Another RAAL v NrT question

[jaxtitleman]

I'm in my early 60's and understand that with age comes a decline in hearing with respect to upper frequencies. So my question is whether or not the upgrade to RAAL would be an advantage over the NrT, i.e., assuming my upper limit is 17 khz what would I be missing in the presentation of the NrT vs the RAAL. I've read a lot about the harmonics of the RAAL, with the term "airy" and "lingers" used quite a bit. But are those things we can still hear as we get older? I don't expect either one to be "harsh" or overly "clinical" based on what I've read which is good because that would be my primary concern. I know there's been a lot of debate about the characteristics of both and I am not looking for a "which one is best" response. Just any thoughts on whether or not I should even be concerned. Appreciate any feedback provided. And apologies if already asked and answered.

[white_darren]

It sounds like you're questioning if the perceived benefit might be out of your audible range. I believe the RAALs are crossed over in the 1.8-3.0 kHz range depending on model which means the RAAL would still be providing a very substantial portion of the sound you hear.

[randyrlee2]

Hey Jax,

I'm mid-sixties and had both ear drums burst as a young jarhead, followed by seven years in road construction. My hearing is bad, especially the upper range (my Wife can't believe the things I can't hear).

Having said that, I have a set of the RAAL Towers, and the RAAL Horizon in a HT setup that I use for stereo music about 50% of the time. I have never heard the upper range the way my speakers play it. It is beyond superb. If you close your eyes, you can tell exactly where each of the instruments is coming from. Have never heard the NrT Towers, but there is no way I would even think about giving up my RAAL Towers. Actually, that isn't true. I might be able to be talked into the RAAL Horizon's as main speakers. I think they may actually be a little better speaker. But no way would I do without the RAAL's, they are truly that good, and you will hear it.

randy

[Jack1949]

I'm 69 and have limited hearing above 2k in my right ear. In 2016 I also did the RAAL/NrT debate with myself about getting older and wondering if my hearing would get worse with time or that my hearing wasn't good enough to justify/appreciate a RAAL purchase (the additional cost was also a consideration).

I'm a music lover, so I decided I might as well enjoy the best sounds while I can (and the wife gave the additional cost approval :)), so I purchased RAAL towers and horizon and love them. They sound great whether I'm playing them softly or loud (an excuse for having hearing problems). And I agree with Randy, RAAL horizons as main speakers would be very tempting.


I've read a lot about the harmonics of the RAAL, with the term "airy" and "lingers" used quite a bit. But are those things we can still hear as we get older?
Can't speak for 70+, but I'm still appreciating these qualities at 69.

Good luck with your decision!

Jack

[jaxtitleman]

Hey Jax,

I'm mid-sixties and had both ear drums burst as a young jarhead, followed by seven years in road construction. My hearing is bad, especially the upper range (my Wife can't believe the things I can't hear).

Having said that, I have a set of the RAAL Towers, and the RAAL Horizon in a HT setup that I use for stereo music about 50% of the time. I have never heard the upper range the way my speakers play it. It is beyond superb. If you close your eyes, you can tell exactly where each of the instruments is coming from. Have never heard the NrT Towers, but there is no way I would even think about giving up my RAAL Towers. Actually, that isn't true. I might be able to be talked into the RAAL Horizon's as main speakers. I think they may actually be a little better speaker. But no way would I do without the RAAL's, they are truly that good, and you will hear it.

randy

Randy, thank you so much for responding. Very helpful and what I was trying to confirm. My assumption was that while the frequency range of our hearing might be reduced the various qualities and harmonics within the range would still be audible, thus making the RAAL or any other quality transducer a worthwhile investment. I think your experience confirms that. While I am at it, would you mind commenting on the bass quality. I will be two channel, no heavy metal, rap, pipe organs, etc. Mostly vocals and instrumental. A lot of Americana and acoustical stuff. So I am thinking bass would be more than adequate.

[jaxtitleman]

I'm 69 and have limited hearing above 2k in my right ear. In 2016 I also did the RAAL/NrT debate with myself about getting older and wondering if my hearing would get worse with time or that my hearing wasn't good enough to justify/appreciate a RAAL purchase (the additional cost was also a consideration).

I'm a music lover, so I decided I might as well enjoy the best sounds while I can (and the wife gave the additional cost approval :)), so I purchased RAAL towers and horizon and love them. They sound great whether I'm playing them softly or loud (an excuse for having hearing problems). And I agree with Randy, RAAL horizons as main speakers would be very tempting.


Can't speak for 70+, but I'm still appreciating these qualities at 69.

Good luck with your decision!

Jack

Well, your experience seems to mirror Randy's. I am not suffering (yet) any significant loss of hearing other than normal age-related as I try to take good care of it (ear protection when mowing etc). Although the NrT would likely handily best my current speakers I am only going to do this once going into retirement so I think RAAL is the way to go. Thank you Jack.

[randyrlee2]

Hey Jax,

Glad to help. Actually, everyone on this forum has most likely had questions like these before buying.

I started as music only, then recently graduated to an Ascend home theater, with RAAL Towers, center, sides and Rythmik subwoofer (soon to be two). In pure stereo music-only mode, you will not be disappointed with the Towers bass. They outperform any speaker I've seen for the size of the speaker. In fact, the bass is much like the RAAL tweeters in that it is precise, on note, and doesn't linger or boom. I have two small Velodyne subs I was using with my prior speakers (Dahlquist DQ-10's) and I didn't use them.

My taste in music is incredibly diverse, but not especially bass-heavy. Having said that, in the music I like that does extend the bass a bit, the Towers are superb. Honestly, in my opinion, you can't touch the sound these speakers manage in anything near the price point. I haven't actually heard any speakers I like better at any price point.

That's my 2 cents. Hope it helps. If you get a pair, you won't be disappointed. Just make sure to give yourself a couple hours after you get them to let yours ears become attuned to what they are hearing.

randy

[davef]

I'm in my early 60's and understand that with age comes a decline in hearing with respect to upper frequencies. So my question is whether or not the upgrade to RAAL would be an advantage over the NrT, i.e., assuming my upper limit is 17 khz what would I be missing in the presentation of the NrT vs the RAAL. I've read a lot about the harmonics of the RAAL, with the term "airy" and "lingers" used quite a bit. But are those things we can still hear as we get older? I don't expect either one to be "harsh" or overly "clinical" based on what I've read which is good because that would be my primary concern. I know there's been a lot of debate about the characteristics of both and I am not looking for a "which one is best" response. Just any thoughts on whether or not I should even be concerned. Appreciate any feedback provided. And apologies if already asked and answered.

The significant advantage of the RAAL ribbon we use is in its transient response. The moving mass (the part of the tweeter that resonates to produce soundwaves) is ~ 50 times less weight than the moving mass of a dome tweeter (even the best dome tweeters). This translates to as near perfect transient reproduction as a transducer is possible of -- which means less stored energy. In other words, there is much less overall energy produced (the stuff that isn't supposed to be there), which translates to more detail yet a smoother overall sound that is actually easier on your ears. I have learned from selling many thousands of RAAL ribbons - more than any other company at this point, that the older one's hearing, the more they actually appreciate these ribbons.

I know at first glance this doesn't make sense since one's hearing gets worse with age - but with these ribbons, there is less "noise" so it turns out they are easier on our ears and the sounds are more distinct.
(I say ours because I am getting old too :( )

[jaxtitleman]

Thank you both Dave and Randy for your responses. Assuming Dave has expresso cabinets in stock I am going to take the plunge.

[Brady]

as someone who has endured both titanium and 'soft' dome tweeters for the past 20 years, I can assure you the RAAL is WAY WAY WAY easier on the ears, resulting in a much more pleasant and engaging experience :)
Example: Diana Krall's "S'Wonderful". On my dome tweeter speakers, every time she sang "S" (which is, obviously a LOT in this song), it really jumped out at you, in an annoying, distracting way. With the RAAL the "S" is very much there and extremely well defined, but it doesn't bring attention to itself. Hope that helps.
Enjoy!

PS- I have no experience with the NrT dome tweeter, no doubt a superior tweeter than I have experienced in the past, so I'm assuming the difference would less prominent.

[mikesiskav]

as someone who has endured both titanium and 'soft' dome tweeters for the past 20 years, I can assure you the RAAL is WAY WAY WAY easier on the ears, resulting in a much more pleasant and engaging experience :)
Example: Diana Krall's "S'Wonderful". On my dome tweeter speakers, every time she sang "S" (which is, obviously a LOT in this song), it really jumped out at you, in an annoying, distracting way. With the RAAL the "S" is very much there and extremely well defined, but it doesn't bring attention to itself. Hope that helps.
Enjoy!

PS- I have no experience with the NrT dome tweeter, no doubt a superior tweeter than I have experienced in the past, so I'm assuming the difference would less prominent.

+1 on this. The lack of sibilants with the RAAL is a standout feature for me. That's why I call them detailed but smooth.

[jaxtitleman]

Appreciate everyone's input. Placed order for RAAL Towers this past Friday so I am awaiting shipping notice which might be a couple weeks. Will post initial thoughts once I have them hooked up.

[4 Luv O' Musik]

I am brand new here... and today is my 70th birthday....and just placed my raal tower order with Dina this afternoon.
What I would like to share is that my current system is very responsive with gobs of very finely detailed
music and lots of presence.
I chose to purchase the raal towers because (though I have not heard them) as I look at the raal tweeter graphics David F provides in his literature...the spectral time stop of the raals is amazingly fast even compared with the Focal Sopra No.3, step response on be tweeter axis at best seems way slower 3.3msec compared to .75 msec of the raal tweeter. Google the Sopra 3 meaurements and compare...

What this means to me is better definition and resolution of the soundstage.. for me even at 70 what I can still enjoy musically will be far better with the Sierra raal tower. The raal tweeter from what i can gather from reading is that the raal tweeter has a uniform smoothness better control metal domes cannot offer. Translating into a cleare, cleaner flowing nasties free musical experience.

I think Brady best described it saying easier on the ears..

My current speakers are Infinity Beta 50s that do many things well...except for the occasional nasty overemphasis of certain instruments.

Hope this helps other seniors realize their audio dreams. If you seniors outhere can still enjoy music..
then why not give the Sierra raal towers a go....

[davef]

I am brand new here... and today is my 70th birthday....and just placed my raal tower order with Dina this afternoon.
What I would like to share is that my current system is very responsive with gobs of very finely detailed
music and lots of presence.
I chose to purchase the raal towers because (though I have not heard them) as I look at the raal tweeter graphics David F provides in his literature...the spectral time stop of the raals is amazingly fast even compared with the Focal Sopra No.3, step response on be tweeter axis at best seems way slower 3.3msec compared to .75 msec of the raal tweeter. Google the Sopra 3 meaurements and compare...

What this means to me is better definition and resolution of the soundstage.. for me even at 70 what I can still enjoy musically will be far better with the Sierra raal tower. The raal tweeter from what i can gather from reading is that the raal tweeter has a uniform smoothness better control metal domes cannot offer. Translating into a cleare, cleaner flowing nasties free musical experience.

I think Brady best described it saying easier on the ears..

My current speakers are Infinity Beta 50s that do many things well...except for the occasional nasty overemphasis of certain instruments.

Hope this helps other seniors realize their audio dreams. If you seniors outhere can still enjoy music..
then why not give the Sierra raal towers a go....

Thank you for getting your order in and I very much look forward to your feedback!

[jaxtitleman]

Thanks for your input. Got word from Dave yesterday that my RAAL Towers should be shipped out today. Once I get a tracking number I will schedule a couple of days off. Will be interesting to see how they compare with current speakers. Will post impressions once I've spent some quality time with them.

[4 Luv O' Musik]

Congratulations on your order..and soon you will have your towers...please, please do share your findings.
As soon as I get mine set up positioned etc...burn in time will be happy to share comparo feed back.

Will try to give specifics such as pieces of music and what all appears to be going on in the soundstage
compared to my Beta 50s. For finish I chose dark cherry...b/c of lowwr back problems ordered soundocity
castered outriggers making it easier to move them around while locating the best position for imaging and soundstaging.

Please keep us posted.