
Thanks for a very well thought out and informative review. I find it very helpful as I already did an upgrade from the Sierra 2 to the Sierra 2 EX. While it's hard for me to buy kits for the LX version, the EXV2 upgrade is incredibly affordable and gives these speakers an upgrade of refinement.
Thanks again!
Edit haha. I see that was your 2nd post. Need better glasses
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
rifmon
I'd say that's one heck of a first post!
Thanks for a very well thought out and informative review. I find it very helpful as I already did an upgrade from the Sierra 2 to the Sierra 2 EX. While it's hard for me to buy kits for the LX version, the EXV2 upgrade is incredibly affordable and gives these speakers an upgrade of refinement.
Thanks again!
You're welcome!
I had really meant to post long ago, but the new V2 crossovers forced me into action!
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
33na3rd
You're welcome!
I had really meant to post long ago, but the new V2 crossovers forced me into action!
Great review! Really happy you are enjoying them. Upgrading the Lunas to the v2 was probably the biggest change I noticed from all the Ascend speakers I own that have the V2 upgrades. I always enjoyed the Sierra 2 EXs. The V2s definitely sound better than before, but less noticeable for me. Still worth the price. Glad to read other experiences.
I've been playing some various music from The SIDH on mine when testing...Just sound great on the Luna V2s and the Sierra 2 EX V2s. Throw in a sub or two and you've got a techno bagpipe party. :)
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Robert
Great review! Really happy you are enjoying them. Upgrading the Lunas to the v2 was probably the biggest change I noticed from all the Ascend speakers I own that have the V2 upgrades. I always enjoyed the Sierra 2 EXs. The V2s definitely sound better than before, but less noticeable for me. Still worth the price. Glad to read other experiences.
I've been playing some various music from The SIDH on mine when testing...Just sound great on the Luna V2s and the Sierra 2 EX V2s. Throw in a sub or two and you've got a techno bagpipe party. :)
Hi Robert,
I just spent part of the morning checking out The SIDH. Wow, they're great! That's one of the best things about audio forums, discovering new music. Thanks for mentioning them!
Come for the equipment discussions, stay for the new music recommendations!
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Welcome to the AA forum!
Great write-up, Jeff. Thanks for your comments and observations. I'm also considering the V2 upgrade! :cool:
Ted
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mjpearce023
My front 3 are 2ex. I’m curious if it would be worth to upgrade all 3 speakers or if I should just do the front L/R. Seems like it would mostly just benefit music or should I do all 3 for a seamless soundstage?
all three to make it as seamless as possible...and music comes through the center channel too in movies.
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
curtis
all three to make it as seamless as possible...and music comes through the center channel too in movies.
Yeah that’s the way I’m leaning right now. It’s just hard for me to imagine the 2ex getting much better, it’s already such an amazing speaker. I said the same thing though before I upgraded my 2s to the 2ex and I was wrong there.
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mjpearce023
Yeah that’s the way I’m leaning right now. It’s just hard for me to imagine the 2ex getting much better, it’s already such an amazing speaker. I said the same thing though before I upgraded my 2s to the 2ex and I was wrong there.
The Klippel NFS gives Dave more information to work with, and he has the know how to use that information when designing/engineering a speaker.
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mjpearce023
Yeah that’s the way I’m leaning right now. It’s just hard for me to imagine the 2ex getting much better, it’s already such an amazing speaker. I said the same thing though before I upgraded my 2s to the 2ex and I was wrong there.
I agree with Curtis, if you plan on upgrading to V2, it would be best to do all 3 speakers. The V2 has better directivity, and that is very important for the center.
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Robert
I've been playing some various music from The SIDH on mine when testing...Just sound great on the Luna V2s and the Sierra 2 EX V2s. Throw in a sub or two and you've got a techno bagpipe party. :)
Thanks for this recommendation - I too am enjoying The SIDH! Please recommend them in our music thread - they are terrific :)
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
33na3rd
I received the V2 crossovers Monday, and promptly installed them. It went rather smoothly after reading the included instructions and watching the videos. I would recommend taking your time, and using a Phillips screw driver that fits the screws securely. Dave has recommended this one which works great, especially when working inside the cabinet.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01I2KTKR8...roduct_details
I also used a garden knelling pad that has a carrying handle cut out that the speaker binding posts fit into rather well, and protected the speaker while working on it.
https://www.acehardware.com/departme...e-pads/7005751
Swapping out the crossovers gave me an appreciation of how well built these speakers are. I had seen the pictures of the internals before, but seeing them with my own eyes and holding the components in my hands really impressed me.
I've only a few hours with the new crossover, but I'm already impressed. The new crossovers make the 2EX sound more refined with greater definition. The RAAL and the woofer seem even better integrated than before, the whole presentation more coherent.
Strings seem similar as before, but piano sound has improved greatly. Well recorded vocals are scary good now. Vocals were good before, but now they float in space between the speakers in a manner that reminds me of my old Virgo 2's which were very good at this. Besides the greater definition, tonal balance seems more accurate/pleasing.
I do not find this upgrade subtle at all. I think that it elevates the 2EX from a
very good speaker to an
excellent speaker.
I'll post an update after the new crossovers have had time to to settle in, but I can tell you already that this upgrade is well worth it.
Thanks for your hard work, Dave! We're all reaping the benefits!
Happy to read this! Thanks for your feedback and it is my pleasure!!!
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Re: New: Sierra-2EX V2!!!
Hi All,
Coming out of lurker mode to comment on the v2 upgrade kits, just in case it's helpful to anyone trying to decide if they should go for it...
...The v2 kits for my two Sierra-2EX fronts arrived about 2 weeks ago. It took me about 20mins each speaker to install and I had no issues at all, other than having to fiddle with the gasket under the woofers to make sure it was properly re-aligned with screw holes.
My 2EXs are 10ft apart and 10ft from MLP and spend most of their service as fronts for HT (along with a Luna Duo v2 center, a couple of SVS rears and a Rythmik L12 sub), but the sound quality of 2 channel music is most important to me, so it is with music that I have done my critical comparison listening over the last couple of weeks.
I was not able to do any A/B testing, but I did not find the change in sound to be subtle, at all. I was actually surprised how much difference I noticed after the upgrade.
Although I don't use any room correction for music listening, oddly, the new measurements I took with ARC on my Anthem AVR don't look very different from v1... There is about +2dB at ~45Hz, which may or may not reconcile with what I'm actually hearing: more mid-bass and a weightier punch.
Overall, I would describe the new sound as richer and warmer. TBH, it took me a couple of days to get used to it. Initially I wondered if the u/g had taken SQ backwards, but once I'd confirmed that I could not detect any loss of detail, I became more confident in what I was hearing.
I feel that the v2 crossovers have tapped more of the potential of the SEAS woofer, or somehow allow the woofer more influence in the overall sound. Regardless, after 2 weeks I am genuinely delighted with the v2 upgrade, mainly because I am now rarely tempted to bring in the sub when I listen to music. The 2EX v2 delivers enough bass - with authority - to enable me to keep the signal path pure analog from my Denafrips DAC into my amp. I.e. No need to do any DSP / crossover in the Anthem for 2.1.
So for me, now being able to listen to multiple genres of music in pure 2-channel stereo is the biggest value I've gained with the upgrade.
One additional benefit I've noticed is more clarity way off axis (very noticeable) and potentially a slightly more spacious presentation... maybe. That one is tough to say for sure without doing A/B.
Anywho, that has been my very positive experience and I have zero regrets. Hope it's useful to someone.
Rob