Surrounds and in-ceiling suggestions

[Mango]

First time posting.

I recently auditioned the FV15HP at a friend's home theater...Wow!!! I have been shopping/researching for my new 7.2.4 HT and I think I found the first 2 pieces (dual FV15s).

My room is 9'5"H x 15'5"W x 24'3" L. 2 rows of seating (not yet decided on distances). I only care about the 1st row two middle seats.

Use will be 100% HT, but a fair amount lot of Music Concerts video content, not just movies.

1st Question: Should I go for the Raal versions of the Tower and Horizon? Or is the benefit negligible for a 100% HT use? I wont watch movies/concerts at a super loud level.

2nd Question: Assuming I get the Tower/Horizon Front Mains combo (no raals) to go with 2 FV15HPs. What would you recommend for the 4 Surrounds and 4 Atmos/Height speakers? Would like to stay under $2000 on these 8 speakers. My preference would be for Inwalls as I like the flush look of a HT.

I will be using either a MRX-1120 or a Denon 6500 as the receiver with no separate Amps.

Appreciate the responses/suggestions in advance!

[racrawford65]

I'd suggest the HTM200's for your surrounds and Atmos/Height speakers. I'm using them with the Sierra 2's for LRC.

[Mango]

Unfortunately I know the wife.....having the surrounds sticking out 6.5"s from the wall will already be a tough sell, having them stick out 6.5" from the ceiling will be a deal breaker.......This is why I am considering inwalls for the surrounds and inceling for the atmos/height speakers.

[racrawford65]

My bad - missed that you were looking at inwalls. You may want to check AVS threads to see what people are using for in-ceilings.

[Mango]

My bad - missed that you were looking at inwalls. You may want to check AVS threads to see what people are using for in-ceilings.

I did. They are all over the place. I was hoping some current Sierra/Horizon users here would chime in if they had non-Ascend Acoustics surrounds/ceilings...There has to be someone using these as front mains and inwalls/in-ceilings as surrounds/height speaker....

As a newbie, I just need some guidance on what to look for when trying to match different surround speakers to the Sierra Towers/Horizon combo.

[racrawford65]

OK.
Not sure what your room is like, but there is a thread or two where someone flush mounted HTM200s in their ceiling.
Otherwise, would the luna's work for you? I can't find the dimensions but believe they are smaller than the HTMs. again, not in wall/ceiling.
Or try some others where there is a 30 day trial - monoprice has some ribbon tweeter in wall/ceiling speakers that you could always try out. Not sure about GoldenEar trial period.

My opinion is you don't need to go with expensive speakers for the ATMOS channels.


Sorry I can't be of more help.

[davef]

First time posting.

I recently auditioned the FV15HP at a friend's home theater...Wow!!! I have been shopping/researching for my new 7.2.4 HT and I think I found the first 2 pieces (dual FV15s).

My room is 9'5"H x 15'5"W x 24'3" L. 2 rows of seating (not yet decided on distances). I only care about the 1st row two middle seats.

Use will be 100% HT, but a fair amount lot of Music Concerts video content, not just movies.

1st Question: Should I go for the Raal versions of the Tower and Horizon? Or is the benefit negligible for a 100% HT use? I wont watch movies/concerts at a super loud level.

2nd Question: Assuming I get the Tower/Horizon Front Mains combo (no raals) to go with 2 FV15HPs. What would you recommend for the 4 Surrounds and 4 Atmos/Height speakers? Would like to stay under $2000 on these 8 speakers. My preference would be for Inwalls as I like the flush look of a HT.

I will be using either a MRX-1120 or a Denon 6500 as the receiver with no separate Amps.

Appreciate the responses/suggestions in advance!

I always recommend upgrading to the RAAL ribbons, even for home theater. So many of our customers who are "mostly home theater" - end up listening to a lot more music than they ever expected to ;)

For in-ceiling / in-walls, I have been recommending the Sonance VP60 series (square or round). They perform very well with our products.

Hope this helps!

[diesel79]

I’m glad this topic just came up and the Sonance speakers are a good match with the Ascends! My buddy is an installer and I sm picking up a pair of VP62R’s for his dealer cost. He also recommended the Dynamat Dynaboxes which I can also get at cost. Finally gonna have a 5.1, although my 3.1 is pretty darn impressive sounding as is. Lol

[BrianNLS]

I have four Atlantic Technologies IC-6 OBA in-ceiling speakers for Atmos in my setup with L-R Sierra 2s with RAAL and Horizon center with RAAL (and some 20 year old Paradigm Mini Monitor rear surrounds). These Atlantic Technologies in-ceilings have near-flush, paintable, magnetic mount grills, are solidly built, and sound very good in my system. They are relatively affordable at $325 each.

Worth considering, anyway.

[Mango]

I have four Atlantic Technologies IC-6 OBA in-ceiling speakers for Atmos in my setup with L-R Sierra 2s with RAAL and Horizon center with RAAL (and some 20 year old Paradigm Mini Monitor rear surrounds). These Atlantic Technologies in-ceilings have near-flush, paintable, magnetic mount grills, are solidly built, and sound very good in my system. They are relatively affordable at $325 each.

Worth considering, anyway.

Thank you Brian. I will definitely look into those.

[Mango]

Thank for the comment on the Sonance. I need to find a local dealer that carries them.

[Mango]

I always recommend upgrading to the RAAL ribbons, even for home theater. So many of our customers who are "mostly home theater" - end up listening to a lot more music than they ever expected to ;)

For in-ceiling / in-walls, I have been recommending the Sonance VP60 series (square or round). They perform very well with our products.

Hope this helps!

David, thank you for the response. I have a few questions for you:
1) What should I look for when trying to match surrounds/height speakers to the front LCR? Should the surrounds and heights have a similar sensitivity? Or that doesn't really matter?
2) As far as efficiency/sensitivity. Have been reading other forums where some say higher sensitivity/efficiency speakers at 97db+ would be a lot better for Home Theater use without external power amps....What are the trade-offs when designing a speaker with a higher sensitivity than say the Sierra Towers?
3) I'm planning on running these with only the amps from a receiver, whether a denon 6500 or MRX-1120 or Integra R1.... Would these be enough to power the Sierra Towers/Horizon plus the 8 surrounds/heights?

[SunByrne]

For in-ceiling / in-walls, I have been recommending the Sonance VP60 series (square or round). They perform very well with our products.

So I looked up Sonance, found they are also based in San Clemente.

They your poker buddies, Dave? ;)

[davef]

So I looked up Sonance, found they are also based in San Clemente.

They your poker buddies, Dave? ;)

Funny thing, they are just up the block from us and I only find about 6-7 years ago.

[davef]

David, thank you for the response. I have a few questions for you:

1) What should I look for when trying to match surrounds/height speakers to the front LCR? Should the surrounds and heights have a similar sensitivity? Or that doesn't really matter?

Since placement is so different, I generally recommend keeping the sensitivity withing 6dB of the fronts. You generally want all surrounds/heights to be fairly neutral speakers with wide dispersion.




2) As far as efficiency/sensitivity. Have been reading other forums where some say higher sensitivity/efficiency speakers at 97db+ would be a lot better for Home Theater use without external power amps....What are the trade-offs when designing a speaker with a higher sensitivity than say the Sierra Towers?

Our towers have excellent efficiency. Unless you are looking for insanely loud volume levels and in a huge room, there is absolutely no reason for 97dB efficient speakers. The trade-off to achieve this efficiency is huge, very short voice coils, very low excursion, basically little to no bass below 100Hz, use of very different tweeter technology that has shortcomings with regards to linearity and extension... In my professional opinion, you sacrifice sound quality for the ability to play at volume levels that are damaging to your ears. Now, that is not to say they won't sound great for home theater, but when listening to music - differences become obvious.



3) I'm planning on running these with only the amps from a receiver, whether a denon 6500 or MRX-1120 or Integra R1.... Would these be enough to power the Sierra Towers/Horizon plus the 8 surrounds/heights?

Absolutely, not even a concern. It would be one thing if you were running speakers in a large room rated at 83dB or lower sensitivity - but our towers are rated at 90dB, this is high. It means at only 1 watt at a distance of 1 meter, one speaker will reach 90dB, which in itself is considered loud.

[Mango]

Since placement is so different, I generally recommend keeping the sensitivity withing 6dB of the fronts. You generally want all surrounds/heights to be fairly neutral speakers with wide dispersion.




Our towers have excellent efficiency. Unless you are looking for insanely loud volume levels and in a huge room, there is absolutely no reason for 97dB efficient speakers. The trade-off to achieve this efficiency is huge, very short voice coils, very low excursion, basically little to no bass below 100Hz, use of very different tweeter technology that has shortcomings with regards to linearity and extension... In my professional opinion, you sacrifice sound quality for the ability to play at volume levels that are damaging to your ears. Now, that is not to say they won't sound great for home theater, but when listening to music - differences become obvious.



Absolutely, not even a concern. It would be one thing if you were running speakers in a large room rated at 83dB or lower sensitivity - but our towers are rated at 90dB, this is high. It means at only 1 watt at a distance of 1 meter, one speaker will reach 90dB, which in itself is considered loud.

Thank you Dave. I truly appreciate your responses here.

I got a little lucky with the surrounds, but I was wondering how would these match. My brother moved into a house where the previous owner left his 4 surrounds mounted on the wall. He is giving me those as they look brand new and work fine (he tested them). They are Revels S16 models.

I'm planning on just using these as the 4 surrounds. It looks like the specs show the same efficiency as the Sierra Towers at 90dB for this But I'm not sure how the 1" aluminum Tweeter would match/work with the Raals on the Towers and Horizon?

[davef]

Thank you Dave. I truly appreciate your responses here.

I got a little lucky with the surrounds, but I was wondering how would these match. My brother moved into a house where the previous owner left his 4 surrounds mounted on the wall. He is giving me those as they look brand new and work fine (he tested them). They are Revels S16 models.

I'm planning on just using these as the 4 surrounds. It looks like the specs show the same efficiency as the Sierra Towers at 90dB for this But I'm not sure how the 1" aluminum Tweeter would match/work with the Raals on the Towers and Horizon?

My apologies for missing this. The Revel S16 will be great as surrounds with our ribbon towers as fronts. No concerns at all...

[diesel79]

I just got my Sonance VP62R SST/SUR speakers installed yesterday. These ones have the dual tweeters, not sure if they are better than the standard ones, but this is what my buddy recommended. I also put them in Dynamat Dynaboxes.

They sound amazing with my S’2s and Horizon. Blend very nicely. I have been only running a front stage for many years and getting back to a 5.1 again is awesome. Crazy how much more ambience is added to movies and concert dvds.

[bcg27]

How well do the Dynaboxes work with low frequencies? Did you also look at the retrofit enclosure that Sonance sells? They claim 20 dB sound reduction although don't specify frequency range, then again Dyanamat doesn't make any claims so it's hard to differentiate.

[diesel79]

How well do the Dynaboxes work with low frequencies? Did you also look at the retrofit enclosure that Sonance sells? They claim 20 dB sound reduction although don't specify frequency range, then again Dyanamat doesn't make any claims so it's hard to differentiate.

I didn’t even consider the Sonance enclosures. Didn’t realize they had them until after I bought my stuff. They are quite a bit cheaper(looks like $45 msrp for a pair) and appear to be a little easier to install, although the Dynaboxes were pretty easy to work with too.

I guess I’m not sure how the Dynaboxes are with low frequency sound reduction. To be honest I never even went upstairs to check and see if any sound came through. I run everything crossed at 80hz so nothing real low going through them. I will have to check this tonight but just going by feel, not much should get through them if anything especially just using as a surround speaker.

The boxes are a fairly thick rubber material and the inside is fully wrapped with foam. The foam that wraps the inside perimeter of the box is pretty dense/heavy and is 2 layers separated by some sort of rubber strip/divider. The back flat portion is the typical eggshell type foam.