New Sierra-2 impressions...

[Harley Weewax]

I just thought I would start a new thread for those who are now starting to receive their Sierra-2s. The Development thread has gotten a bit long.

I thought this might be a good place for first impressions and comments that do not amount to a full fledged Review.

C'mon, tell us that are still waiting (me) or are still on the fence what we are missing!

[petmotel]

I still don't have shipping confirmation, BUT, when I do get my new Sierra-2s, I plan to directly compare them to my Sierra-1s (NRTs), side by side (AB-AB configuration) with quick switching using the main, and zone one outputs from my Anthem pre/pro using a five channel amp. I will use a disc with pink noise and an SPL meter to match output levels as accurately as I can. With two sets of Towers, I also plan on comparing the twos with those.

What I'm most curious about is how the mid, and low dynamics compare between the three, and also how well the twos image compared to the Towers. I gotta tell you, the Towers are a VERY tough act to follow!

Jay

[Galaga]

I still don't have shipping confirmation, BUT, when I do get my new Sierra-2s, I plan to directly compare them to my Sierra-1s (NRTs), side by side (AB-AB configuration) with quick switching using the main, and zone one outputs from my Anthem pre/pro using a five channel amp. I will use a disc with pink noise and an SPL meter to match output levels as accurately as I can. With two sets of Towers, I also plan on comparing the twos with those.

What I'm most curious about is how the mid, and low dynamics compare between the three, and also how well the twos image compared to the Towers. I gotta tell you, the Towers are a VERY tough act to follow!

Jay


Really looking forward to your AB results and other peoples impressions. I'm on the fence between the Sierra-1's and Sierra-2's so info like this is much appreciated!

[Harley Weewax]

Just got mine in yesterday and been running them mostly with just television and kids shows for the lil critter.

Packaging was tough and well thought out. The reusable 'cloth' bags for each speaker is a nice touch. These are definitely boxes worth hanging on to for moving/shipping.

My wife was even impressed with the included measurement sheet for each speaker. Very cool that each unit was measured individually. The cotton gloves are nice also. I kinda laughed when I first saw them, but as I unbagged the first speaker my first thought was "I don't want to get fingerprints on these."

So far, with no critical listening at all, I am impressed; they are breaking in nicely. The audio is very detailed, especially at lower volume levels. I have a three year old , so I haven't had a chance to open things up and give them a listen, yet. Maybe Grandma can look after the lil' 'un tonight.

The fit and finish of the speakers is top notch. I chose the satin cherry and they look very nice. The satin finish is also very even and fine. I don't know how else to put it. The sheen on the speakers looks very nice. Also, they just disappear with the lights off.

So far, I couldn't be happier.

[Harley Weewax]

Wow, these speakers really open up after a few days of casual listening. I still have not had a chance to give them a workout, but tonight the wife and I watched about half of a movie (yay for having a two year old!) and we were both impressed at how intelligible the dialogue was from the center channel at quite low volume levels.

There is an effortless quality to the sound (shoot, I sound like an audio rag writer) that makes them very non-fatiguing. You know how it can get quite unpleasant trying to make out what every one is saying when you have the volume turned way down? Not a trace of that sort of fatigue with the Sierra-2's. Not exactly the most rockin of tests, but waddaya gonna do? We need to butter up grandma so that we can get some time alone with these babies.

More to come...

[eliwankenobi]

Wow, these speakers really open up after a few days of casual listening. I still have not had a chance to give them a workout, but tonight the wife and I watched about half of a movie (yay for having a two year old!) and we were both impressed at how intelligible the dialogue was from the center channel at quite low volume levels.

There is an effortless quality to the sound (shoot, I sound like an audio rag writer) that makes them very non-fatiguing. You know how it can get quite unpleasant trying to make out what every one is saying when you have the volume turned way down? Not a trace of that sort of fatigue with the Sierra-2's. Not exactly the most rockin of tests, but waddaya gonna do? We need to butter up grandma so that we can get some time alone with these babies.

More to come...

Thanks for confirming that!

I also have a two year old and my media room is rather close to my child's room. And at night when she is sleeping, well... You know it is, so the fact that they maintaing vocal clarity and intelligibility at low volume levels will be a big plus for me. I hope to order the upgrade soon, early in the month.

[Harley Weewax]

They really are breaking in nicely. I think if any audio component has a true "break-in" period, it is transducers. The mechanical components have to limber-up, if you will, and the capacitors in the crossover, I believe, are subject to a certain amount of break-in. And these are doing nicely. I recently put my old gear in storage and moved to a Home Theater centric setup.

Until now I was a dedicated stereo/tube geek. I have my stereo setup 90% where I want it and the last 10% I like to get through DIY and tinkering. So I have fairly high standards of what sounds good in my room. My stereo setup (DIY two-way transmission line towers, VAC PA45 amp, heavily modified Bottlehead Foreplay preamp, tweaked Hagtech Bugle phono pre, Rega turntable, rebuilt and modified Audio Alchemy DAC from back-in-the-day, you get the idea...) was at the point where I could hear the varying quality of my house's AC power at different times of the day. But with less and less time to just sit and chill to music, I traded priorities.

So far I have no regrets. My former system (She'll be back! I'll get my mancave one of these days, even if it's in a closet.) had soul. My new setup sounds damn good. I am powering everything with a Marantz 7008 and using an Oppo103d as my blu ray player. I am also have a Rythmik FV15HP on backorder, so the system is still a bit incomplete. But I am really happy with the sound and how it is developing. I have yet to find my new system's soul, but she wouldn't be interesting if she gave it all up right away, right?


I remember when I used to be in the A/V & High-End business (In the nineties and early aughts. Still got my laserdisc player.) guys would point their stereo speakers at each other, wire one of them out of phase, turn up the volume , and then run pink noise through them for 24 hours or so. Me, I just break 'em in like I'm going to use them. Just be careful and don't blow them up.

Man, I'm rambling this morning...I like the speakers!

Yay me!

[markie]

Very nice Harley!

So am I to understand that currently you are running a 3.0 setup, all Sierra 2's?

I am very glad to hear of the great clarity at low volumes.

You must be somewhat tempted to sneak your high end stereo electronics out of storage, bring them into the family TV room and try them on the Sierra 2's for a day when everyone is out of the house ... ;) (But that's a lot of work for just a bit of listening )

Mark

[Harley Weewax]

Yeah, just 3.0 for right now. I just have not had the time to climb up on the ladder and get my surrounds mounted yet. I ordered some CBM-170s for surrounds and I want to make sure and mount them properly to the studs. My little girl is just too interested in anything tool related for me to get the job done. She would be all up in my bidness.

Also, knowing her, she would see tools, screws, speakers, etc. and want to help Daddy and then decide that she needed to fix my Sierras while I am on the ladder. It's probably what I would have done as a kid. My mom says I am paying for my raising. But that is another story.

You know, if I had the time, I really would have loved to switch out each new component and see how it affected the overall sound. I definitely want to try the Sierra 2s with the rest of my old system, but that will have to wait for now.

[smurraybhm]

After my setback Monday when one of my screw heads partially cracked during removal I thought a lot about what to do next including going with different speakers. If you look at what's out there, components/cabinets being used by Dave and others it is easily apparent that the Ascend Sierra 2s are equal (better) to speakers costing a lot more. I would put them up against Salk's bookshelf speakers which cost a heck of a lot more. So I decided to see if I would have better luck doing my other 2 speaker upgrades tonight. About an hour later I had two Sierra 2s and relegated my remaining Sierra 1 to center channel duty -just a flip of the tweeter. Plan now is to return one upgrade kit and order a Horizon for my center with the RAAL upgrade. Happy Birthday to me - at the end of the month. That's not implying a Sierra doesn't work well as a center - my 3 1s across the front have been great for the past 3 years. I just wish I had started with 3 instead of waiting a few years to add another for a center.

First impressions post upgrade are hard to convey - immediate WOW effect. I put in Bob Dylan's Basement Tapes SACD into my Oppo 103 and set the receiver (Denon 4311) to source direct. Immediately I could tell the speakers are more open, imaging improved and much improved mid and highs. That custom RAAL tweeter just sings and the new woofer performs much better in the mid range. Bass doesn't seem to reach quite as deep - but not boomy as the 1 could get at times depending on the material.

Anyone considering the upgrade or Sierra 2s I can't recommend them enough - what an accomplishment for Dave and his team. Sierra 1 is a great speaker but the 2 is in a class all by itself. If you can afford the upgrade don't hesitate. I have no doubt that this speaker will receive awards throughout the next year. I love how they work for two channel sources and am confident they will also be outstanding as part of a 5.1 or 7.1 setup - for me 7.1. If you have doubts do your homework and look at what other speaker companies are using SEAS woofers, RAAL ribbon tweeters with bamboo cabinets. When you do you will see these are not only a steal at around $750 each, these are a audiophile's bookshelf speaker. They should be on everyone's short list who is looking to purchase a top level bookshelf speaker.

I also agree with time they will improve even more. More later - I need to order a Horizon. With my wife headed to the BCS I will be doing some listening to music and movie watching to do the next few days.

Harvey, these speakers make you ramble :)

[FirstReflect]

Thanks so much for posting your impressions thus far, Harley and smurraybhm.

These are exactly the sorts of descriptions I was hoping to hear :)

In my own setup, I purchased 11 custom speakers from Ascend. At the time, the Sierra-2 were in development, but they didn't exist yet. I was 100% certain of my choice of Front 3 speakers, which were a pair of custom "low-profile", vertically oriented Sierra Horizon RAAL Mains, and a one-off "Skinny" Sierra Horizon RAAL Center. Those speakers were part of my "master plan" from my future house and dedicated home theatre, and Dave's willingness to design and manufacture that one-off "Skinny" Center really was the lynchpin!

But, my other big demand was a pair of bookshelf speakers that would PERFECTLY match the sonics of those Front 3 Sierra Horizon RAAL speakers. I did not want ANY difference in the treble and mid-range between the Front 3 and my Front Wide speakers.

In speaking with Dave, he told me straight up that the best possible solution was to use the Sierra-1 cabinet, but to use the exact same RAAL 70-20XR ribbon tweeter and dedicated, phase-plug mid-range driver as those Sierra Horizon RAAL speakers. The ONLY down side is that the dedicated mid-range driver cannot play all that low. I have settled on a 120Hz crossover frequency to my subwoofers.

The results have been exemplary. The sonic match across my Front Wides and Front Mains & Center really is perfectly seamless, and simply glorious to hear in person. The best compliment I can think to pay is in saying that I am STILL not "used" to the sound quality I am enjoying on a daily basis. It still just kind of shocks me every single time I sit down and listen to anything on my system -- and that is a rare thing indeed! It's like falling in love and never getting out of the honeymoon phase -- haha.

All of this is a long-winded preamble to talk about my Sierra-1 NrT speakers, though, and why I have decided that I will be upgrading all of them to Sierra-2 in the not too distant future. As I said, at the time of my order, the Sierra-2 did not yet exist. I opted to purchase 3 pairs of Sierra-1 NrT to act as my Surround, Surround Back, and Front Height speakers.

I have always said, and I still maintain, that if you are going to skimp ANYWHERE in your sound system, then skimp on your Surround speakers. Their job is primarily ambience, and the occasional sound effect. I still very much hold that opinion. And I did NOT skimp -- I bought Sierra-1 NrT, which are excellent speakers!

But...as smurraybhm just pointed out so well, there's still a "wow factor" and an improvement to be had.

Naturally, I've done direct comparisons between my Sierra-1 NrT speakers and my custom 70-20XR + dedicated mid-range bookshelf Front Wides. I can listen to the Sierra-1 NrT and think to myself, "these are just excellent sounding speakers that allow me to hear everything in the recording". Then I switch over to the custom Front Wides, and it's like going from looking out a very clean window to removing the glass entirely. There's just an extra level of realism. It goes from "excellent speakers" to "uncannily real".

That comparison and lasting impression is what has led me to the conclusion that I will upgrade all of my Sierra-1 NrT speakers to Sierra-2. I had even considered switching all 6 of my Sierra-1 NrT over to the exact same 70-20XR tweeters and dedicated mid-range drivers, just like my Front Wides. But, that notion is less than ideal: the cost would be very substantial, as I would have to ship all of my Sierra-1 NrT speakers from Canada back to Ascend in order to cut the cabinets for the 70-20XR tweeters to fit, and the parts themselves are not inexpensive. But, more than that, the 120Hz crossover works very well for the Front Wide positions, as they are essentially co-located with my dual subwoofers, but it would be less than ideal for the Surround, Back and Front Height channels. 120Hz is high enough that the transition from the speakers to the subwoofers might become noticeable and localizable.

So, the Sierra-2 are here to save me! haha.

I already feel ridiculous for wanting to improve upon the Sierra-1 NrT. It is NOT a case of feeling as though I "skimped", or hearing so large a difference in the sound quality that I feel the upgrade is necessary. Rather, I feel as though I am SO CLOSE to an absolutely flawless soundstage ALL around me, that I just cannot shake the desire to see it through!

When sounds transition from my Front 3 speakers, through my Front Wides, and into my Surround and Back channels, the timbre of the sound remains excellently matched, but there's the slightest disconnect. It's made more noticeable (to me, probably not anyone else -- haha) by the fact that the transition from the Front 3 to the Front Wides is just PERFECT. Thus, I can't help but feel it is only natural for me to want to continue that absolutely flawless transition through every single speaker in my system!

Will the Sierra-2 accomplish that? My hopes are very high :) To put it plainly, the stunningly low cost -- all things considered -- of the upgrade kits, and the relative ease with which the Sierra-1 NrT parts can be swapped out - by me, in my own home - for Sierra-2 parts, it has made this an easy decision. But, written impressions, such as the ones above, only bolster my hopes! If people are describing the very same sorts of differences in going from the Sierra-1 to the Sierra-2 as what I just described in going from my own Sierra-1 NrT to my custom Wides, I find that highly encouraging! That is exactly what I was hoping for, and it is all coming true :D

I really do feel almost disrespectful for intending to use Sierra-2 speakers as lowly Surrounds, Backs, and Heights, rather than letting them shine as Front Main speakers! But, this is about chasing perfection. The Sierra-1 NrT already do their jobs phenomenally well in my setup. They produce that ambience and the occasional sound effects of those channels with wonderful quality and detail. But...what if...? What if, during those rare instances when a sound fully circles the room, or transitions from front to back, or vice versa, what if those transitions were just completely undetectable? What if the glass were simply never there at all? What if I didn't have 11 speakers, but instead, I just had SOUND? That is what is driving me now. That is what I am chasing. And I really do believe the Sierra-2 can get me there.

I shall let you know, if and when it happens...

:D

[eliwankenobi]

Thanks so much for posting your impressions thus far, Harley and smurraybhm.

These are exactly the sorts of descriptions I was hoping to hear :)

In my own setup, I purchased 11 custom speakers from Ascend. At the time, the Sierra-2 were in development, but they didn't exist yet. I was 100% certain of my choice of Front 3 speakers, which were a pair of custom "low-profile", vertically oriented Sierra Horizon RAAL Mains, and a one-off "Skinny" Sierra Horizon RAAL Center. Those speakers were part of my "master plan" from my future house and dedicated home theatre, and Dave's willingness to design and manufacture that one-off "Skinny" Center really was the lynchpin!

But, my other big demand was a pair of bookshelf speakers that would PERFECTLY match the sonics of those Front 3 Sierra Horizon RAAL speakers. I did not want ANY difference in the treble and mid-range between the Front 3 and my Front Wide speakers.

In speaking with Dave, he told me straight up that the best possible solution was to use the Sierra-1 cabinet, but to use the exact same RAAL 70-20XR ribbon tweeter and dedicated, phase-plug mid-range driver as those Sierra Horizon RAAL speakers. The ONLY down side is that the dedicated mid-range driver cannot play all that low. I have settled on a 120Hz crossover frequency to my subwoofers.

The results have been exemplary. The sonic match across my Front Wides and Front Mains & Center really is perfectly seamless, and simply glorious to hear in person. The best compliment I can think to pay is in saying that I am STILL not "used" to the sound quality I am enjoying on a daily basis. It still just kind of shocks me every single time I sit down and listen to anything on my system -- and that is a rare thing indeed! It's like falling in love and never getting out of the honeymoon phase -- haha.

All of this is a long-winded preamble to talk about my Sierra-1 NrT speakers, though, and why I have decided that I will be upgrading all of them to Sierra-2 in the not too distant future. As I said, at the time of my order, the Sierra-2 did not yet exist. I opted to purchase 3 pairs of Sierra-1 NrT to act as my Surround, Surround Back, and Front Height speakers.

I have always said, and I still maintain, that if you are going to skimp ANYWHERE in your sound system, then skimp on your Surround speakers. Their job is primarily ambience, and the occasional sound effect. I still very much hold that opinion. And I did NOT skimp -- I bought Sierra-1 NrT, which are excellent speakers!

But...as smurraybhm just pointed out so well, there's still a "wow factor" and an improvement to be had.

Naturally, I've done direct comparisons between my Sierra-1 NrT speakers and my custom 70-20XR + dedicated mid-range bookshelf Front Wides. I can listen to the Sierra-1 NrT and think to myself, "these are just excellent sounding speakers that allow me to hear everything in the recording". Then I switch over to the custom Front Wides, and it's like going from looking out a very clean window to removing the glass entirely. There's just an extra level of realism. It goes from "excellent speakers" to "uncannily real".

That comparison and lasting impression is what has led me to the conclusion that I will upgrade all of my Sierra-1 NrT speakers to Sierra-2. I had even considered switching all 6 of my Sierra-1 NrT over to the exact same 70-20XR tweeters and dedicated mid-range drivers, just like my Front Wides. But, that notion is less than ideal: the cost would be very substantial, as I would have to ship all of my Sierra-1 NrT speakers from Canada back to Ascend in order to cut the cabinets for the 70-20XR tweeters to fit, and the parts themselves are not inexpensive. But, more than that, the 120Hz crossover works very well for the Front Wide positions, as they are essentially co-located with my dual subwoofers, but it would be less than ideal for the Surround, Back and Front Height channels. 120Hz is high enough that the transition from the speakers to the subwoofers might become noticeable and localizable.

So, the Sierra-2 are here to save me! haha.

I already feel ridiculous for wanting to improve upon the Sierra-1 NrT. It is NOT a case of feeling as though I "skimped", or hearing so large a difference in the sound quality that I feel the upgrade is necessary. Rather, I feel as though I am SO CLOSE to an absolutely flawless soundstage ALL around me, that I just cannot shake the desire to see it through!

When sounds transition from my Front 3 speakers, through my Front Wides, and into my Surround and Back channels, the timbre of the sound remains excellently matched, but there's the slightest disconnect. It's made more noticeable (to me, probably not anyone else -- haha) by the fact that the transition from the Front 3 to the Front Wides is just PERFECT. Thus, I can't help but feel it is only natural for me to want to continue that absolutely flawless transition through every single speaker in my system!

Will the Sierra-2 accomplish that? My hopes are very high :) To put it plainly, the stunningly low cost -- all things considered -- of the upgrade kits, and the relative ease with which the Sierra-1 NrT parts can be swapped out - by me, in my own home - for Sierra-2 parts, it has made this an easy decision. But, written impressions, such as the ones above, only bolster my hopes! If people are describing the very same sorts of differences in going from the Sierra-1 to the Sierra-2 as what I just described in going from my own Sierra-1 NrT to my custom Wides, I find that highly encouraging! That is exactly what I was hoping for, and it is all coming true :D

I really do feel almost disrespectful for intending to use Sierra-2 speakers as lowly Surrounds, Backs, and Heights, rather than letting them shine as Front Main speakers! But, this is about chasing perfection. The Sierra-1 NrT already do their jobs phenomenally well in my setup. They produce that ambience and the occasional sound effects of those channels with wonderful quality and detail. But...what if...? What if, during those rare instances when a sound fully circles the room, or transitions from front to back, or vice versa, what if those transitions were just completely undetectable? What if the glass were simply never there at all? What if I didn't have 11 speakers, but instead, I just had SOUND? That is what is driving me now. That is what I am chasing. And I really do believe the Sierra-2 can get me there.

I shall let you know, if and when it happens...

:D

Hello Rob!

Great post! Very eloquently written. It reminds me of Smaug talking on the 2nd Hobbit movie Ha! I kinda of imaging him speaking, but I know its you from AV Rant! Love that podcast!

I also have recently got a pair of Sierra-1 NrTs (used but in 10/10 condition), and they sound great! But very much like you said, I've heard the RAAL towers and Horizon center and those tweeters are amazing! There is like an extra layer of clarity that seems like removing the crystal all together. I heard this with the towers and another pair of bookshelves (Legacy Studio HDs) that have ribbon tweeters as well. In the end thats where I will be heading too!
Also, the ability to do the upgrade at home saves me money as shipping of my speakers to Ascend for the upgrade would include higher than usual shipping cost (shipping from Puerto Rico). Although it would reset the warranty and be remeasured, etc, and that is a big plus! but I trust I can do it at home and still get the same results as if done at the factory and we know components are of high quality and are tested before shipment so they should be good when they get home.

[petmotel]

I've been doing some critical listening today, comparing the new Sierra-2s to my RAAL Towers. The new Twos are just absolutely stunning, second best speaker I've heard recently. I heard some Apogee speakers many, many moons ago that were VERY good (and also very expensive) but that was a lifetime ago, so not fair to compare an ancient memory with current tech.

I will note here that the S-2s do have one advantage over the Towers, that being they are more forgiving with regard to vertical dispersion. Loss of the high frequencies is far less noticeable when standing compared with the Towers (tweeters are at almost identical heights). Like the Towers, the imaging of the S-2s is deep, and wide (proper placement dependent of course).

I was also quite pleasantly surprised at the quality and quantity of the bass the S-2 are capable of, well able to play competently without a sub IMHO. Tight, tight, tight.

I'm still not set up to quick switch between the Twos and the Towers, but I can definitely discern differences between the two. I'll be posting more shortly!

Jay

[was-b&w]

I will start with I had the B&W CM-5's with the B&W Center. I sold them because the speakers have a so called laid back sound in the upper midrange and upper highs. I feel that it was not laid back, but missing sounds in those areas. I just received my Sierra-2's in Black Piano finish. The speakers are just as good looking as the B&W's. The sound from the upper highs are so smooth! I was wondering if the RAAL would be a little harsh, not the case. The sound field is very detailed and crisp! Ascend has done an excellent job with the speakers. The price is the same as the CM-5's but I feel either the B&W's were overpriced or the Sierra is under priced! You will not get listening fatigue with the Sierra speakers. I found that with the B&W speakers. Thanks for making such a superior product in the price range customers can enjoy!
Greg

[eliwankenobi]

I will start with I had the B&W CM-5's with the B&W Center. I sold them because the speakers have a so called laid back sound in the upper midrange and upper highs. I feel that it was not laid back, but missing sounds in those areas. I just received my Sierra-2's in Black Piano finish. The speakers are just as good looking as the B&W's. The sound from the upper highs are so smooth! I was wondering if the RAAL would be a little harsh, not the case. The sound field is very detailed and crisp! Ascend has done an excellent job with the speakers. The price is the same as the CM-5's but I feel either the B&W's were overpriced or the Sierra is under priced! You will not get listening fatigue with the Sierra speakers. I found that with the B&W speakers. Thanks for making such a superior product in the price range customers can enjoy!
Greg

You know, your username has got to be one of the better testimonials I've seen. It says it all!! Enjoied your post a lot!

Cant wait to receive my upgrades....

[petmotel]

I have my quick switching system in full working order, and have been listening to, and comparing my RAAL Towers to my new set of Sierra-2s. I just now came in from the shop, feet and hands can't take the cold any longer. Shop is heated, but propane is expensive, 45 degrees gets a bit chilly after a while!

The Twos just continue to impress the living daylights (PG rated description) out of me! I'm going to do some more listening at several different volume levels, before I'm through, but I have to say the two speakers are far more alike than I'm comfortable admitting to.

I would say that for someone on the fence, thinking they are giving up a considerable chunk of performance, and are compromising by opting for the Twos, I'm here to tell you if I were doing this testing blind, and didn't know which was playing, I'm not sure I could tell. Yep they really are that good!

I don't even know where to begin, I knew the RAAL tweeter would be awesome, but how can a single mid/woofer handling the frequencies from about 3 kHz to under 40 Hz hang with the awesome Tower? Dave is truly an absolute master at his craft, and his partners have conspired with him to build a piece of sonic magic.

I was excited about these speakers before we really knew anything about them, I was even more intrigued as the details were made public. Now that I have actually been throwing all of my very most demanding music at them, all I can say is they somehow managed to exceed my expectations. Like I said before, there's a new sheriff in town :D!

Man, I'd love to take a pair of these into a big box store, and blow some minds!

Jay

[Mag_Neato]

Wow! Comparing them to the RAAL towers so closely is crazy, but just confirms what my ears have experienced.... Dave has created a true giant slayer.

[ematthews]

Has anyone had a chance to compare the 2's to the Kef LS50? I had a chance to listen to the Kef's today at lunch for a few minutes and was really blown away by them.

[curtis]

Has anyone had a chance to compare the 2's to the Kef LS50? I had a chance to listen to the Kef's today at lunch for a few minutes and was really blown away by them.
Compare them...I'd bet you will be pleasantly surprised. If not, send the 2's back.

[ematthews]

I couldn't do that. I just got off the phone with Dina and placed my order on the 2's.;)

[ematthews]

I couldn't do that. I just got off the phone with Dina and placed my order on the 2's.;)

Plus I hate gloss black and rose gold....

[billy p]

I couldn't do that. I just got off the phone with Dina and placed my order on the 2's.;)

I would say NO since the S2 reviews have just started to trickle in...but I've read some accounts from former Sierra 1 owners @ AVS and they preferred LS50's but you must take into account they nearly cost twice as much. The new Sierra 2 should compare more favorably by all accounts...IMHO. They're priced within the same price bracket and a much more refined speaker over the S1.

I know some on this forum have compared the S1 with the Kef Reference 201 and they cost 5x's as much.

My 2 cents...


Has anyone had a chance to compare the 2's to the Kef LS50? I had a chance to listen to the Kef's today at lunch for a few minutes and was really blown away by them.

[ematthews]

I am excited about getting them next month. I am redoing my music room and will need stands and a new sub. Right now I will just run the Sierra 2's with my Martin Logan Grotto sub until I can get an new sub.

[billy p]

I am excited about getting them next month. I am redoing my music room and will need stands and a new sub. Right now I will just run the Sierra 2's with my Martin Logan Grotto sub until I can get an new sub.

I for one am looking forward towards your initial impression...maybe post them at Audioholics as well.

Fyi....HTS...is doing a 3G speaker evaluation...both Kef and B&W declined their speakers participation, what does that tell you about those 2 huge B&M brands.

[rkoaudio]

I for one am looking forward towards your initial impression...maybe post them at Audioholics as well.

Fyi....HTS...is doing a 3G speaker evaluation...both Kef and B&W declined their speakers participation, what does that tell you about those 2 huge B&M brands.

Absolutely nothing. You can read it in many ways. The plausible explanation for me would be that they have already established themselves on the market and having its fair share don't care anymore ...

[Mr McIntosh]

What size room are you guys putting the S-2 in?

[ematthews]

What size room are you guys putting the S-2 in?

Mine is a 11x14 room. Not big at all.

[TheHolyCannoli]

Mine is a 11x14 room. Not big at all.

That's the size room that I'll be using as well, albeit with an annoying brick chimney that sticks out 2ft from one of the long walls.....still not sure how I'm going to deal with that.

Fortunately (or unfortunately) the wife won't let me convert our 17x24 room into my media/man-cave, otherwise I'd surely find a way to justify purchasing the RAAL towers.

[Sam1000]

I have had Sierra-1s before (now upgraded to RAAL towers). Having said that, I was quite surprised at what kef LS50 could do with rythmik. I only listened to them for 5 minutes at someone's house. They are fine speakers as well. I wish I could do side by side comparison with S1. Everyone who have upgraded from S1 to S2, are very impressed and happy though, so, I'm not sure how LS50 would fare...
And I agree with ematthews..LS50 did look a little ugly :-)

[Hlam]

I have auditioned the LS 50's twice. These speakers have had great reviews.
You must hear a speaker for yourself and form your own opinion.
I did not like the 50's at all. I honestly thought that the **** system in my son in laws car sounded better. I was very shocked at what I heard. I was going to buy five of these and had my mind made up that these were my new speakers. Very lucky that a trip out of town gave me the chance to hear them for myself.
I hooked up my five new Sierra 2's about three hours ago and can honestly say that I am blown away.
IMHO, the sierra 2 is the better speaker by a LONG SHOT.

[Hlam]

I know! Without a pic it did not happen.
1038

[eliwankenobi]

I know! Without a pic it did not happen.
1038

Aw man! Those look beautiful!

Are those piano black? I kinda see a hint of dark brown, sort of like an espresso finish but don't know if it is a reflection on the speaker...

BTW, what is that huge center speaker that's holding your TV? Will you be replacing that setup with the S2s?

[Mag_Neato]

That huge center speaker looks like an old Rocket "Big foot". Should be a nice upgrade to the Sierra-2!

[eliwankenobi]

Hlam,

Could you post a closer picture of one of your Sierra-2s ?

[ematthews]

I almost went black but all of my speakers for the last 25 years have been black.. Tired of it and wanted the natural bamboo.. The wait is going to drive me nuts.

[curtis]

I almost went black but all of my speakers for the last 25 years have been black.. Tired of it and wanted the natural bamboo.. The wait is going to drive me nuts.
I have had natural bamboo Sierra-1's since they first came out...7 years ago. Love them!

But if and when I go to Sierra-2's...I might just get new ones in the black bamboo to change things up.

I think they would go well with my custom stands. Here's an old pic:
http://changpics.smugmug.com/Other/Ascend-Acoustics-pictures/i-ZCprHvD/0/L/P1020604-L.jpg

[ematthews]

I didn't think about the color stands that I will need. I wonder if anyone has a pick of the Bamboo Sierra's on top of the black Ascend stands.. That might not look right in my eye.

[curtis]

I didn't think about the color stands that I will need. I wonder if anyone has a pick of the Bamboo Sierra's on top of the black Ascend stands.. That might not look right in my eye.
Look in this gallery:
http://changpics.smugmug.com/Other/Ascend-Acoustics-pictures

[ematthews]

I am thinking that since I ordered the natural bamboo that a normal VTI brand black speaker stand would look good. The Ascend stand that makes it look like a tower with the natural is not my taste..
I think if I were to g with the Ascend stands that I would need to call Dina and change my color order..

[markie]

I have auditioned the LS 50's twice. These speakers have had great reviews.
You must hear a speaker for yourself and form your own opinion.
I did not like the 50's at all. I honestly thought that the **** system in my son in laws car sounded better. I was very shocked at what I heard. I was going to buy five of these and had my mind made up that these were my new speakers. Very lucky that a trip out of town gave me the chance to hear them for myself.
I hooked up my five new Sierra 2's about three hours ago and can honestly say that I am blown away.
IMHO, the sierra 2 is the better speaker by a LONG SHOT.

So THAT'S where all the Sierra 2's have gone! Gosh what a nice haul there Hlam. Lookin' good for sure.

I've heard the LS50s on a couple of occasions at audio shows. I thought the look was great - very original. Sound was quite good as well, although I was a little underwhelmed compared to the reviews I read. What can one expect in a hastily set up hotel room though.

Welcome aboard!

Mark

[Sam1000]

Nice pic Hlam. Are those PB or Espresso?

[Hlam]

eliwankenobi
The speakers are satin espresso.
Mag_Neato's guess was correct. Rocket big foot center.
Here is a closer picture:
1039

[eliwankenobi]

eliwankenobi
The speakers are satin espresso.
Mag_Neato's guess was correct. Rocket big foot center.
Here is a closer picture:
1039

Thank you Hlam, they look very nice! Enjoy them!!

[JustABrah]

I know! Without a pic it did not happen.
1038

How u liking the S2 as rears? Thinking about changing out my HTM-200 for some S2 to match my LCR.

[ADWhite]

Okay, so I’ve had my Sierra 2’s for about three weeks now. Just to mention, I am strictly a 2 channel music person, so my opinions may be severely limited to some in that regard as I am not much into home theater:)I listen to classical, rock, R&B, hip hop, and Jazz. However, Jazz is by far the lion share of my music collection (in a good mix of both vinyl and digital formats). But just as Bsound eluded to in post# 1265 of the Sierra2 development thread, I’ve found myself listening to music mostly from my CD collection, which is a little unusual for me since my last upgrade (S1-NrT) where I enjoyed listening to my vinyl collection most of the time. It’s interesting to note that although the Sierra 2’s are very adept at revealing information extremely well from both formats, the clarity, depth and detail the Sierra 2’s provide for both redbook and SACD’s is nothing short of outstanding especially when the recording itself is of higher quality (even from average source components like mine). I suspect though that part of my recent affinity for listening to my CD’s has more to do with just being a lazy basterd:rolleyes: - I can put a SACD in and play it for hours of musical enjoyment and not have to move my arse until I’m ready for something new off the rack. These S2’s are just so enjoyable to listen to that I don’t really feel like getting up to flip a record right now (maybe not ever!) It’s funny to admit, but it seems that the longer I sit and listen to a track like Miles Davis’ “Kind of Blue” (SACD) for example, I hear some new subtle information that I didn’t hear the 1st, 2nd or 3rd time – there is certainly a break-in period that the S2’s demand and it’s simply beautiful to behold.
My room is about 16’x16’ with about 12’-14’ high ceilings, my floor is carpeted and I have the Sierra 2’s sitting in each corner of my listening area about 2 ft. behind my thick leather couch on a pair of Sanus (sand filled) UF-30’s which places the tweeter at about ear level. I know it’s not the optimal placement, but with twin 4yr. old boys terrorizing the house, this is the best that I could do for now. I’m powering them with an Emotiva XPA2 Gen2 along with a Marantz 15s2 SACD player. In addition, I’m using a Martin Logan Dynamo 1000 Sub for the lower end. The first thing that stood out to me almost immediately after I did the upgrade was how smooth and articulate the S2’s are even at very low listening levels where I do most of my listening, they seem to be particularly well suited for listening to jazz and classical music. The one thing that I find most intriguing is the difference in how the S2 performs when pushed as compared to the S1-NrT. I put in an old Jimi Hendrix Blues CD that I burned a few years back, and I played a track called “Electric Church Red House” at a pretty high volume level – so much so that my wife and boys had to leave the room. The RAAL tweeter seemed to disappear! In fact, the whole damn speaker disappeared and simply gave back exactly what was being inputted without any strain or effort, the music just filled the room – stunning!! The S1-NrT on the other hand was outstanding in its own right, but the one thing that I noticed was that the NrT tweeter made its presence known somewhat when it was pushed – it sounded sharper but slightly less articulate at the same volume levels. To me, I think the bass is slightly deeper in the S1-NrT, but I think it is negligible as compared to the S2, and in fact, at high volume listening levels the S2’s bass and mid bass is a bit more articulate, detailed and composed as well. As I’ve heard in some of the other posts, I think it’s an accurate statement to say that the speaker simply disappears from the room when playing literally anything on any format, and for me, that’s all that I’ve been searching for. I mean let’s be honest, the S2 is not unique in this regard as there are other quality well performing speakers capable of doing the same thing that I’m raving about, but certainly not at this price-point. The thing that I appreciate most about Dave Fabrikant and all the contributors at Ascend Acoustics is that they’ve taken the time and depth of thought to produce a product that the average working class stiff (me) can afford, and as a consequence, I’ve been freed from the burden of being a “stereophile”. I can now settle into becoming one which I define as a true “audiophile” – someone who recognizes, appreciates, and simply enjoys listening to quality well recorded music regardless of genre.

This is a luxury we all can now afford to take a little step closer to.

Thanks Dave




Current Set up:

Sierra 2's (1 pr)
NAD c165BEE preamp
Marantz SA-15s2 (SACD)
Emotiva XPA2-Gen2
Martin Logan Dynamo 1000 (sub)
Furman (Power Cond.)

[ematthews]

Great write up. I am looking forward to getting mine soon. I placed my order this past Thursday. I will be using a similar set up but in a smaller 11x14 room. XPA-1, USP-1 with Martin Logan Grotto sub. I have a Marantz PM8004 Integrated with a CD6004 in my bedroom. Really thinking of using my Marantz gear with the Sierra's since I like the warmer sound when compared to the Emotiva gear. Not sure how I would use my sub with the Marantz however.

[curtis]

Myself, mziegler, and mikesiskav got to hear the Sierra-2 at Ascend Acoustics today.

First, I want to thank Dave for taking the time on a Sunday to host us for a few hours.

We listened to numerous tracks. I personally through stuff at it that I am very familiar with...tracks that I heard tens if not hundreds of times...stuff that tests the bass, the midrange, the treble, imaging, a dynamics.

The Sierra-2's are exceptionally clean and detailed throughout...if it is in the recording, you are going to hear it.

The first thing I noticed with my material was the bass....clean and articulate. I listen to my current Sierra-1's with a Rythmik F15HP crossed at 80hz. While the Sierra-2's on their own won't play as deep, but what they do play is every bit as good..with authority and articulation. With the material we played, a sub certainly was not necessary. The custom SEAS woofer is every bit as important to the Sierra-2 as the RAAL tweeter. We played material and measured 105+dB peaks at 12 feet...the Sierra-2 never screamed...handled it all in stride. These things are incredibly dynamic for a bookshelf speaker.

The midrange is as clean as ever. We did not get to compare to a Sierra Tower, as Dave was down to his last set of Tower cabinets...and nice pair of naturals. I fell in love with empty cabinets as I really like the new reveal on the front baffle...so nice. This same reveal will be on Sierra-1/2 cabinets that are built locally. Anyways, the midrange is outstanding...clear, open, articulate(fast).

The treble...I can't say anymore than has already been said about a RAAL tweeter. Natural, extended, and detailed. Extremely wide dispersion/soundstage. I detected no immediately issues from being seated to standing...so I don't think vertical dispersion will be an issue for anyone. No fatigue while listening as loudly as we did.

Imaging is outstanding. Well recorded material will show this. Every instrument/sound is separated and has it's proper space. A picture that is in focus.

On top of all of this, the overall sound of the speaker is extremely coherent. It is safe to say that Dave achieved "synergy" when he created the Sierra-2.

I'm at home and listening to my Sierra-1's with my Rythmik. I still love them, but the Sierra-2 is clearly a notch or two or three above.

I took some pictures:

mikesiskav and mziegler settling in for the first listen:
http://changpics.smugmug.com/Other/Ascend-Acoustics-pictures/i-jHCjw8R/0/L/IMG_0773-L.jpg

The Sierra-2 in piano black (mikesiskav in the reflection):
http://changpics.smugmug.com/Other/Ascend-Acoustics-pictures/i-6JMj4RZ/0/L/IMG_0775-L.jpg

People always wonder what electronics Dave uses in the demo room. Rotel pre/pro, Oppo 105 Universal disc player, Onyx CD (not used anymore), ADA PTM-6150 amp:
http://changpics.smugmug.com/Other/Ascend-Acoustics-pictures/i-M377n3R/0/L/IMG_0776-L.jpg

The RAALs...Ascend proprietary RAAL used in the Sierra-2 on the left, RAAL 70-20XR used in the Towers on the right:
http://changpics.smugmug.com/Other/Ascend-Acoustics-pictures/i-wCpJt2z/0/L/IMG_0788-L.jpg
http://changpics.smugmug.com/Other/Ascend-Acoustics-pictures/i-rqd4PG5/0/L/IMG_0785-L.jpg

More pics of the backside of the Sierra-2 RAAL:
http://changpics.smugmug.com/Other/Ascend-Acoustics-pictures/i-3h97fBK/0/L/IMG_0780-L.jpg
http://changpics.smugmug.com/Other/Ascend-Acoustics-pictures/i-Vp3bNqk/0/L/IMG_0781-L.jpg

That iPhone 5S takes pretty decent pictures.

[ematthews]

Great read. Any idea what stands the Sierra's are on..

[Mag_Neato]

Nice pics! That RAAL from the tower is huge. Quite a contrast to the Sierra-2 custom unit.

I did some more listening tonight and continue to be impressed with them. Although they deserve a diet of well recorded material to really strut their stuff, I played some old time disco to finish up my listening session. Donna Summers "I feel love" never sounded better!

[curtis]

Great read. Any idea what stands the Sierra's are on..
Dave told us...but I can't remember what he said.

Maybe mziegler or mikesiskav will remember and chime in. Otherwise, send Ascend an email and ask.

[petmotel]

So Curtis, were you moved enough to want to upgrade?

Jay

[curtis]

So Curtis, were you moved enough to want to upgrade?

Jay...yes.

I own the second set of Sierra-1's sold, about 7 years now I think. I held off on the NrT upgrade because of priorities, but the Sierra-2's have pushed me over the edge.

What I want to do is give my Parents my Sierra-1's....they currently have a "classic" CMT-340/CBM-170 setup, and get a set of Sierra-2's for my LCR.

At the shop yesterday, we did see a set of natural Tower enclosures....I thought they were gorgeous. Thinking about it last night, the Towers, along with a Horizon...with RAALs, would be a lot for my room..and budget. So Sierra-2's it will be.

Now, I will do my taxes, see how that works out, and then plan for the Sierra-2's. Also have to decide what finish I want.

[petmotel]

Jay...yes.

I own the second set of Sierra-1's sold, about 7 years now I think. I held off on the NrT upgrade because of priorities, but the Sierra-2's have pushed me over the edge.

What I want to do is give my Parents my Sierra-1's....they currently have a "classic" CMT-340/CBM-170 setup, and get a set of Sierra-2's for my LCR.

At the shop yesterday, we did see a set of natural Tower enclosures....I thought they were gorgeous. Thinking about it last night, the Towers, along with a Horizon...with RAALs, would be a lot for my room..and budget. So Sierra-2's it will be.

Now, I will do my taxes, see how that works out, and then plan for the Sierra-2's. Also have to decide what finish I want.

I have Towers, and a Horizon in satin espresso, and imported S-2s in satin espresso, S-1NRTs in gloss espresso, and I also have some unused natural cabinets.

The imported satin espresso cabs are more reddish than the domestic cabs, and of course do not have the reveal around the front baffle. The imported satin is also more glossy than the domestic, I'd call it more a semi-gloss than satin finish. I think the gloss cabs are gorgeous, but the gloss is a pain due to how much they show finger prints and dust. I guess I am most pleased with my domestic satin espresso finish, it does a better job of showing off the bamboo grain, and is just classy IMHO. I'd also think the satin black bamboo would suit my tastes well.

I have no doubt that if you do get the Sierra-2s, you'll be thrilled with them, they are truly a wonderful product.

Jay

[mziegler]

I can second everything Curtis said about the Sierra 2.

The remaining question for me is an aesthetic one: can I find a stand that will look good with an espresso Sierra. I have some old stands that went with the 340s, but I don't think they will look that great with the Sierra. Towers, though, would look awesome.

[eliwankenobi]

I have Towers, and a Horizon in satin espresso, and imported S-2s in satin espresso, S-1NRTs in gloss espresso, and I also have some unused natural cabinets.

The imported satin espresso cabs are more reddish than the domestic cabs, and of course do not have the reveal around the front baffle. The imported satin is also more glossy than the domestic, I'd call it more a semi-gloss than satin finish. I think the gloss cabs are gorgeous, but the gloss is a pain due to how much they show finger prints and dust. I guess I am most pleased with my domestic satin espresso finish, it does a better job of showing off the bamboo grain, and is just classy IMHO. I'd also think the satin black bamboo would suit my tastes well.

I have no doubt that if you do get the Sierra-2s, you'll be thrilled with them, they are truly a wonderful product.

Jay

What's this front baffle reveal?

[petmotel]

What's this front baffle reveal?

http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/showthread.php?4630-The-Tower-Discussion-Thread!&p=45535#post45535

Let Dave explain it ^^^^^

Jay

[slowturn]

Great read. Any idea what stands the Sierra's are on..

Looking at the base, they look like the Sanus Steel Series
http://www.sanus.com/en_US/products/speaker-stands/?subCategorySlug=steel-series-speaker-stands

I use the SF30 for my surround speakers.

[SGCSG1]

For stands check out www.skylanstands.com

I'm trying to upload a nice pic of them with a Sierra on them, but it doesn't seem to work? I get an upload but then there's a pic exclamation point next to it. ???

[ematthews]

Ordered the Sanus SF26 this morning. I looked all over for the 30 on Amazon but no one had them. I had to order from Amazon since I had a gift cert..
On a side note. When using the Sierra 2's with and without sub will I set them to full range on my Emotiva USP-1. Wasn't sure since these are book shelf what the settings would be.

[SGCSG1]

Skylan two-post stands with Sierra-1's.

1043

[curtis]

On a side note. When using the Sierra 2's with and without sub will I set them to full range on my Emotiva USP-1. Wasn't sure since these are book shelf what the settings would be.
Yup...full range.

[ematthews]

Yup...full range.
I am supprised by that since I don't use the Polk LSi-15 in full range when using a sub.
So just to be clear. I will use full range with a sub on the Sierra 2's..

[billy p]

For stands check out www.skylanstands.com

I'm trying to upload a nice pic of them with a Sierra on them, but it doesn't seem to work? I get an upload but then there's a pic exclamation point next to it. ???


Whoa...those skylanstands look very nice...I know Dave recommended the Sanus SF series for the Sierra1 IIRC. I also recall another Ascend member posting his own custom built stands for his Sierras and mentioned he could build matching custom stands for others...just can't find the post...I have tried..no luck...I'm not sure if Dave would approve or disapprove in dealing with another member in such a manner.

As for the 26" stands I thought with the height of the Sierra 1...sat on the perfect plane to the main LP for my situation. The 30" would have been 1"-2" to high.

[curtis]

I also recall another Ascend member posting his own custom built stands for his Sierras and mentioned he could build matching custom stands for others...just can't find the post...I have tried..no luck...I'm not sure if Dave would approve or disapprove in dealing with another member in such a manner.
That was Jason Coleman from three or four years ago. I got my custom bamboo stands from him. He doesn't do it any longer. He has since moved from Sierra-1's to big Dali floorstanders.

My stands are actually 30"-31" tall. At the time I got them, I needed them to clear an arm of a sofa. I think 26" would have been perfect. Since then the room has changed a lot. I move my ears up and down a foot or so, and I can't hear a difference. This is at a distance of about 9'.

[SGCSG1]

Whoa...those skylanstands look very nice...I know Dave recommended the Sanus SF series for the Sierra1 IIRC. I also recall another Ascend member posting his own custom built stands for his Sierras and mentioned he could build matching custom stands for others...just can't find the post...I have tried..no luck...I'm not sure if Dave would approve or disapprove in dealing with another member in such a manner.

As for the 26" stands I thought with the height of the Sierra 1...sat on the perfect plane to the main LP for my situation. The 30" would have been 1"-2" to high.

I've been buying stands from Noel (Skylan) for ten years or so. They are pretty much perfect - Noel makes them to your desired custom height and makes the top plate so it perfectly fits (and supports) your speaker. I'll never go back to metal stands again.

[curtis]

I am supprised by that since I don't use the Polk LSi-15 in full range when using a sub.
So just to be clear. I will use full range with a sub on the Sierra 2's..
I mis-read "with and without"....and yes, without a sub, use the Sierra-2's fullrange.

With a sub, just like you do with the LSi-15's, you will NOT use the Sierra-2's fullrange.

[Mag_Neato]

Normally I'd agree with Curtis here......small with a sub. However, the 2's are so dynamic and handle loads of power with ease that I would suggest experimenting with what settings work best. I actually run mine full range with the sub with no issues.

[curtis]

Normally I'd agree with Curtis here......small with a sub. However, the 2's are so dynamic and handle loads of power with ease that I would suggest experimenting with what settings work best. I actually run mine full range with the sub with no issues.

But then you are doubling the bass somewhere in the FR.

I would actually go fullrange without a sub (the bass is that good) before fullrange with a sub.

[billy p]

That was Jason Coleman from three or four years ago. I got my custom bamboo stands from him. He doesn't do it any longer. He has since moved from Sierra-1's to big Dali floorstanders.

My stands are actually 30"-31" tall. At the time I got them, I needed them to clear an arm of a sofa. I think 26" would have been perfect. Since then the room has changed a lot. I move my ears up and down a foot or so, and I can't hear a difference. This is at a distance of about 9'.

Whew...I knew, I wasn't imaging things...now, if I only kept my Sierra 1's...I'd likely be talking about the S2 upgrade and have something more valuable to contribute.:o

Cheers, Bill...:)

[petmotel]

My checklist after having spent a good deal of quality time with my new Sierra-2s


airy, sparkly, realistic, RAAL top end: check
bass extension (typical in room response) to around 40 Hz: check
High end transient impact of the first order: check
Midrange transient impact of the first order: check
Bass transient impact of the first order: check, and double check
unbelievably transparent imaging: check
gets loud without strain, or compression: check
huge dynamic range: check
stickler for details: check
no listener fatigue to be found regardless of volume: check
tremendous performance/price ratio: check
quality fit, and finish: check

I would say the biggest surprise I have found with the Sierra-2s is the power, and brutal transient abilities of these speakers. Second is the control in the bass region, they are extremely capable, and yet very tight, and controlled. The new mid/woofer driver in the Sierra-2 is a very remarkable achievement, Seas, and Dave must be thrilled with the outcome!

I have the new Twos installed as side surrounds in my 5.1 "theater" system now, and am very pleased with them. As surrounds, there are many times they do their job quietly, and without notice. On the occasions when I'm playing surround music that has a liberal mix that makes more than average use of them, it's just so cool how they have the same sonic signature of the RAAL equipped front stage. I really thought the Sierra-NRTs did a great job, and yet there is a distinct difference between blending well, and actually matching. And the Twos match up with the RAAL equipped Towers, and Horizon perfectly.

Jay

[eliwankenobi]

Hello everybody!

Last week I got the upgrades and my center s2! Very excited with them. I've only been able to do just one speaker, could not the other one since I received a wrong sized woofer gasket. Called Dina and immediately sent another one. Should be here soon. So far my customer service experience with Ascend has been very good, no complaints.

So, I took the chance to compare the one S2 to the one NrT. One next to the other, and listening near field the difference is remarkable. The NrT us more forward (not that I have a problem with that) while the RAAL is so smooth and detailed and more relax, no harshness what so ever. Putting my face less that a foot from the speakers I could tell very easily that the NrT's sound came from the dome tweeter, meaning I could localize the tweeter as the source, but with the RAAL, not at all. I mean it was like its coming from somewhere in the front of the speaker, but not from the tweeter. More like a floating sound source from somewhere in the area of the speaker.. Very weird and cool.

When the other gasket gets here, I should be able to comment more and a proper review!

EDIT:

Meanwhile here is a pic

1045

[Harley Weewax]

The RAAL tweeter is what tipped the scales in favor of the S2's for me. I have wanted to get into ribbon tweeters for about a decade now, but they are expensive.

I had already decided to go with Ascend based on their customer service. There is no shortage of good loudspeakers on the market today. What Ascend offers that I really appreciated was their QC. That is one of the biggest aspects of the way Ascend does things that impressed me. I REALLY liked that I get response plots for my individual speaker and that pairs are level matched. But the Towers with RAAL were just too expensive for me.

Then I read about the S2's. I had to have them. And the ribbons are everything they are purported to be. Their clarity and acuity coupled with no fatigue whatsoever is so refreshing. There is no boom and tizz here. Just wide open airy highs and well controlled bass response. I know this sounds like hyperbole, but it really isn't. These tweeters are amazing. Combined with the SEAS woofer, this is a well integrated and happy speaker.

I have had the S2's set up as LCRs and 170s as surrounds. I have been running subless as I wait for the Rythmik FV15HPs to arrive. They work without a sub just fine for 90% of my listening. So far it is 90/10 in favor of HT/TV over music and the speakers are just fine without a sub. Now I am not a dolt. I am not saying that bookshelf speakers will rattle windows and slam you in the chest when something explodes onscreen. Or that the latest dubstep track will be heard across the street. However the bass response is there and it is tight and controlled enough that it is still satisfying for most watching/listening. Especially with a three year old in the house.

Anyhow, tldnr version: the Sierra 2s are great; buy them.

When I get my sub in and begin my Audyssey odyssey I will be sure and start a thread with my experiences. I just ordered a UMIK-1 and am reading up on REW. Down the rabbit hole I go...

[davef]

Great read. Any idea what stands the Sierra's are on..

Those are the Sanus SF-30. Nice stands for the $$$

[ematthews]

Those are the Sanus SF-30. Nice stands for the $$$

Dave What do you recommend using my preamp setting on for the new Sierra 2's WITH SUB...
Full range Or High pass
Respect to the other answers. Just wondering what Dave would do.

[curtis]

Dave What do you recommend using my preamp setting on for the new Sierra 2's WITH SUB...
Full range Or High pass
Respect to the other answers. Just wondering what Dave would do.
I'm not Dave...so don't take any of this as his answer.

The idea of the high pass is to alleviate the woofer in the speaker of doing work that is better left to the subwoofer.

When at the Ascend offices just couple weeks ago to hear the Sierra-2, the subject of using a subwoofer with the Sierra-2's came up to get "closer" to the sound of the Sierra Tower w/RAAL....taking deep bass work from the Sierra-2 would help.

One thing for sure, if using a sub with the Sierra-2, high passed or not, I recommend something with great sound quality. Anything less is not going match well. The Sierra-2's bass quality is outstanding. If I didn't have a good enough sub, I wouldn't use one.

That all said, it won't hurt to try all the combinations and figure out which you like best.

[ematthews]

I'm not Dave...so don't take any of this as his answer.

The idea of the high pass is to alleviate the woofer in the speaker of doing work that is better left to the subwoofer.

When at the Ascend offices just couple weeks ago to hear the Sierra-2, the subject of using a subwoofer with the Sierra-2's came up to get "closer" to the sound of the Sierra Tower w/RAAL....taking deep bass work from the Sierra-2 would help.

One thing for sure, if using a sub with the Sierra-2, high passed or not, I recommend something with great sound quality. Anything less is not going match well. The Sierra-2's bass quality is outstanding. If I didn't have a good enough sub, I wouldn't use one.

That all said, it won't hurt to try all the combinations and figure out which you like best.
Thanks. So you are saying I need a good sub to match. I own the Martin Logan Grotto... I plan on replacing it with a Rythmik F12.. Would this be good enough?

[curtis]

Thanks. So you are saying I need a good sub to match. I own the Martin Logan Grotto... I plan on replacing it with a Rythmik F12.. Would this be good enough?
I don't know how the Martin Logan fairs, but I know the Rythmik has excellent sound quality. I own an F15HP.

I don't own Sierra-2's yet...their bass quality is better than the Sierra-1's, although not quite as deep. Crossed at 80hz, with phased dialed in right, the F15HP is seamless with my Sierra-1's. When I had a VTF-3MK3, I had to cross at 60hz with the Sierra-1's...above that, the quality didn't match and not seamless.

I have a feeling I may have to cross lower than 80hz with the Sierra-2's, but I'm not worried about it, as we were listening to them fullrange no-sub, at some very loud levels, and they handled it beautifully.

[ematthews]

I'm a little nervous going with the Sierra 2 for the sole purpose of not getting enough bass quantity.. Not quality, as I know I will get that. My intentions for replacing my Polk's was to go with a really good book shelf and sub set up... I want a very full top to bottom sound.

[curtis]

I'm a little nervous going with the Sierra 2 for the sole purpose of not getting enough bass quantity.. Not quality, as I know I will get that. My intentions for replacing my Polk's was to go with a really good book shelf and sub set up... I want a very full top to bottom sound.
How big is your room? Ascend's demo room is pretty big.

Dave measured output at 12' and we hit over 105dB....two speakers only, no sub. Behind where Dave was measuring is around another 3-4'. The Sierra-2's had no problem with it.

I don't think you have anything to worry about, especially if you are getting a Rythmik in the future.

What you will have problems with wrapping your head around is the quality of the bass vs your Polks. :)

[FirstReflect]

When it comes to bass and the crossover between the subwoofers and speakers, it's not about the capabilities of the speakers, it's about what your room acoustics will allow you to hear at your seat.

The Sierra-2 will output their bass to whatever their linear extension limit is (seems to be something close to 50Hz or so), and they will roll off below that point with something close to a 24dB/octave slope when using their standard ported configuration (no port plugs).

But that is not what you're going to hear at your primary seat. Furthermore, what you hear at your primary seat is not what you will hear at the seat beside the primary seat. And that won't be the same as what you hear at your 3rd seat, 4th seat, and so on.

Your speakers need to be placed wherever works best for imaging, soundstage, and proper integration with images from your display. Those will not be the best spots in your room in terms of giving you uniform, linear bass response. And there's nothing wrong with that! That is exactly what subwoofers are for.

So what I strongly recommend is to first position and set up your speakers for good imaging and soundstage. Then start playing some bass sweeps. I typically use a marked, linear sweep from 100Hz down to 30Hz that can be easily made for free over at audiocheck.net . That way, I can easily listen to the sweep and count the clicks to know the approximate frequency at which any notable dips or peaks stand out.

Play the sweep on repeat through only one speaker at a time, and listen to the sweep at every seat in your room that matters to you. You'll come to discover that the bass response is not uniform from seat to seat, and you might discover a very large dip or peak at certain frequencies at certain seats.

Make a note of any large dips. There's no way to fix those with EQ. Therefore, you want to set your speaker crossover (high pass filter) to a frequency above any large dips. Let your subwoofers handle the frequencies below that point, and you'll be treated to much more linear and uniform bass throughout your room :)

[billy p]

Yup...with the Towers I found 60hz worked best in my room...the bass sounded more natural less localized...even with the SB13U going solo...I tried some higher cutoffs(120hz) but simply found the sweet spot to be around 60hz largely due to location restrains. The most important thing to remember is to get your sub to blend in with your speakers.

[FirstReflect]

Thanks, billy p :D

Yes, in my room, I wound up with 80 Hz for my Horizon RAAL Center, 60 Hz for my Front L/R, 70 Hz for my Surrounds, Backs, and Heights, and 120 Hz for my Wides.

My Front L/R and Center speakers, they all play nice and linear down to 40 Hz on their own. My Surrounds, Backs, and Heights all output linearly down to about 45 Hz. And my Wides are linear down to about 100 Hz. But not one if them sounds that way in my particular room, and they do not sound identical from seat to seat.

My pair of SVS Ultra subs, though, positioned at the mid-point of both side walls, they sound not only linear down to below 20 Hz, but they also sound uniform from seat to seat.

So I used the bass sweeps, discovered how low the speakers could play before they started to sound non-linear and/or non-uniform, and then set the crossover above that point :)

The results are darn near magical. It's really quite unbelievable. I can play a bass sweep through any and every channel now, and the entire sweep just sounds even, linear, and best of all, completely uniform in every seating position. I do not even notice that my subwoofers are there, which is utterly insane given how physically close they are to my seats! But all the theory about multiple subwoofers and sound wave interference patterns totally works in practice! It just sounds as though each and every speaker in my system plays linearly down to below 20 Hz all on its own! And at every seat in the room!

There is simply no way to achieve that same illusion with the speakers alone. That's not the fault of the speakers. They are doing their job. Most people would look at the specs of my Horizon Center and ask, "why the heck are you using an 80 Hz crossover?" Furthermore, if they listened to my Horizon Center play a bass sweep all by itself with the speaker outside, they'd think I'm even more bonkers for setting it to 80 Hz, since it plays so well all the way down to at least 40 Hz!

But it is not just the speaker alone. It is the speaker, plus my room's reflections, plus the locations of my seats. Those things all interact, and in my particular instance, they happen to result in a big old null at 70 Hz. The sound waves come out of the speaker itself nice and linear and accurate, but by the time those sound waves reach my ears at my seat, reflections of those sound waves off of my walls, ceiling, and floor have conferred and interfered to result in a cancellation right at the spot where my primary seat goes. So instead, my subwoofers take over at 80 Hz, and I eliminate that problem :D

This is why I do not consider bass extension to be something that buyers and reviewers should stress so much. Whatever extension and linearity or non-linearity you heard in your room? It's unique to that room! It's not because of the speakers. I get a little frustrated by how much people emphasize bass extension in speakers. One person will say the speakers play very low and you don't need a subwoofer. Another person will say the exact same speakers don't play all that low, and you definitely need a subwoofer. Neither person is lying. That's undoubtedly what they heard, for real. BUT IT'S NOT BECAUSE OF THE SPEAKERS. The room, the room, the room. It's because of the room…and where your seats happen to be placed within that room relative to where the speakers are placed.

Best part of my argument: it's easy to prove :) Just play that bass sweep through one speaker by itself, have a listen, then move seats, or move the speaker. The sound changes! Well, the speaker didn't change. The bass sweep didn't change. So that just leaves sound wave interference as the culprit. And we can fix that by using multiple subwoofers ;)

[davef]

Dave What do you recommend using my preamp setting on for the new Sierra 2's WITH SUB...
Full range Or High pass
Respect to the other answers. Just wondering what Dave would do.

Regardless of the speakers being used, if you are using a subwoofer -- I always recommend setting the speakers to high passed. If you do not, having bass coming from multiple sources in different positions will result in some frequencies being cancelled (out of phase) and some frequencies being doubled (in phase).

[TheHolyCannoli]

Just received my Sierra-2 fronts and center in satin espresso. The finish looks excellent and I'm happy I went with the darker espresso over the cherry. I got a bit nervous at one point as I was running my finger along the rubber surround of he woofer. I felt what I thought was a tear or crease, but then I turned on the lights in my room and noticed that the surround is somewhat ribbed....phew. Side note, I've been having terrible luck with my purchases lately, most recently having to return a $1300 Ariens snowblower, TWICE, because of defects.

I'm in the middle of renovations, so I'm stuck with a 3.1 setup in a medium size room with minimal furnishings. My music collection is buried somewhere in an unlabelled moving box, and I'm still struggling with the thought of watching a blu-ray with no surround channels. Therefore, my first sonic impression is limited to HDTV programming. First thing that really jumps out is how crisp the highs seem. Even with background music that is significantly subdued compared to the rest of the programming, the cymbals and guitar strings are very distinct. Also, the sound of a glass vase shattering on-screen was so remarkably life-like that the dog jumped to his feet and was on high-alert.

I haven't done anything close to critical listening with music or high quality sources, and with that said, I'm actually surprised I've been able to hear a significant difference while simply watching television with mostly news/dialogue programming.

[ematthews]

I could not do that. I would have to tear into my music and give it a go...Mine are due here Friday. Hope they get here so I have the full weekend for the set up. Speaker stands came in today. Tomorrow the assembly starts and I am not looking forward to the kitty fill. These Sanus stands have three very small fill holes....
So get a CD out and fill us in...

[curtis]

These Sanus stands have three very small fill holes....

Get a funnel.

[Mag_Neato]

I thought I'd post an update to my impressions of the Sierra-2 after upgrading.

I had a little free time last night while the girls were out to do some listening. I've been debating whether to run them full range in Pure direct w/out a sub or crossed with a sub in stereo. To me, the pure direct mode has yielded audibly better (to me) results and so I usually have it going that way. The RAAL tweeter gets the lion's share of attention, and with good reason. It is amazing. However, the new SEAS woofer is equally, if not MORE impressive! I pushed the -2's in pure direct (full range) with more power than I ever felt comfortable feeding the NrT's with and they never batted an eye. I had not played the track "Never Mind" by Infected Mushroom on the -2's until last night. I had them cranked as much as I dared with Marantz SR6003 pushing 100 watts per channel. I was blown away.

If you want to be amazed at the capabilities of these speakers this is one of my recommended tracks. I streamed it from Spotify. My jaw hit the floor and I had to laugh. These speakers should easily cost over
$3000.

Dave, as I said before.....out of the ballpark.

[jahjd2000]

Yup...with the Towers I found 60hz worked best in my room...the bass sounded more natural less localized...even with the SB13U going solo...I tried some higher cutoffs(120hz) but simply found the sweet spot to be around 60hz largely due to location restrains. The most important thing to remember is to get your sub to blend in with your speakers.

I agree with this 100%. For the longest time I had been running my set up in a suboptimal way. After rotating my sub 90 degrees and properly calibrating it with udyssey (basically trimming the gain on my sub..before I ran it too hot), it sounds so much better now. My Epik Empire blends in seamlessly with my Ascend towers and Horizon center. Any localization I had in the past is virtually gone. The bass is now much more uniform and it sounds like it's coming from the front stage now (my sub is near field next to the sofa). I'm loving this new configuration.

[curtis]

I thought I'd post an update to my impressions of the Sierra-2 after upgrading.

I had a little free time last night while the girls were out to do some listening. I've been debating whether to run them full range in Pure direct w/out a sub or crossed with a sub in stereo. To me, the pure direct mode has yielded audibly better (to me) results and so I usually have it going that way. The RAAL tweeter gets the lion's share of attention, and with good reason. It is amazing. However, the new SEAS woofer is equally, if not MORE impressive! I pushed the -2's in pure direct (full range) with more power than I ever felt comfortable feeding the NrT's with and they never batted an eye. I had not played the track "Never Mind" by Infected Mushroom on the -2's until last night. I had them cranked as much as I dared with Marantz SR6003 pushing 100 watts per channel. I was blown away.

If you want to be amazed at the capabilities of these speakers this is one of my recommended tracks. I streamed it from Spotify. My jaw hit the floor and I had to laugh. These speakers should easily cost over
$3000.

Dave, as I said before.....out of the ballpark.
Yeah...they can take a lot of power. That was evident in Ascend's demo room.

What crossover points have you tried? I'd start going lower until I couldn't hear a difference.

[Mag_Neato]

I can only go down to 60Hz with the SR6003. 60, 80, 100, etc. up to 180.

I am going to look into adding an external crossover I can run at speaker level between the Marantz and the speakers to use in pure direct.

[curtis]

I can only go down to 60Hz with the SR6003. 60, 80, 100, etc. up to 180.

I am going to look into adding an external crossover I can run at speaker level between the Marantz and the speakers to use in pure direct.
So you even heard a difference crossed at 60hz?

Another option for you is a preamp with an HT bypass...but then you would need an external amp.

[magi44ken]

How is the dynamic when comparing to speaker that uses compression driver with a waveguide or horn? I'm looking for a speaker with very good dynamic for theater and music plus a big sweet spot which RAAL provides compare to dynamic drivers.

[Mag_Neato]

How is the dynamic when comparing to speaker that uses compression driver with a waveguide or horn? I'm looking for a speaker with very good dynamic for theater and music plus a big sweet spot which RAAL provides compare to dynamic drivers.

The dynamics of the -2's are excellent. They could put many floorstanders to shame. I would not worry about that at all. I know it has been said again and again, but they really are incredible.

[ematthews]

So you even heard a difference crossed at 60hz?

Another option for you is a preamp with an HT bypass...but then you would need an external amp.
Correct me if I am wrong, but you guys are talking about your AV Receiver's here... Just confused me a little since all I do is 2 channel music only systems.

[Galaga]

Well, ended up getting way more than I was expecting on my returns, so it ordered some Sierra-2s. On a side note, I opened a new cc that gives 40,000 miles if you spend > $1,000 in the fisrt 90 days. That covers a $400+ (you also get 2 miles for every dollar spent) plane ticket, enough for a domestic flight. Since I had a trip coming up anyway, that covers my ticket and then you can just fee the money over and close the cc after you redeem your points. So it effectively took $375 or so off the price. Just thought I would put that out there if anyone else is in a similar situation.

Anyway now it's just the waiting game, feeling the anticipation I'm sure all of you who already went through this felt!!

[RicardoJoa]

I can only go down to 60Hz with the SR6003. 60, 80, 100, etc. up to 180.

I am going to look into adding an external crossover I can run at speaker level between the Marantz and the speakers to use in pure direct.

Have you tried running full range for the front and have the sub cross low to around 50 or below just to supplemenet the low end?

[Mag_Neato]

Have you tried running full range for the front and have the sub cross low to around 50 or below just to supplemenet the low end?

I did try running them as large with the sub also, but as I said, the crossover only goes down to 60Hz.

The pure direct mode just seems to sound better. More detail larger soundstage. Subtle in certain instances but noticeable.

[curtis]

I did try running them as large with the sub also, but as I said, the crossover only goes down to 60Hz.

The pure direct mode just seems to sound better. More detail larger soundstage. Subtle in certain instances but noticeable.
But set the sub amp's crossover to below 50hz. That way it won't also play same signals above 50hz as the speakers.

In other words, don't use the crossover on the receiver.

[Mag_Neato]

But set the sub amp's crossover to below 50hz. That way it won't also play same signals above 50hz as the speakers.

In other words, don't use the crossover on the receiver.

So, set the Sierra's to Large with bass set to "Both" and set the crossover for the sub at 60Hz(lowest setting) in the AVR, and dial the crossover on the Rythmik to 50Hz? Should I leave the toggle on the Rythmik to EXT/12db, or set it at 50Hz/24?

[curtis]

So, set the Sierra's to Large with bass set to "Both" and set the crossover for the sub at 60Hz(lowest setting) in the AVR, and dial the crossover on the Rythmik to 50Hz? Should I leave the toggle on the Rythmik to EXT/12db, or set it at 50Hz/24?
Yeah...I think that would do it. On the sub, I think set it to 50hz/24.

See how that sounds with low bass material.

[curtis]

Correct me if I am wrong, but you guys are talking about your AV Receiver's here... Just confused me a little since all I do is 2 channel music only systems.

Yes...we are.

But aren't you using a receiver with bass management as well? It shouldn't make a difference between 2-channel and multi-channel.

[ematthews]

Yes...we are.

But aren't you using a receiver with bass management as well? It shouldn't make a difference between 2-channel and multi-channel.

My Emotiva USP-1 has bass management. It's different than an AVR set up. Simple really. All you do is hook it up to high pass and dial in your cross over. I normally have mine set around 80...
I however won't be using the Emotiva gear at first. My XPA-2 is going in for repair. I will be using my Marantz PM8004 without a sub for a while.

[eliwankenobi]

All right guys!

Here it is my newly upgraded Sierra-2s

1053

I upgraded from NrTs.. and all I have to say is this... ignorance is bliss. I know many of you would have been more than happy keeping your NrTs as they were excellent.. Like a picture through a very clean glass....now the S2 has broken that glass as others have mentioned.

This are just quick impressions...from a copule of hours of listening this morning... but boy am I glad I did this upgrade.

I set them on top of the boxes (box on the left is for the S2 center I ordered) in a near field configuration to get a quick glance at how they perform. I don't have proper stands yet and for the moment I also have many reflective surfaces, so I wanted to minimized that as much as possible. I was sitting like maybe between 3-4 ft away, on the floor over a carpet.

I am very impressed. They sound very open and clean. Imaging is great! very precise, width of soundstage went actually a little beyond the speaker edges which is awesome. Even being that close to the speaker, all sounded like...sounds or voices in the air...not coming from the speaker at all..I can confirm that they are very dynamic too with more impact than the NrTs which were great speakers.

More to come as I set up the speakers on stands and setup the center speaker. I also plan on getting a measuring mike to get into REW too. Perhaps I make a new thread for that, but wanted to share with others here how amazing these things are!

I have been auditioning speakers for a very long time while also saving money for them...These were right within my budget and their performance is right up there with other brands that I like very much but like with other high end companies, their prices are higher too. Congratulations to ASCEND for making such wonderful speakers! Awesome Job Dave!

I also owe a big thank you to merrymaid520 for allowing me to visit and demo his towers with RAAL. It all started with listening to those speakers, they are awesome! Thank you Brandon!

[curtis]

My Emotiva USP-1 has bass management. It's different than an AVR set up. Simple really. All you do is hook it up to high pass and dial in your cross over. I normally have mine set around 80...
I however won't be using the Emotiva gear at first. My XPA-2 is going in for repair. I will be using my Marantz PM8004 without a sub for a while.
Nice...but how do you see that as different than an AVR?

[magi44ken]

The dynamics of the -2's are excellent. They could put many floorstanders to shame. I would not worry about that at all. I know it has been said again and again, but they really are incredible.

Thanks for the confirmation. I would love to demo one. Anyone near the Bay Area, California?

[eliwankenobi]

Thanks for the confirmation. I would love to demo one. Anyone near the Bay Area, California?

If you live in California, is Dan Clemente very far? You could just visit Ascend

[Beave]

California is a big state - from the Bay Area to San Clemente is a good 8 hour drive, assuming you don't get stuck in traffic.

But maybe Dan Clemente is closer? :p

[eliwankenobi]

LOL !! Typing on iPhone with my fat fingers is hard!

[merrymaid520]

I also owe a big thank you to merrymaid520 for allowing me to visit and demo his towers with RAAL. It all started with listening to those speakers, they are awesome! Thank you Brandon!

I am glad you are enjoying the Sierra-2's! It was my pleasure hosting you for the tower demo! Hopefully someday I can visit you and hear them;)

[Asliang]

I wonder how the Sierra-2 compares to some of the Selah Audio kits that also use the RAAL tweeter.

[ematthews]

Nice...but how do you see that as different than an AVR?

Isn't the AVR parametric?

[RicardoJoa]

I did try running them as large with the sub also, but as I said, the crossover only goes down to 60Hz.

The pure direct mode just seems to sound better. More detail larger soundstage. Subtle in certain instances but noticeable.
Thats right, forgot about the xover settings but you can run higher and use the crossover on the sub, if there is one.
I run mine full range with the highest setting on the avr, and use the crossover on the rythmik. I also use the 24db cut which seems to integrate pretty well without any distance adjustment on the avr.

[curtis]

Isn't the AVR parametric?
Parametric refers to equalization, not bass management.

[TheHolyCannoli]

As I'm sitting her listening to an assortment of FLACs, I feel the need to post about how amazed I am with this ribbon tweeter. Just as an example, Michael Jackson and Akon duet - Hold My Hand...at about 0:45sec into the song I felt like a fairy was flying around my head sprinkling pixie dust on me. Unbelievable transparency and detail. Even more impressive is the fact that I'm only listening at around 35-45dB and they are still giving such a realistic and enveloping effect.

[ematthews]

Let me ask something about book shelf speakers like my new Sierra 2's. I am using my Marantz PM8004 until I get my Emotiva XPA-2 amp back. I have to turn my volume up to almost twelve O clock to get it pretty loud in my small 11x12 room. Can these speakers handle a lot of power? Do I risk damaging the speakers putting them at a high volume? I always used floor standers in the past and it's taking a little time to adjust.
I worry that my Emotiva XPA-2 will be to much for these speakers...Or maybe that's what these Sierra 2's need.. Power.

[eliwankenobi]

Let me ask something about book shelf speakers like my new Sierra 2's. I am using my Marantz PM8004 until I get my Emotiva XPA-2 amp back. I have to turn my volume up to almost twelve O clock to get it pretty loud in my small 11x12 room. Can these speakers handle a lot of power? Do I risk damaging the speakers putting them at a high volume? I always used floor standers in the past and it's taking a little time to adjust.
I worry that my Emotiva XPA-2 will be to much for these speakers...Or maybe that's what these Sierra 2's need.. Power.

Not at all! The Sierra-1 can withstand up to 400 watts! The XPA-2 wont give that much power to a 6ohm load. They will sound awesome!!!

[RPM]

I use a XPA-2 and its a great combo!

[merrymaid520]

S2 upgrade kit has been ordered for my rear surrounds! RAAL all around, woohoo!

[petmotel]

S2 upgrade kit has been ordered for my rear surrounds! RAAL all around, woohoo!

Try the Blu-ray of Steven Wilson's "The Raven That Refused to Sing and Other Stories" in multi-channel after you get the surrounds converted. Best multi mix I've yet heard, and not by a small margin either! Goose bump city.

Jay

[merrymaid520]

Try the Blu-ray of Steven Wilson's "The Raven Who Would Not Sing and Other Stories" in multi-channel after you get the surrounds converted. Best multi mix I've yet heard, and not by a small margin either! Goose bump city.

Jay

Hey Jay,
I'm a step ahead of ya. I have that album already, indeed it does sound great! I had never heard Steven Wilson or porcupine tree before, cool stuff! I have the tracks off the blu ray In flac:)

[ematthews]

Steve Wilson stuff is number 1 in my book. I have been enjoying his stuff for a long time. The raven thst refused to sing was the best song to come out last year.

[merrymaid520]

Steve Wilson stuff is number 1 in my book. I have been enjoying his stuff for a long time. The raven thst refused to sing was the best song to come out last year.

Nice. Any other recommendations from him?

[ematthews]

As for cd music. All of the porcupine tree albums. Blackfield is another project he did.

[merrymaid520]

As for cd music. All of the porcupine tree albums. Blackfield is another project he did.

What other Multi channel / High res stuff do they have??

[ematthews]

I have this one. Not sure of all the Hi rez stuff. Check out his own personal site. There is a lot there.
This is a great one to have.
http://www.amazon.com/Anesthetize-DVD-Blu-ray-Porcupine-Tree/dp/B003F0NFHM/ref=sr_1_2?s=movies-tv&ie=UTF8&qid=1394126623&sr=1-2&keywords=porcupine+tree

[merrymaid520]

I have this one. Not sure of all the Hi rez stuff. Check out his own personal site. There is a lot there.
This is a great one to have.
http://www.amazon.com/Anesthetize-DVD-Blu-ray-Porcupine-Tree/dp/B003F0NFHM/ref=sr_1_2?s=movies-tv&ie=UTF8&qid=1394126623&sr=1-2&keywords=porcupine+tree

Thanks! I might try a few PT albums in dvd-a format. I'll grab that blu ray too!

[davef]

I have become a huge PT fan over the past year :)

[merrymaid520]

I have become a huge PT fan over the past year :)
I've only heard the "raven" album on blu ray and it's cool and well recorded. What other ones have you checked out?

[davef]

I've only heard the "raven" album on blu ray and it's cool and well recorded. What other ones have you checked out?

My daily playlist at the office is as follows:

Deadwing
In Absentia
The Incident
Stupid Dream
Fear of a Blank Planet

All of it is excellent IMO...

[ematthews]

I personaly have never listened to anything I didn't like from him...If you get a few albums from PT...
Get these.
1.The Incident
2. Stupid Dream
3. in absentia
4. Deadwig
5. Lightbulb sun
6. Signify

Oh I could go on....Get all of them. Some of his Imports have extra stuff on them. He will add 5.1 surround disc to a lot of his cd's.
In fact... He is so good that YES asked him to redo one of their old albums...

[ematthews]

My daily playlist at the office is as follows:

Deadwing
In Absentia
The Incident
Stupid Dream
Fear of a Blank Planet

All of it is excellent IMO...

Ha. Dave.. We were typing the same thing at the same time...
Eric

[merrymaid520]

Dave / Eric,
I just ordered most of PT's albums you listed but in their Dvd-audio format:). This way I get high res stereo and surround! I need demo material for my soon to arrive Sierra 2 rears.

[TheHolyCannoli]

I've also been listening to In Absentia, albeit in FLAC. What I've been noticing lately is that the sounds/music coming from the Sierra-2s don't seem like they are coming from the speakers. It's a bit hard to explain, but it's most easily demonstrated by walking out of the room while they are playing...

Currently, the speakers are located in a living room that has a half-wall opening to the kitchen. When I leave the room, the vocals and instruments don't lose their clarity. With other speakers I've used, if you weren't in an ideal listening position, things tended to sound muffled without any real distinction between different instruments. Now, it truly sounds as if the band is sitting in the room. It's quite remarkable.

I've mentioned it before somewhere on these forums, but our dog has been on edge since setting up the Sierras. At least once every couple days, the dog jumps up growling at sounds coming from the speakers. We've had him for 4 yrs and I can count on one hand the number of times he's done that before the Sierra-2's.

[bkdc]

I am thoroughly impressed with the Sierra-2. If I ever need another pair of bookshelves, I'll purchase another pair. My only wish is that I wish it were front-ported like the Salk Sound SILK bookshelf. I understand that the rear ported cabinet from the original Sierra had to be preserved. But make a front ported version with a slit-like port (similar to the port on the Horizon) and I'd buy another pair.

[FirstReflect]

I am thoroughly impressed with the Sierra-2. If I ever need another pair of bookshelves, I'll purchase another pair. My only wish is that I wish it were front-ported like the Salk Sound SILK bookshelf. I understand that the rear ported cabinet from the original Sierra had to be preserved. But make a front ported version with a slit-like port (similar to the port on the Horizon) and I'd buy another pair.

If you're finding the rear port placement problematic (speakers have their backs close to a wall, or they're inside a shelving unit or a bookcase or something), you can use Ascend's Q-Plugs: http://www.ascendacoustics.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=9QPKSR1&Category_Code=ACCS

Q-Plug B alters the low end response for situations where near-a-wall placement is creating too much bass reinforcement.

Q-Plug A essentially turns the Sierra bookshelf cabinet into a sealed configuration as far as output response is concerned.

[eliwankenobi]

If you're finding the rear port placement problematic (speakers have their backs close to a wall, or they're inside a shelving unit or a bookcase or something), you can use Ascend's Q-Plugs: http://www.ascendacoustics.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=9QPKSR1&Category_Code=ACCS

Q-Plug B alters the low end response for situations where near-a-wall placement is creating too much bass reinforcement.

Q-Plug A essentially turns the Sierra bookshelf cabinet into a sealed configuration as far as output response is concerned.

Do you think this ports will work the same way on the Sierra-2 the same way they did on the Sierra-1?

[FirstReflect]

Do you think this ports will work the same way on the Sierra-2 the same way they did on the Sierra-1?

Yes. While there's some difference in the bass extension and output between the Sierra-1 and the Sierra-2, it's honestly not that large of a difference. If you place the Sierra-2 close to a wall or within a shelving unit, it will still receive a bass boost from those boundaries, just like any other speaker. So the port plugs still work well for the Sierra-2. I'm certainly still using the Q-Plugs A for my Sierra-2 speakers. Keeps them nice and linear sounding down to my chosen 70Hz crossover point :)

[smurraybhm]

I would just point out that Dave recommended not using the Q plugs after the upgrade. I followed his advice and honestly can't tell a difference with or without them. My speakers are a few inches from the wall due to being placed on built in bookshelf that is also home to the A/V equipment.

[bkdc]

I e-mailed Dave, and he said the same thing. He did not recommend Q-Plugs for the Sierra-2. He suggested I cross over and above 80Hz when I integrate with a subwoofer to deal with any boominess, and I'm just going to hook them up to my SVS SB-1000 to fill out the bottom.

[FirstReflect]

Okey dokey! Good to know!

I will certainly defer to Dave on this matter; he knows far better than I when it comes to the Sierra-2's design regarding the porting!

[davef]

I am thoroughly impressed with the Sierra-2. If I ever need another pair of bookshelves, I'll purchase another pair. My only wish is that I wish it were front-ported like the Salk Sound SILK bookshelf. I understand that the rear ported cabinet from the original Sierra had to be preserved. But make a front ported version with a slit-like port (similar to the port on the Horizon) and I'd buy another pair.

Very happy to hear that you have been enjoying the Sierra-2!!!

I actually built some front slot port sample cabinets a while back -- even posted some pictures of them. After thorough evaluation, bass performance was compromised by this design. There was just no way to make the slot port with enough area with the tuning required that would allow for uninhibited air-flow of the rather exceptional movement the S2 woofer is capable of. The cabinet would have to be quite a bit larger, thus changing the overall design and adding additional expense :(

See here:
http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/showthread.php?4978-Sierra-2-Development-Thread&p=44382#post44382

Sorry :)

[bkdc]

Thanks for the input, Dave. Did you ever think about moving the woofer mount higher so that the tweeter and woofer mounts are almost in contact (As they are arranged on the Sierra Tower) so that there is more space at the bottom for a round port? I don't know much about speaker design but I was thinking this would be the only way to front-port on the current cabinets.

[curtis]

Thanks for the input, Dave. Did you ever think about moving the woofer mount higher so that the tweeter and woofer mounts are almost in contact (As they are arranged on the Sierra Tower) so that there is more space at the bottom for a round port? I don't know much about speaker design but I was thinking this would be the only way to front-port on the current cabinets.
Still don't think there would be enough space for a front port.

[JustABrah]

My Sierra 2s are pretty close to the wall and performance out of them is outstanding, I personally like the rear ported design as it cleans up the front, my only wish is that it had magnet grills to clean up the holes for the grill. This isn't a big deal though cause my next LCR of S2s will be ordered without grills for my front 3 :) why cover up the woofer and this beauty raal tweeter? The raal tweeter looks really cool in the dark cause you can see the silver a little bit when the grills are off. Still amazed with these speakers, movies, tv, music all sound crazy good, like scary good, when watching the walking dead it freaks the **** out of me sometimes cause the zombies sound like their in the room, or watching house of cards every time the door shuts in the show it shoguns like a door shut in my room, the weight and just realist sound to it tricks me way too much.

[sunlight99]

Is S2 good for near field listening? my room is 11' and the distance between the speakers and listening spot is likely to be 5-7'.
And how do you like the S2 with classical music / movies?

[bkdc]

I was using my Sierra 2 for near field monitoring for a while. At low volumes, they're great. But at higher volumes, it's like wearing headphones with kick. I can feel my eardrums moving with the air displacement. My Sierra-1 NrT has moved to my computer speaker near-field duty, and the Sierra-2's are now serving as normal bookshelf duty. You can't go wrong with the Sierra-2 for classical.

[sunlight99]

Thanks, I figure if I go with s2 instead of s2 I can only afford a budget amp (but can be upgraded later), what do people recommend for a $300-400 amp? Since it's for near field, quality is more important than power.

[davef]

Is S2 good for near field listening? my room is 11' and the distance between the speakers and listening spot is likely to be 5-7'.
And how do you like the S2 with classical music / movies?

The S2's are excellent for near field listening. I do at least half of my listening of the two's near field. That stated, near field is considered less than 1 meter away from the speaker -- at 5-7' distance, you are in what I would consider the standard listening distance of the speaker.

[davef]

I was using my Sierra 2 for near field monitoring for a while. At low volumes, they're great. But at higher volumes, it's like wearing headphones with kick. I can feel my eardrums moving with the air displacement. My Sierra-1 NrT has moved to my computer speaker near-field duty, and the Sierra-2's are now serving as normal bookshelf duty. You can't go wrong with the Sierra-2 for classical.

Interesting, are you saying that with the two's -- you noticed more air displacement thus pressurizing your ears a bit more than say the Sierra-1 NrT? That would be somewhat odd, since it is directly related to volume level.

[ematthews]

Dave
Can you suggest any integrated amps or pre/amps that may match very good with the Sierra's 2's? I sold off my Emotiva gear, as I thought they were a little bright sounding with the Ascends.. I prefer a little warmer less harsh sound. budget around 2 grand

[natetg57]

Interesting, are you saying that with the two's -- you noticed more air displacement thus pressurizing your ears a bit more than say the Sierra-1 NrT? That would be somewhat odd, since it is directly related to volume level.

I don't know if it's air displacement but to me, the midrange seems more palpable with more impact with the 2's.

[bkdc]

Interesting, are you saying that with the two's -- you noticed more air displacement thus pressurizing your ears a bit more than say the Sierra-1 NrT? That would be somewhat odd, since it is directly related to volume level.


It's an issue with near field monitoring using any quality speaker. It's a sensation that I never feel when the speakers are far from me, but it's the same sensation as I feel if I'm wearing headphones. When I turn up the volume, I can feel the punchiness as the waves drive my eardrums. For some reason, I feel it more with the Sierra-2, but the Sierra-2 SOUNDS better when used as a near field monitor. I might just be hallucinating.

The Sierra-2 makes a great nearfield monitor. But when I'm turning up the volume, it almost feels like I'm wearing quality cans.

I tried moving the Sierra-2 to rear monitor duty in a 5.2 SACD setup, and OMG. Even with the less important rear channels, there's something to be said for timbre matching those awesome RAAL tweeters. Classical choral music never sounded so good. Too bad my my Sierra Tower color doesn't match my Sierra-2's. LOL.

[picasso]

dave
can you suggest any integrated amps or pre/amps that may match very good with the sierra's 2's? I sold off my emotiva gear, as i thought they were a little bright sounding with the ascends.. I prefer a little warmer less harsh sound. Budget around 2 grand

rotel

[smurraybhm]

Not to jump in on your question to Dave, but you do know that amps in regards to "sound" are indistinguishable from each other, assuming you are not using some type of room correction system that may be offered with a pre. If you truly feel you are one in a million in your ability to tell the difference I would suggest switching to a D class amp - I believe the Emotivas are A/B. A D class amp maker that is well thought of and similar in pricing to Emotiva is Outlaw. Otherwise I would recommend a good receiver like the Denon 4520 that has plenty of power to drive 9 channels and offers Audyssey XT32 with sub EQ. I use a Denon 4311 and my Sierra 2s sound great (and anything but bright) with room correction in use or without it.

[ematthews]

Not to jump in on your question to Dave, but you do know that amps in regards to "sound" are indistinguishable from each other, assuming you are not using some type of room correction system that may be offered with a pre. If you truly feel you are one in a million in your ability to tell the difference I would suggest switching to a D class amp - I believe the Emotivas are A/B. A D class amp maker that is well thought of and similar in pricing to Emotiva is Outlaw. Otherwise I would recommend a good receiver like the Denon 4520 that has plenty of power to drive 9 channels and offers Audyssey XT32 with sub EQ. I use a Denon 4311 and my Sierra 2s sound great (and anything but bright) with room correction in use or without it.

Guess I am one in a million.;) This set up is for 2.1 audio only. I wouldn't be using any room correction with this set up. As for being able to tell a difference. The Emotiva gear was a bit more harsh than my Marantz gear. I am NOT sure if it was the amp or the pre that made a difference. I know that all SS Amps are supposed to sound exactly the same. If so, then something else in the path changes the sound to my ears... And I did a blind test with both as well. I will most likely go Tube this time around like Primaluna.

[davef]

I don't know if it's air displacement but to me, the midrange seems more palpable with more impact with the 2's.


It's an issue with near field monitoring using any quality speaker. It's a sensation that I never feel when the speakers are far from me, but it's the same sensation as I feel if I'm wearing headphones. When I turn up the volume, I can feel the punchiness as the waves drive my eardrums. For some reason, I feel it more with the Sierra-2, but the Sierra-2 SOUNDS better when used as a near field monitor. I might just be hallucinating.

The Sierra-2 makes a great nearfield monitor. But when I'm turning up the volume, it almost feels like I'm wearing quality cans.

I tried moving the Sierra-2 to rear monitor duty in a 5.2 SACD setup, and OMG. Even with the less important rear channels, there's something to be said for timbre matching those awesome RAAL tweeters. Classical choral music never sounded so good. Too bad my my Sierra Tower color doesn't match my Sierra-2's. LOL.

I suspect it could be due to the much faster acceleration time of the ribbon, combined with the larger radiating surface area.

[davef]

Thanks for the input, Dave. Did you ever think about moving the woofer mount higher so that the tweeter and woofer mounts are almost in contact (As they are arranged on the Sierra Tower) so that there is more space at the bottom for a round port? I don't know much about speaker design but I was thinking this would be the only way to front-port on the current cabinets.

Sorry I missed this...

A round and properly flared port tube on the front baffle would require quite a bit more baffle space. To keep the tuning the same (which is critical), the overall dimensions of the cabinet would have to change, which would also require changes to the crossover's baffle compensation. It is quite complex to get it right and even with that, the changes in the baffle would result in changes to the off-axis response such that this front ported cabinet would not sound exactly like the rear ported version.

In addition, through many years of evaluation, I find rear porting has performance benefits over front porting... Two of the biggest ones are that port noise is masked with rear porting and with front porting, you end up with an inevitable large "hole" in the front baffle where sound waves enter, bounce around and come back out resulting in response and phase anomalies that are nearly completely avoided with rear porting. Keep in mind that sound waves travel along the surface of the cabinet...

[duvallite]

Just now decided to join the Ascend forums. After reading all of the great comments everywhere on all of the Sierra models, I will likely be springing for a pair of the Sierra-2s hopefully fairly soon, for a music only system I'm putting together. I'll be using a Rogue Sphinx integrated hybrid to drive them for use primarily with vinyl for now, but also some CDs. The room is carpeted and 11x13. Any recommendations for speaker cables that might work well with this combination, $350 or less? What about ICs also? I like rich, clear sound, listening to 70s & 80s pop & rock, jazz, Motown, and some country.

[ematthews]

Just now decided to join the Ascend forums. After reading all of the great comments everywhere on all of the Sierra models, I will likely be springing for a pair of the Sierra-2s hopefully fairly soon, for a music only system I'm putting together. I'll be using a Rogue Sphinx integrated hybrid to drive them for use primarily with vinyl for now, but also some CDs. The room is carpeted and 11x13. Any recommendations for speaker cables that might work well with this combination, $350 or less? What about ICs also? I like rich, clear sound, listening to 70s & 80s pop & rock, jazz, Motown, and some country.

Blue Jeans cables make some of the best speaker cables around for a great price. Check them out. I just had them make some 8ft length with welded connectors for less than 80 bucks.. I get all of my wires from them.

[bkdc]

If you want to pay for snake oil expensive speaker cables, it's your money. Just buy oxygen-free copper cables. I'd recommend 14-gauge, but given that room size you can get away with 16-gauge and not notice any issues. For a pair of speaker wires in a 11 x 13 room, you should NOT be paying more than 50 dollars.

I made my own cables using Belden 5100UP 14-gauge paired wire -- the same stuff Blue Jeans Cable uses. Bulk wire is 30-some cents per foot. And then a few bucks more for whatever connectors you want to use (spade, banana plugs) but bare wire is best (and cheapest)

I can say the same about interconnects, but there's a big market for overpriced cables in this country. I buy quality wires (Mogami usually) and ends (usually Neutrik) and make them myself. Anything that sounds better ('smoother' etc) is usually not transparent, but rather introducing distortion.

[markie]

Just now decided to join the Ascend forums. After reading all of the great comments everywhere on all of the Sierra models, I will likely be springing for a pair of the Sierra-2s hopefully fairly soon, for a music only system I'm putting together. I'll be using a Rogue Sphinx integrated hybrid to drive them for use primarily with vinyl for now, but also some CDs. The room is carpeted and 11x13. Any recommendations for speaker cables that might work well with this combination, $350 or less? What about ICs also? I like rich, clear sound, listening to 70s & 80s pop & rock, jazz, Motown, and some country.

Welcome to the forum duvallite!

Awesome choice in integrated amp! For budget cables, I second Eric's recommendation for the blue jeans cables, and if you want to save even more on cost and put more work into it like bkdc, his recommendation is good.

Cables do make a difference. If you want to go a definite step up the ladder of performance, imo it would be hard to beat Anticables for value, both cables and interconnects. No doubt there are others of good value, but from my reading over the years the Anticables seem to have made the biggest surprise-impression on those who experiment with cables. Please keep us posted on your choices!

Mark

[petmotel]

Welcome to the forum duvallite!

Awesome choice in integrated amp! For budget cables, I second Eric's recommendation for the blue jeans cables, and if you want to save even more on cost and put more work into it like bkdc, his recommendation is good.

Cables do make a difference. If you want to go a definite step up the ladder of performance, imo it would be hard to beat Anticables for value, both cables and interconnects. No doubt there are others of good value, but from my reading over the years the Anticables seem to have made the biggest surprise-impression on those who experiment with cables. Please keep us posted on your choices!

Mark

Markie, in a different thread you mentioned that you have not yet heard a pair of Sierra-2s. I'm curious as to whether or not you actually own any Ascend Acoustics products, and if so which ones.

I would also like to ask you, in the interests of transparency, if you are involved in any manner with the sale, or distribution of audio equipment.

Thanks in advance,
Jay

[markie]

No I don't yet own any Ascend products, nor have I heard any. But I know from reports that they are good, and I believe the reports.

I am involved in the distribution of audio equipment. For instance in the last week I helped my 86 year old father in law get a $100 turntable, a $250 stereo receiver with phono input, and a $15 driver belt for an old turntable that stopped working. :D Other than that, not much!

Mark

[petmotel]

No I don't yet own any Ascend products, nor have I heard any. But I know from reports that they are good, and I believe the reports.

I am involved in the distribution of audio equipment. For instance in the last week I helped my 86 year old father in law get a $100 turntable, a $250 stereo receiver with phono input, and a $15 driver belt for an old turntable that stopped working. :D Other than that, not much!

Mark

So kind of you to magnanimously endow us with your considerable "knowledge" for the past 5 years without even having heard any of Ascend's speakers. Interesting that you would feel comfortable suggesting compatible components for a speaker you've not heard.

I'm still curious about the reason why you continue to spread misinformation on this forum such as the cable nonsense, but I suppose you must have your reasons. Surely you must be able to find a forum more open to the "audiophoolery" you subscribe to.

Note: The thread topic here pertains to "New Sierra-2 Impressions", do you not think it might be a touch more logical to actually own, or at least have listened to a pair before commenting about them, or their supporting hardware?

Jay

[billy p]

I for one don't prescribe to the notion that you must own said products in order to be a valuable contributor to any forum. I know you two have some history on varied options of all things audio related. Most of us in this hobby likely have a good understanding where some of these myths lie...some truly believe they exist & others don't.

[Beave]

With all due respect, Jay, I for one know that cables make a HUGE difference in my system.

Without them, it doesn't sound very good at all. But with them? Oh, it's wonderful.

:)

[petmotel]

I for one don't prescribe to the notion that you must own said products in order to be a valuable contributor to any forum. I know you two have some history on varied options of all things audio related. Most of us in this hobby likely have a good understanding where some of these myths lie...some truly believe they exist & others don't.

There are plenty of topics here I would be inclined to agree with your opinion. OTOH, when someone asks about a product I have no first hand knowledge of, it seems prudent to let someone else with knowledge of said product to answer.

In a different thread, Mark comments about how a competing speaker compares with the Sierra Towers, again without having even heard the Towers. I find the whole notion ludicrous, but maybe that's just me.

There are also some subjects in audio that are open to "opinion", cables are not one of them. It is a well known fact to anyone with any credibility that the properties of a conductor are well known and documented beyond any interpretation. Any other viewpoint is not opinion, it's absurdity.

Jay

[smurraybhm]

With all due respect, Jay, I for one know that cables make a HUGE difference in my system.

Without them, it doesn't sound very good at all. But with them? Oh, it's wonderful.

:)

It's called bias - you buy something more expensive and expectation takes over for reality. A true blind a/b would demo said bias. No study has ever shown that a Monoprice, Blue Jean or less expensive cables to be inferior to cables costing more. Sorry but this is bull crap - and discussed to death on every audio forum out there. There are much better ways to spend your $ that will actually result in measurable improvements.

[petmotel]

It's called bias - you buy something more expensive and expectation takes over for reality. A true blind a/b would demo said bias. No study has ever shown that a Monoprice, Blue Jean or less expensive cables to be inferior to cables costing more. Sorry but this is bull crap - and discussed to death on every audio forum out there. There are much better ways to spend your $ that will actually result in measurable improvements.

I'm pretty sure Beave agrees with me, he is being sarcastic. Yeah, a system doesn't sound so good without ANY cables LOL!

Jay

[Beave]

It's called bias - you buy something more expensive and expectation takes over for reality. A true blind a/b would demo said bias. No study has ever shown that a Monoprice, Blue Jean or less expensive cables to be inferior to cables costing more. Sorry but this is bull crap - and discussed to death on every audio forum out there. There are much better ways to spend your $ that will actually result in measurable improvements.

I'll gladly take - and pass - any double-blind A/B you want comparing cables to no cables.

By the way, read before you rant next time. :rolleyes:

[bkdc]

I'll gladly take - and pass - any double-blind A/B you want comparing cables to no cables.

By the way, read before you rant next time. :rolleyes:

LOL. I think he missed your sarcasm. But there's plenty of people in the audiophile community who believe that their ears are among the one in thousands that can perceive differences between two identical sounds. That's psychoacoustics for you. Engineering and science is another matter.

I'll take a pair of unshielded 14-gauge oxygen-free copper cables for my speaker wire any day over a bi-wired (4 strands) of the same 14-gauge oxygen-free copper cable (2 strands per terminal) for any run under 40 feet. What you gain in decreased resistance you would probably lose in increased capacitance, but the differences would not be audible. I'm a fan of the Blue Jeans Cable keep-it-simple design.

But seriously. You can buy 100 feet of 12-gauge Beldon 5000UP paired speaker wire for 80 dollars plus shipping. If you truly believe that 12-gauge is better than 14-gauge or 16-gauge for a 10 or 20 foot run of speaker wire (the difference is NOT audible), you can save yourself a lot of money by just running the wire and using bare copper ends for your termination. A good paired 12-gauge speaker cable should run you less than a dollar per foot. If your speaker wires are only 10 feet long, you don't need anything more than 16-gauge copper wire unless you are driving massive current into a 2-ohm speaker. Don't pay more. :)

[smurraybhm]

I'll gladly take - and pass - any double-blind A/B you want comparing cables to no cables.

By the way, read before you rant next time. :rolleyes:

Whoops - my bad. I have spent too much time on AVS lately where they will even rant about the font you use in your posts and it's tax time. Plus I keep waiting on an email telling me my Horizon has shipped. Come on Dave, how about some good news during tax week. 14 weeks and waiting - patiently - sort of. :)

[merrymaid520]

I can finally write my impressions of the S2's! I have had them for over a week now and they are excellent as expected. With our 6 month old, my listening time has been very limited. I was only able to A/B them with my RAAL Towers for a short period before I threw them up on my wall mounts (as surrounds).

As I stated in a separate thread, My fronts are crossed over around 80hz so I only focused on the highs and mids. To me, the mids were fuller with more "weight" on the Towers. I used some well recorded guitar tracks and the plucking seemed to stand out more on the Towers if that makes sense. The highs on both were identical to my ears. Sorry I cannot comment more on the lows, I just didn't have the time. They did sound tight and punchy though!

As surrounds, the S2's sound great! With movies, the difference from my original sierras is minimal but with MCH music, its a nice improvement. I was, on some tracks able to hear some timbre differences when certain music traveled around the room, now its completely seamless. The S2's blend exceptionally well with the RAAL Towers for this application. I bought them not expecting a night and day difference. Its subtle on most material, but worth it if ones into MCH music. I have gotten into Steven Wilsons stuff as of late, cool tracks!

Now with RAALs all around (Horizon RAAL center too), I cannot foresee making any speaker changes for quite some time.

Thanks Dave, well done.

[JustABrah]

What are you using for subs merrymaid?

[merrymaid520]

What are you using for subs merrymaid?

Dual 15" Rythmiks.

[JustABrah]

Dual 15" Rythmiks.

Sealed? What models and how you like them?

[merrymaid520]

Sealed? What models and how you like them?

One d15se and a E15hp both sealed of course. Someday I'll sell one to get a matching pair. I like the form factor of the E better.
I love them. I've heard many subs before and these are some of the most articulate subs you can buy!

[JustABrah]

One d15se and a E15hp both sealed of course. Someday I'll sell one to get a matching pair. I like the form factor of the E better.
I love them. I've heard many subs before and these are some of the most articulate subs you can buy!

Does it sound too lean for movies? gives you that chest thumping bass? I'm looking at buying the E15, you get the PB to match your speakers?

[merrymaid520]

Does it sound too lean for movies? gives you that chest thumping bass? I'm looking at buying the E15, you get the PB to match your speakers?

I don't feel it lacks during movies. They hit hard and deep in my room, both are EQd flat. They may not have the output some ported subs posess, but impressive nonetheless.

Piano black throughout!

[JustABrah]

I don't feel it lacks during movies. They hit hard and deep in my room, both are EQd flat. They may not have the output some ported subs posess, but impressive nonetheless.

Piano black throughout!

Yeah, I'm leaning toward the E15 in PB, how well does it match up to the Sierra-2 PB?

[merrymaid520]

Yeah, I'm leaning toward the E15 in PB, how well does it match up to the Sierra-2 PB?

Finish wise, they all match very well. Not perfect but extremely close.

[JustABrah]

Thanks a lot merrymaid

[jahjd2000]

Thanks a lot merrymaid

Oh that's why you were asking if I received my E15 in the AVS thread. I should be getting mine early next week.

Just a heads up, Dina stated today that Rythmik will no longer be making the E15 in black oak and the sale on the black matte will be expiring really soon. A moot point since you're looking for PB, but these two moves could create more demand for the PB.

[JustABrah]

Oh that's why you were asking if I received my E15 in the AVS thread. I should be getting mine early next week.

Just a heads up, Dina stated today that Rythmik will no longer be making the E15 in black oak and the sale on the black matte will be expiring really soon. A moot point since you're looking for PB, but these two moves could create more demand for the PB.

Yeah, I'm torn between the E15 and the SB13 Ultra, should be buying one of them next week. Thanks for the heads up I was also considering the oak, I wonder why their cutting it out of the line up. Give us a update when you get your new toys.

[jahjd2000]

Yeah, I'm torn between the E15 and the SB13 Ultra, should be buying one of them next week. Thanks for the heads up I was also considering the oak, I wonder why their cutting it out of the line up. Give us a update when you get your new toys.

I saw that you were interested in how it fares with HT. My Empire is a HT monster in my space so I have a good point of comparison. I'll let you know how it does--if I forget feel free to PM me.

Also, I take it you read Jim Wilson's review of the E15HP vs. SB13-U?

[JustABrah]

I saw that you were interested in how it fares with HT. My Empire is a HT monster in my space so I have a good point of comparison. I'll let you know how it does--if I forget feel free to PM me.

Also, I take it you read Jim Wilson's review of the E15HP vs. SB13-U?

I did read Jims review and I'm pretty sure I'm going with the E15 after reading that, could you upload pics when you get it? I want to see how the E15 looks in the black matte finish.

[jahjd2000]

I did read Jims review and I'm pretty sure I'm going with the E15 after reading that, could you upload pics when you get it? I want to see how the E15 looks in the black matte finish.

I'll definitely snap some pictures. I too was curious how the matte finished looked. I found a few good pictures on the Rythmik thread over at AVS.

[Mag_Neato]

All these impressions of the Rythmik in the Sierra-2 thread? What gives?

[jahjd2000]

All these impressions of the Rythmik in the Sierra-2 thread? What gives?

The Sierra-2s dig so deep people are confusing them with Ryhmik subs :).

[ematthews]

The Sierra-2s dig so deep people are confusing them with Ryhmik subs :).

Ha... Not! Even though I listen to my 2's without my Rrthmik sometimes, there is no substitute for the F12..
On a funny note. I put my old Klipsch RF82's in my audio system yesterday to compare them with my Sierra 2's.... Holy crap they were awful.. I really couldn't get through 2 songs... Would really love to add a full Ascend set up to replace the Klipsch in the TV room.

[petmotel]

Ha... Not! Even though I listen to my 2's without my Rrthmik sometimes, there is no substitute for the F12..
On a funny note. I put my old Klipsch RF82's in my audio system yesterday to compare them with my Sierra 2's.... Holy crap they were awful.. I really couldn't get through 2 songs... Would really love to add a full Ascend set up to replace the Klipsch in the TV room.

I thought my Sierra-1NRTs were amazing, they were a huge amount better than the Mirage towers they replaced. After comparing the Sierra-1NRT, and Twos it was readily apparent the new speakers trumped the already fabulous originals in every area. Accuracy, linearity, and transient response all perform at a higher level than my NRTs.

I must also mention that after having listened to my RAAL equipped Sierra Towers/ Horizon for quite a while now, I'm spoiled with the high end the ribbons provide. I don't think I could ever be happy again with a dome type tweeter, the RAALs really are exquisite! Even with the Sierra-2s used as surrounds, with multi-channel surround music, the difference is quite noticeable on some material.

I think that anyone buying the Sierra-2s for a movie set-up will probably end up listening to a lot more music through them. Also, they will likely be looking for high quality recordings, because these speakers just sound increasingly better with the quality of the source material (and conversely, poor recordings are stripped bare as well).

Jay

[markie]

Ha... Not! Even though I listen to my 2's without my Rrthmik sometimes, there is no substitute for the F12..
On a funny note. I put my old Klipsch RF82's in my audio system yesterday to compare them with my Sierra 2's.... Holy crap they were awful.. I really couldn't get through 2 songs... Would really love to add a full Ascend set up to replace the Klipsch in the TV room.

This is an important facet of evaluating speakers. Hearing excellent, higher end speakers for a prolonged period of time gives one special insight into the specific faults of lesser speakers, given the same room and equipment. But if one has not heard higher end speakers, the lesser speakers sound pretty fine!

Jay talks about the improved "accuracy, linearity, and transient response" of the Sierra 2s, and no doubt measurements show this. But it is the overall *feeling*, the emotional connection to the music, which speakers should be facilitating to the greatest degree. One wants to keep listening and listening. Some speakers seem to measure well, but are not engaging. (Why?) With the Sierra 2, they measure extremely well *and* they just pull you in, say those who has listened to the beautiful beasties.

Mark

[curtis]

This is an important facet of evaluating speakers. Hearing excellent, higher end speakers for a prolonged period of time gives one special insight into the specific faults of lesser speakers, given the same room and equipment. But if one has not heard higher end speakers, the lesser speakers sound pretty fine!

Jay talks about the improved "accuracy, linearity, and transient response" of the Sierra 2s, and no doubt measurements show this. But it is the overall *feeling*, the emotional connection to the music, which speakers should be facilitating to the greatest degree. One wants to keep listening and listening. Some speakers seem to measure well, but are not engaging. (Why?) With the Sierra 2, they measure extremely well *and* they just pull you in, say those who has listened to the beautiful beasties.

IMO, making the music engaging is the job of the artist and recording engineers. The speaker's job is to convey what they intended.

[petmotel]

IMO, making the music engaging is the job of the artist and recording engineers. The speaker's job is to convey what they intended.

I couldn't agree more, and in fact, adding the linearity, and transient response, is just a redundancy to the accuracy part of my comment. A more accurate speaker will be more linear (both on, and off axis), and have better transient performance as compared to a lesser speaker.

Curtis, have you made the transition to the Twos yet? I know you were hoping to get the speakers with your tax refund, hope that went well!

Jay

[markie]

IMO, making the music engaging is the job of the artist and recording engineers. The speaker's job is to convey what they intended.

I agree. Some might call that 'transparency'. That word has a good connotation.

But I've heard that (for instance) presumably accurate studio monitors can have a tendency to present the music in an 'analytical', 'sterile', 'dry', or 'lifeless' manner. This would contrast with speakers that have been reported to present music in a 'coherent', 'rhythmic', 'energizing', 'toe tapping' manner. I've listened to speakers that seemed to have all the 'information' there, but I had a 'meh' response to it. Hard to put my finger on what was wrong. Maybe it was just me :)

Mark

[davef]

I agree. Some might call that 'transparency'. That word has a good connotation.

But I've heard that (for instance) presumably accurate studio monitors can have a tendency to present the music in an 'analytical', 'sterile', 'dry', or 'lifeless' manner. This would contrast with speakers that have been reported to present music in a 'coherent', 'rhythmic', 'energizing', 'toe tapping' manner. I've listened to speakers that seemed to have all the 'information' there, but I had a 'meh' response to it. Hard to put my finger on what was wrong. Maybe it was just me :)

Mark

Studio Monitors tend to focus only on the on-axis response... What we hear when we listen in a typical environment is a combination of the direct sound (on-axis response only) combined with the indirect (typically 1st, 2nd and even 3rd reflections). Some believe we hear more of the indirect sound than direct sound.

[curtis]

Curtis, have you made the transition to the Twos yet? I know you were hoping to get the speakers with your tax refund, hope that went well!

Not yet Jay. I know Dave/Ascend is back up with orders. I got my tax refund, spend some of it on stuff for the kids. I'll get my turn soon! I need to decide between domestic black bamboo or overseas natural.

I think I have ruled out upgrading my current Sierra-1's. They were the second production trio sold, as nice as they are, the production cabinets are even nicer now.

[steveting99]

Guys,

Reading through the thread, Dave doesn't recommend plugging the port at the back. For those who have the Sierra 2, what is the recommended distance away from the walls/corners using the back of the speaker as the reference? What about the side wall?

Thanks.

[natetg57]

Guys,

Reading through the thread, Dave doesn't recommend plugging the port at the back. For those who have the Sierra 2, what is the recommended distance away from the walls/corners using the back of the speaker as the reference? What about the side wall?

Thanks.
If using the Sierra-2 with a sub and crossover, you could probably get away with the speakers only a few inches away from the wall. If they are run full range, I think you'd want at least a foot. Dave said the q-plugs probably wouldn't be needed. But it wouldn't be bad to try them to see if it'd help with your particular setup.

[davef]

Guys,

Reading through the thread, Dave doesn't recommend plugging the port at the back. For those who have the Sierra 2, what is the recommended distance away from the walls/corners using the back of the speaker as the reference? What about the side wall?

Thanks.

We don't actually have a formal recommendation for this as there are just too many variables involved. That said, if using the Sierra-2 full range, 6 inches or more from the wall behind them is ideal. Or, if you prefer a bit more bass reinforcement, just move them closer to the wall.

It all comes down to personal preference.

[duvallite]

I've narrowed my search for dedicated music speakers down to the Sierra-2, Nola Boxer, and Reference 3A Dulcet, using a Rogue Sphinx to drive them. They all seem to get great reviews, are well liked, and pricing is very close. Are the Sierra-2s better, and has anyone here heard the Boxers and/or the Dulcets and can give an opinion as to how they sound and compare to the Sierra-2? No chance to hear any of them myself beforehand, so I'll likely be buying blind. Thanks.

[Macddmac]

I've narrowed my search for dedicated music speakers down to the Sierra-2, Nola Boxer, and Reference 3A Dulcet, using a Rogue Sphinx to drive them. They all seem to get great reviews, are well liked, and pricing is very close. Are the Sierra-2s better, and has anyone here heard the Boxers and/or the Dulcets and can give an opinion as to how they sound and compare to the Sierra-2? No chance to hear any of them myself beforehand, so I'll likely be buying blind. Thanks.

Not sure if you're able to return the Boxers or Dulcet's but you definitely can the S2's.
I'd start with the Ascends, and take it from there, although I doubt you'll return them.
I've never heard the Sierra 2's but I have the 1's and they're the best standmount speaker I have experienced under 2k with the exception of the LS50 which IMO are a dead-heat with the ones.
Cheers, Mac

[markie]

I've narrowed my search for dedicated music speakers down to the Sierra-2, Nola Boxer, and Reference 3A Dulcet, using a Rogue Sphinx to drive them. They all seem to get great reviews, are well liked, and pricing is very close. Are the Sierra-2s better, and has anyone here heard the Boxers and/or the Dulcets and can give an opinion as to how they sound and compare to the Sierra-2? No chance to hear any of them myself beforehand, so I'll likely be buying blind. Thanks.

All very good speakers. I would *love* to hear them all in the same room together. As it is, I haven't even heard one of them.

I've heard larger, open backed Nola speakers and they were very good, although not a 'wow' for me personally, at that time, in that room. :) I think the high frequencies of the Nola's, in general, won't draw attention with any oohhs and aahhs. But the highs of the Sierra 2's would be more stand out, in a very good way.

The Dulcet's I've only heard about. They are manufactured less than an hour drive away from Toronto where I live. Amazingly they lack a crossover(?) so the frequency response may not be the most even. They are very direct and lively sounding. Foot tapping. Although they are dynamic they can't be played too loudly as they can tend to get a honky sound so I've heard.

The Boxers and Dulcet are great for tone and texture and capturing very well the real sound of various instruments. I don't recall comments on the Sierra 2 about that aspect and would welcome insights from owners of the Sierra 2 about this.

Interestingly people who own the Boxers and Dulcet generally have more upscale electronics costing much more than the speakers.

In short: What monitor among the three give the most rich, yet clear, sound? (Something you indicated you valued in your first post.) I wish I knew! There is another monitor called the Clue which retails for around the same price. It is known for a rich and full type of sound, with oodles of bass, because it is meant to go right up against a wall and utilize wall reinforcement. But I don't know how clear or clean sounding it is.

Please let us know how things turn out!

Mark

[davef]

I've narrowed my search for dedicated music speakers down to the Sierra-2, Nola Boxer, and Reference 3A Dulcet, using a Rogue Sphinx to drive them. They all seem to get great reviews, are well liked, and pricing is very close. Are the Sierra-2s better, and has anyone here heard the Boxers and/or the Dulcets and can give an opinion as to how they sound and compare to the Sierra-2? No chance to hear any of them myself beforehand, so I'll likely be buying blind. Thanks.

I hope this doesn't come across as a negative towards the Boxer or the Dulcet, but both of these speakers are better compared to our Sierra-1 than our Sierra-2. Try not to use retail price as any indication of what should be compared to what :)

[steveting99]

Dave,

Thank you for the reply.

Wanted to ask about THD measurement for the Sierra-2. Would it be possible to disclose this and include this as part of the measurement section for the speaker? The reason I ask is that not many speaker manufacturers' are willing to disclose this information as it might give the impression that distortion / coloration numbers might put off some buyers. What I'll be interested in is the THD curve that's easily available from REW.

Another general question if you would please. If I cross over the Sierra-2 at say 80Hz to the sub woofer, how much power is being saved at the Seirra-2? What I understand is that producing the bass takes the most amount of power, while the mids and high frequencies requires less. Is there a general rule of thumb that can be used for power split between the bass:mid/high frequencies, such as 3:1 in dB/W/m unit? I believe it'll be crossover frequency dependent. What I'm trying to determine is of a smaller amp + sub woofer is sufficient.

[davef]

Dave,

Thank you for the reply.

Wanted to ask about THD measurement for the Sierra-2. Would it be possible to disclose this and include this as part of the measurement section for the speaker? The reason I ask is that not many speaker manufacturers' are willing to disclose this information as it might give the impression that distortion / coloration numbers might put off some buyers. What I'll be interested in is the THD curve that's easily available from REW.

It is not that manufacturer’s aren’t willing to disclose this info, it is that it is a rather meaningless measurement and offers no insight to the way a loudspeaker sounds. THD under 1% is inaudible, and even most mediocre loudspeakers have THD well below this level within their stated bandwidth and power handling specifications.

In addition, you can not compare one manufacturer’s THD measurements of a loudspeaker with another, unless using the exact same equipment and driving level.

For example, with REW – How much of the THD measured is generated by the soundcard? How much THD is caused by the PC itself? (noise / RFI / any other type of interference will also show up as THD) What drive level are you using? Certainly a soundcard amplifier is not truly capable of driving a hi-fi loudspeaker, so ideally you should be using the line-out of the sound card into an amplifier to drive the speaker. In this case, how much of the THD is generated by the amp? Every single component in the chain will generate THD that will be reproduced by the speaker and show up in the measurement. So while you think you are measuring the THD of the loudspeaker, you are actually measuring the THD of the entire system…

Properly measuring THD requires considerably more sophisticated measurement gear and loop-back reference measurements must be made.

And finally, but of equal importance, REW uses swept sine waves – which are steady state signals. These are not representative of music or home theater sources. Different types of transducers perform better / worse with steady state signals – such that a particular design performs remarkably well on a sine wave based THD measurement – but yet performs poorly with non steady state sources (multi-tone impulse measurements which is more representative of music) The opposite is also true…






Another general question if you would please. If I cross over the Sierra-2 at say 80Hz to the sub woofer, how much power is being saved at the Seirra-2? What I understand is that producing the bass takes the most amount of power, while the mids and high frequencies requires less. Is there a general rule of thumb that can be used for power split between the bass:mid/high frequencies, such as 3:1 in dB/W/m unit? I believe it'll be crossover frequency dependent. What I'm trying to determine is of a smaller amp + sub woofer is sufficient.

There are just too many variables to answer this question. It completely depends on the source material being played. However, overall wattage requirement for an amp would not change, what changes by crossing over the amp and lessening the bass demand on the amp is available headroom.

Hope this helps!

[steveting99]

Dave,

Thanks for your reply.

Didn't know that THD was such a problematic number to look at.

Using your analysis of the entire sound chain, i.e. source ---> player ---> pre/pro ---> amp ---> speaker ---> room acoustics ---> measurement mic

which adds various levels of THD at each point such that the end measurement is combined error, could the same be said for frequency response say from 20Hz to 20kHz?

Or even the waterfall graph?

I'm trying to understand why such measurements are meaningful while others are not. There will be always be errors in measurement, but what makes say frequency response or decay useful, but THD not so?

[davef]

Dave,

Thanks for your reply.

Didn't know that THD was such a problematic number to look at.

Using your analysis of the entire sound chain, i.e. source ---> player ---> pre/pro ---> amp ---> speaker ---> room acoustics ---> measurement mic

which adds various levels of THD at each point such that the end measurement is combined error, could the same be said for frequency response say from 20Hz to 20kHz?

Or even the waterfall graph?

I'm trying to understand why such measurements are meaningful while others are not. There will be always be errors in measurement, but what makes say frequency response or decay useful, but THD not so?

When taking frequency response measurements, for professional measurement gear like we use, a microphone calibration file is loaded to account for any response deviations in the mic response. The frequency response of the amp is also measured and accounted for in the response measurement. Even if the test gear you are using does not allow this, it is assumed that the amplifier you are using will measure "flat" and nearly all do. What you see in our measurements with regard to frequency response measurements is the speaker only.

The waterfall plots we publish are cumulative spectral decay -- any "decay" in the power amp or any other components in the chain is also accounted for by taking loop back measurements. However, the decay in a power amp is so miniscule that in most cases, for cumulative spectral decay, loop back measurements aren't even necessary.

THD measurements for a loudspeaker, as previously stated, in no way describe how a loudspeaker sounds. If one knows how to interpret frequency response graphs in combination with CSD graphs and off-axis graphs, one can get a very good understanding of how a loudspeaker sounds. For example, I most certainly know how a speaker will sound if it has a 6dB bump in the response at 100Hz as compared to one that does not. If I had two identical speakers and one measured .5% THD and the other measured even .01% THD, I could not tell them apart. Nor could I describe the way a loudspeaker sounds if it had 3% THD.

In addition to this, there are just far too many variables involved to compare THD graphs between loudspeakers unless taken using the exact same equipment and same SPL. And even with that, one speaker may measure an average of 0.5% THD while another might measure 0.1% THD. One speaker would look much better than the other one, but the THD level in either speaker is completely inaudible.

Even in amplifiers and receivers, THD is rather meaningless and mostly used for marketing purposes. THD typically measures quite high in tube amplifiers.

[steveting99]

I'd like to have a listen to the Sierra 2 and would like to know if there's anyone here in Hong Kong who's got a pair and willing to accommodate my request?

[Galaga]

Just want to say I have owned the Sierra-2's for 6 months now and I am still super happy with my decision. Still being surprised by and enjoying the clarity and richness of the sound, especially that high-end cymbal sparkle. Really hard pressed to find any negatives with the speakers and they have really brought some music and memories to life for my wife and I.

[bds0048]

Just want to say I have owned the Sierra-2's for 6 months now and I am still super happy with my decision. Still being surprised by and enjoying the clarity and richness of the sound, especially that high-end cymbal sparkle. Really hard pressed to find any negatives with the speakers and they have really brought some music and memories to life for my wife and I.

That's what I wanna hear! Patiently awaiting my RAAL Towers which will be my first ever hifi purchase.

[18inch]

My Sierra 2s are pretty close to the wall and performance out of them is outstanding, I personally like the rear ported design as it cleans up the front, my only wish is that it had magnet grills to clean up the holes for the grill. This isn't a big deal though cause my next LCR of S2s will be ordered without grills for my front 3 :) why cover up the woofer and this beauty raal tweeter? The raal tweeter looks really cool in the dark cause you can see the silver a little bit when the grills are off. Still amazed with these speakers, movies, tv, music all sound crazy good, like scary good, when watching the walking dead it freaks the **** out of me sometimes cause the zombies sound like their in the room, or watching house of cards every time the door shuts in the show it shoguns like a door shut in my room, the weight and just realist sound to it tricks me way too much.

im sold by lot of praise on the sierra-2 in this thread, but especially this comment loll!! this will def be my next set of speakers in the coming months when the time is right, hopefully before the years end, im fed up of doing research, ascend acoustics wins :D...

can anyone talk more about the mid-bass/mid-range driver? any comparision (dynaudio, b&w). I have a fairly small room and planning on a new diy housing (enclosure) on my currently sealed pair of subs but id like to leave that for next summer and want to run full range without need of subwoofers...

[mde8965]

OK I just wanted to chime in to give my impressions of my new Sierra 2's and Horizon center with RAAL. I have had these for only 3 days now. But I have spent a lot of time with them.

First let me start by saying that I ordered the Sierra 2's to be side surrounds and ordered the Towers with RAAL as my FL and FR. But since the Towers are on backorder I got a chance to replace my front stage with the Sierra 2's and Horizon with RAAL to compare to the speakers they are replacing. Once my Towers come in I will again compare the Sierra 2's as FL and FR to the Towers in the same setup.

The speakers that the Ascends are replacing are Paradigm Studio 100's V1 and a Studio CC570 V3 for the center.

My room is not treated and is fairly small (11' x 17.5' x 7.5'). The floors are wood laminate but there is a large area rug taking up 1/2 the room And lots of furniture too. So its not like an empty room. I use a Denon AVR-4311 and Emotiva XPA-5. Calibration via Audyssey MultiEQ XT32 Music is played either through a Sonos connect (FLAC files) or for SACD/DVD-A and Blu Ray Audio I use my Oppo. I am running a 5.2 system with Paradigm Studio 20's as my surrounds and 2 Rythmik F15 subs.

Problems with the current Studios that prompted the change:
1) Fatiguing to listen to at volume - I wear hearing aids to correct some hearing loss in the upper frequencies related to auto racing and heredity. I consider the Studios to be a bit harsh with their dome tweeter. I know that certain voices and notes on a guitar during rock songs make me cringe. I am extra sensitive to this because my hearing aids amplify upper frequencies. This fact got me to looking at ribbon tweeters.
2) The sound stage is all over the place. I am not good with descriptions, but it almost seems like at times the various instruments and drums and vocals in a song get stirred together in a way that sounds like I am listening to speakers that are inside of a box or something. In movies when something pans left to right and front to back, the movement does to translate right at all at times. I think this all may have something to do with the fact that the 100's are just too big for my room? And lack of room treatments? I have experimented a lot with toe-in and it never seems to do a lot of good. Best was with the speakers directly pointing at my nose.
3) The 100's are big black rectangular monsters. Not particularly nice to look at and too big in my small room. I think they are close to 5' tall.
4) The 100's are old and becoming higher maintenance. They are perfect right now, but had to replace a tweeter in one and a couple of rubber surrounds. Parts are becoming hard to get.
5) I have had these speakers for a few years now, and was itching to upgrade...

The positives about the Ascends:
1) The upper frequencies are "crisp" without being harsh, overly loud. I am not fatigued at all listening to these speakers at fairly close to reference levels. Acoustic guitar plucks are heard so clearly, as are piano keys, cymbals, etc.. But they are not overly "crunchy" or grating like my 100's. I told you I was not good at descriptions. I will not use the term "a veil has been lifted". I hear that too much. I prefer to think about it like this. You know what an LCD TV looks like in the store with the super bright settings that really pop but that look artificial and give you a headache. That was like my 100's with upper frequencies. The Ascends are more like a calibrated Plasma TV. They are not so far out there, and they are more pleasing and real to the ears.
2) They look so sexy. I love the cherry cabinets. You can still see the bamboo grain through them. They look high end. Where the 100's looked...well outdated.
3) The sound stage. After calibration I messed around with toe in a bit. The front speakers are 6' apart and I sit a little over 7' back. I found the best results with just a little bit of toe in. They are not pointed at my face, but about a foot or two outside of me. I was listening to the Doors, LA Woman on multi channel CD. There is one part of the song where Jim Morrison's voice repeats a lyric and it goes from one speaker to another from FL, FR, SL and SR. And it was very easy to track. With my 100's I never got a clear sense of the movement in his voice. The drums sounded like they were coming from behind my TV with the Ascends. With my 100's the drums were just everywhere and somewhere. I would say that the sound stage portrayed by the Ascends in most music is surprisingly large, but accurate or more pin point.
4) I really enjoy a couple of classical CD's I have with these speakers. The sound stage and the "high fidelity" and wow moments I get with various instruments as they are featured, I really cannot say that I enjoyed this type of music that much before. I guess I am saying that the Ascends make me appreciate various genre's and allowing me to broaden my music appreciation.

I am dying to get the Towers so I can replace my Paradigm Studio 20's with the Sierra 2's for my side surrounds. I love the Studio 20's (much more than my 100's), but I feel that having the Ascends all around will enhance the experience that much more.

So in the end I would have to say, if you are on the fence about ordering these, do it. Especially if you prefer less harsh and fatiguing speakers that manage to be less harsh but still super crisp. You will be impressed with the sound stage too especially for bookshelfs.

[markie]

Great write-up, thanks Mike! And yes those Sierra 2's look sexy! I look forward to your next review when you get the Towers, especially how they sound compared to the 2's. Also I'll be interested in any comparison between the 2's and Studio 20's as surrounds.
Mark

[mde8965]

Great write-up, thanks Mike! And yes those Sierra 2's look sexy! I look forward to your next review when you get the Towers, especially how they sound compared to the 2's. Also I'll be interested in any comparison between the 2's and Studio 20's as surrounds.
Mark

Thanks Mark. I can't wait to be able to do that comparison with the Towers and S2's as surrounds. I should note that the lack of me mentioning the mid-bass with the S2's was not an omission. I just really do not feel that it is a fair comparison with my Studio 100's.

However, I will say this. I was listening to Pink Floyd, Black Eyed Peas, and Sara Bareillis and Norah Jones using pure direct mode this morning. And for their size, the mid-bass is truly impressive. It is tight and does not sound strained at all. That says a lot coming from me. I tend to like hot bass (not bloated, but strong clean tight bass - the Rythmik F15 is superb for that). When I run my subs, I run them 5db hot from what Audyssey sets them. and use Auralex Subdudes.

Ive read comments in this thread that say you really don't need a subwoofer with these. I would not go that far. Make no mistake, unless I was listening to these nearfield, I would definitely want a sub to round out or complete the sound picture. But I would definitely say that the mid bass is much tighter and clean (not sloppy in the least) and in terms of volume compares to some towers that I have heard. Amazing given the size.

Compared to my Studio 20's I would say that they both have impressive bass response but in different ways. The S2's are clean and composed with impressive upper to mid bass volume. The Studio 20s seem to go a little bit deeper, but the bass is a little less clean. For me (YMMV) if I did not run a subwoofer, I would pick the Studio 20's if bass were the only factor. But with a sub, I would definitely pick the S2's (again only considering the upper and mid bass characteristics).

Overall given everything, I think the S2's are a better speaker than the Studio 20's. But don't misunderstand I think the Studio 20's are terrific speakers too in their own right. My comparison is with Studio 20's V1 and V2. I have both.

That all said, I can't wait to get my towers which I feel will round out my system even more.

[18inch]

thx for sharing your thoughts ! very cool read