The Tower Discussion Thread!

[davef]

As promised, here are pictures of complete cabinets in the various "black" finish options. I felt creative so I broke out the 'ole Les Paul in order to show the differences in the sheen :)

Hand Rubbed Piano Black:

http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/images/ascenduploads/pblack.jpg

High Gloss Black (90 sheen):

http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/images/ascenduploads/hgblack.jpg

Satin Black (20 sheen):

http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/images/ascenduploads/sblack.jpg

Matte Black (Black Sand Finish, VERY DURABLE!!!):

http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/images/ascenduploads/mblack.jpg

And a shot with all of them:

http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/images/ascenduploads/allblacks2.jpg

From left to right:

Piano Black, High Gloss Black, Satin Black, Matte Black


For easy reference, I will list the introductory prices again:

*Hand Rubbed Piano Black = $2848/pr + shipping (edited to reflect latest pricing)

High Gloss Black = $1998/pr + shipping

Satin Black = $1998/pr + shipping

Matte Black = $1898/pr + shipping

Natural Finish = $1898/pr + shipping

Dark Cherry Satin = $1998/pr + shipping

Espresso Satin = $1998/pr + shipping

*Note: Piano Black is considered a custom finish and will require a non-refundable $950 deposit.


All the finishes look great and emails will be sent out within a few hours confirming finish choices.

Thanks so much for your patience!!!!

[curtis]

Nice!!!

Not bad for an amateur photographer!!

[Mag_Neato]

Thanks Dave! Excellent job!! The pictures really show off the differences in the 4 finishes.

The only thing I'd like to see added is a picture of the natural finish as I really like how my natural Sierra-1 NrT's look.

[steven1110]

Very Nice! Beautiful speakers and the Les Paul was a great way to show the differences. The Piano Black is just gorgeous!

[Jonnyozero3]

Hey Dave,

Love the photos and the finishes.

Curious question - why are the grill peg holes different (lower) on the Piano Black cabinet?

[davef]

Hey Dave,

Love the photos and the finishes.

Curious question - why are the grill peg holes different (lower) on the Piano Black cabinet?

You have good eyes!

These piano black cabinets were our first prototype samples. Based on feedback, we shortened the length of the grill for the final version and it looks much better.

[davef]

Many of you have asked for a picture of the center....

Here are 2 pics of the cabinet construction showing the front slot ports and separate midrange enclosure. As you can see, it is a complicated enclosure but our goal is to precisely match the performance of the Sierra Tower.

The final version should be completed within a week and I will post more pictures then...

http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/images/ascenduploads/stc1.jpg


http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/images/ascenduploads/stc2.jpg

[Sam1000]

Wow.. The Piano Black looks gorgeous.

When do we get to see the other finishes( Espresso and Dark Cherry)..

[scape]

looks great dave! im a big fan of the satin. i can't wait for a product page to show up, displaying all of the specs and features :)
not sure if this was covered, but what kind of placement do you suggest for the towers, specifically the minimum to the behind-wall distance as well the front-seating distance.

[scape]

Many of you have asked for a picture of the center....
...

http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/images/ascenduploads/stc2.jpg

Are those slits along the bottom part of the port? pretty slick! oh and im guessing this center speaker is meant to be flipped if placed below screen?

[markenki]

Looks awesome, Dave! Great photos. The Les Paul is genius.

Is the Black Sand Finish smooth to the touch, or does it have some texture to it?

I love my Sierras but those Towers are so tempting.

Thanks,

Mark

[merrymaid520]

The new finishes look very nice, great choices!

Good news,
The new XO and driver installation went good.....as my luck would have it both these new XO's and the one from my Sierra to sierra Nrt needed new holes drilled since the XO board was a different size. Other than that, all went smooth thanks to my father in law;)

As for the sound, only had about 30 min of quick demoing. I noticed the difference pretty quick. The mids are less "edgy" giving the Tower an overall smoother more refined sound without losing any detail up top or its dynamic nature. An audio analogy I thought of was that the new version gives you more of that "coaxial" sound where everything blends together very well....if that makes sense:p

I will spend more time listening next week when i return, but so far so good. Dave, excellent work on the minor tweaks, I like them:D

Good night folks, been a long day.

Brandon

[markie]

Brandon thanks so much for giving us the scoop on v2 in such a timely manner before you left. And sorry for confusing you with Curtis. Brain glitch :o We're fans of him too...

Great description on the difference between v1 and v2. I hear that the Sierras are smoothies, and it looks like the tower continues with that, and more. :cool:

Mark

[Jonnyozero3]

I didn't know we signed up for a fan club, lol :p J/k

[hearing specialist]

Matte Black for me in regards to all the color choices...and that center channel enclosure is super technical! Just think, the slot venting for a reason, mid enclosure in lower center for a reason, and some pretty sufficient air space and volume for whatever size drivers our masterful creator places in. Thick side and rear walls, and i'd bet a pretty thick baffle to be used. Nothing like an enclosure with thick baffles and a highly advanced crossover design :D



Brian in Bakersfield...

[Mag_Neato]

That looks like a monster! Will the center use the same drivers from the tower? Will the tweeter be vertically above, or below the mid driver? I assume the same woofers will flank the mid-tweeter array.

Still want to see a picture of the towers in natural!;)

[davef]

The only thing I'd like to see added is a picture of the natural finish as I really like how my natural Sierra-1 NrT's look.


When do we get to see the other finishes( Espresso and Dark Cherry)..

I won't be able to post pics of the other finishes until the production run is finished. Please understand that it costs us a small fortune to have our cabinet maker produce a small quantity run of a specific finish. There is a lot of labor involved in the setup and cleanup for applying the various finishes. Think about it this way, which is more cost effective --- painting 10 sq feet of your house each day (and cleaning up after each day) or painting your entire home in one day?

Since the various blacks seem to be the most popular choice at this point and since we felt it was important to document the differences in the blacks prior to customers choosing the finish -- we bit the bullet and did a small run of cabinets.

I will be sure to post pictures of ALL of the finishes once the entire production run is finished but at this point, we can not do any additional small cabinet runs.

Thanks for understanding!

[Mag_Neato]

I won't be able to post pics of the other finishes until the production run is finished. Please understand that it costs us a small fortune to have our cabinet maker produce a small quantity run of a specific finish. There is a lot of labor involved in the setup and cleanup for applying the various finishes. Think about it this way, which is more cost effective --- painting 10 sq feet of your house each day (and cleaning up after each day) or painting your entire home in one day?

Since the various blacks seem to be the most popular choice at this point and since we felt it was important to document the differences in the blacks prior to customers choosing the finish -- we bit the bullet and did a small run of cabinets.

I will be sure to post pictures of ALL of the finishes once the entire production run is finished but at this point, we can not do any additional small cabinet runs.

Thanks for understanding!

Understood completely, Dave. I am just expressing my interest in the natural finish. No pressure!! I get the painting analogy totally as I am in the process of painting a teenage girls' room. I have to work around her things and on my free time, so it is sort of like doing a wall a day, having to clean up after each one. Ugh!

[davef]

Looks awesome, Dave! Great photos. The Les Paul is genius.

Is the Black Sand Finish smooth to the touch, or does it have some texture to it?

I love my Sierras but those Towers are so tempting.

Thanks,

Mark

Glad you like the addition of the Les Paul :)

The black sand finish has a light texture to it. It is a flat black paint with a small grain sand additive. It does not reflect light and is practically scratch proof. It is very discrete and very similar to the finish on our 170/340/200's.

I think it is an ideal solution for dedicated home theater rooms.

Attached is a close up of the paint.

[davef]

Understood completely, Dave. I am just expressing my interest in the natural finish. No pressure!! I get the painting analogy totally as I am in the process of painting a teenage girls' room. I have to work around her things and on my free time, so it is sort of like doing a wall a day, having to clean up after each one. Ugh!

Thanks for understanding! I will say that I was originally a bit concerned about how the natural finish would look in a tower speaker. However, after seeing the unfinished cabients (which essentially are the natural finish without a sealer which slightly darkens the wood) -- I am not concerned at all. The natural finish looks terrific. I have attached a teaser pic :)

We had the interior of our home painted last year and the painters recommended we leave for a few days. We decided against it and that was a big mistake as it took 3 times longer to finish because they had to work around us and setup / cleanup each day :(

[curtis]

Hmmm...I think that pic sends me over the top...

[davef]

not sure if this was covered, but what kind of placement do you suggest for the towers, specifically the minimum to the behind-wall distance as well the front-seating distance.

I have been listening to them at 1 foot away from the wall and they sound great, but of course this will vary from room to room. For front-seating distance, due to having multiple woofers, I recommend a minimum distance of 6 feet to allow for proper driver integration.

[davef]

Are those slits along the bottom part of the port? pretty slick! oh and im guessing this center speaker is meant to be flipped if placed below screen?

Yes - those slits are actualy slot ports. The speaker can be fipped vertically for placement above or below the television set.

[surfcane]

with regard to the 12" rythmik F12 subs

how much does the black oak look like the black matte finish on the towers?

or what does the black oak F12 sub mostly closely match in the new towers?

as well as what does the piano of the 12" sub most closely resemble in the towers?

[RicardoJoa]

with regard to the 12" rythmik F12 subs

how much does the black oak look like the black matte finish on the towers?

or what does the black oak F12 sub mostly closely match in the new towers?

as well as what does the piano of the 12" sub most closely resemble in the towers?

i dont have the f12 nor any ascend towers of black finish but i do have a f15 oak and i would say base on the pics it match closely to the satin black. the colour of the matt leans toward a really dark gray where the satin black has a deeper black. as far as the sheen level, it seems like the rythmik falls in between of matt and satin. hope that helps

[steven1110]

Hey guys,

Just wanting a quick verification that my Denon 1910 will be enough to drive a pair of these towers. Seating distance is about 10' back and typically listen at -20 to -15.

I'll hopefully be adding the "monster" center when released and also drive 8ohm sides with Emotiva in-wall rears (6 ohm).

Thanks!

[davef]

With the finishes now confirmed for the first production run and a lack of orders for the hand rubbed piano black, it is with much regret that we are now forced to raise the pricing of the American-Made hand rubbed piano black to $2848. This reflects a $250 price increase per pair.

The reason for this is that we initially had enough requests for the piano black to get a volume discount on the finishing but with final finish confirmations, that number is now quite a bit lower and we can no longer receive the quantity discounting.

I sincerely apologize for this and I want anyone considering the hand rubbed piano black to understand that we are just passing our cost to you. There is not a cent of profit in this finishing price for us...

Thanks for understanding!

[davef]

Hey guys,

Just wanting a quick verification that my Denon 1910 will be enough to drive a pair of these towers. Seating distance is about 10' back and typically listen at -20 to -15.

I'll hopefully be adding the "monster" center when released and also drive 8ohm sides with Emotiva in-wall rears (6 ohm).

Thanks!

Plenty of power for both the Sierra Towers and the STC!!! (Sierra Tower Center) The Towers (and center) have a sensitivity rating of about 90dB anechoic. At only 10 feet back, you will be hitting 100dB peaks (very loud) while using less than 60 watts of power :) At average listening levels (87dB), your receiver will be producing only about 4 watts of power...

[merrymaid520]

I finally had a chance to sit back and get some good solid listening time with my Towers and the new Crossover(and modified Tweeters) Dave sent back to me.

I must confirm what I had heard initially (the first 30min or so of listening before I had to leave). The mid range is much more fluid and less edgy. Vocals seem spot on. I listened to some good female and male vocal tracks including the album "We are one" by Kelly sweet. The Dream On track is awesome, highy recommended. Dynamics are truly superb, some of the tracks on Jesse cook's albums are very good at portraying this. To me the whole speaker sounds much more refined and exudes a very detailed and smooth sound, neither laid back nor bright, but just right! Not to reitterate what Dave said, but the new XO does seem to blend all the drivers together giving it that refind and smooth sound I hear. The Tweeter and mid seem like one where before, it almost seemed like you could tell which one was producing certain frequency ranges. Although I liked what I was hearing, the new version is quite a bit better at blending the two.

As you guys probably know, I have done quite a few comparisons with my Towers and other speakers. At this point, I truly can say I am very pleased with my purchase. I know we all have our preferences, mine favor the Ascend Towers V 2.0. To me, the mid range driver produces airy natural vocals, the NrT is crisp, detailed, and very dynamic, the bass is impressive and punchy/tight, and the imaging to me is much better than some of the speakers I have compared them to;)

I can't wait for the rest of you to receive your Towers. I hate being the only one to voice my opinion. Hopefully you guys appreciate them as much as I do!

Thanks for listening,

Brandon

[Sam1000]

Thx Brandon. Your reviews and Dave's track record were very helpful in making a decision to buy the speakers without much feedback.

[merrymaid520]

Thx Brandon. Your reviews and Dave's track record were very helpful in making a decision to buy the speakers without much feedback.

You are welcome! Looking forward to reading everyones thoughts when they recevie their own pair. What finish did you choose BTW?

[Sam1000]

You are welcome! Looking forward to reading everyones thoughts when they recevie their own pair. What finish did you choose BTW?

'Dark Cherry'.

[malaplace]

Put in my order yesterday. High-gloss Towers incoming in a few weeks, hopefully.

[mariob33]

Put in my order yesterday. High-gloss Towers incoming in a few weeks, hopefully.

Let's keep our fingers crossed been patiently waiting on these puppies..:)

[merrymaid520]

Just bought some extra horsepower for my towers yesterday:D I grabbed a Parasound A-21 2 ch amp. 250 WPC @ 8ohms & 400 WPC @ 4ohms.

Should hopefully be enough juice:p

[Jonnyozero3]

Nice! I picked up a Bryston 4B ST last year with these towers in mind (250 WPC as well). Welcome to the big watts club! :)

[wired4sound]

Just wondering, is the Tower more suited (better sounding) for SS amp or tube amp?
Thanks.

[Mag_Neato]

Just bought some extra horsepower for my towers yesterday:D I grabbed a Parasound A-21 2 ch amp. 250 WPC @ 8ohms & 400 WPC @ 4ohms.

Should hopefully be enough juice:p

What are you currently using for amplification? What did you feel was missing from the sound?

I was at a local hi-fi shop last week and the owner showed me a Halo 125 watt per channel model for just a hair under $1K. I think it was the A23. Nice looking unit, but even at that price I'd have taken it on the chin when the MC statement tattled on me!

[Sam1000]

Just bought some extra horsepower for my towers yesterday:D I grabbed a Parasound A-21 2 ch amp. 250 WPC @ 8ohms & 400 WPC @ 4ohms.

Should hopefully be enough juice:p

I thought Tower's has a higher sensitivity rating than Sierra... But, a quality amp is always nice to have :-)

[merrymaid520]

Nice! I picked up a Bryston 4B ST last year with these towers in mind (250 WPC as well). Welcome to the big watts club! :)

Thanks! I heard the Bryston is a rock solid amp too!

[merrymaid520]

What are you currently using for amplification? What did you feel was missing from the sound?

I was at a local hi-fi shop last week and the owner showed me a Halo 125 watt per channel model for just a hair under $1K. I think it was the A23. Nice looking unit, but even at that price I'd have taken it on the chin when the MC statement tattled on me!

I currently use a Proceed amp 3 (based off the Mark Levinson gear) running 150 wpc @8ohms and 250 WPC @ 4 ohms. Nothing missing really, just wanted more headroom and a mtching amp to go with my 2100 parasound preamp....this will allow me better trigger on functionality too.

The Halo series is a great line, my buddy loves his 2 ch A23.

[merrymaid520]

I thought Tower's has a higher sensitivity rating than Sierra... But, a quality amp is always nice to have :-)

You are correct, too much power is never a bad thing:) I am also waiting for the yet to be released Halo preamp that has the same features as my 2100;)

[curtis]

Ha...you used the new Towers as an excuse to get a new amp. :)

The Halo stuff is suppose to be great.

150wpc is plenty for the tower. That is the kind of power Dave has in his demo room....and we were listening pretty loudly!

Even with my Sierras, I am thinking of shelving my 500wpc IcePower amps, and just using my 150wpc ATI 1505.

[merrymaid520]

Ha...you used the new Towers as an excuse to get a new amp. :)

The Halo stuff is suppose to be great.

Shhhh, dont tell my wife:p

I love my 2100 preamp, so its like a match made in heaven.....gosh I am gullible!

[TomK]

My bucket list included a nice tube amp. Wanting to spend my money in America, I bought a Rogue Cronus Magnum. (made in PA) It is rated a 90 WPC RMS. I believe it will be more power than I will ever need as my listening room is small. Dave suggests I run it at 4 Ohms output. My natural finished Towers are in the process of being assembled...I hope. If we all turn on our amps at the same time we'll bring down the grid.:(

[surfcane]

What speaker wires to use with the towers?

Blue Jean vs Ultralink ? which one? or something else?

As long as I am asking - what speaker wire for the Rythmik subs?

[scape]

What speaker wires to use with the towers?

Blue Jean vs Ultralink ? which one? or something else?

As long as I am asking - what speaker wire for the Rythmik subs?

I use monoprice's CL2 rated 12AWG speakerwire. Then again I have yet to purchase a tower speaker.

[merrymaid520]

One more update....sick of me posting yet?:p
After much debate (with myself only), I decided to go back and run the Towers full range and cross the Rythmik sub over around 50hz. To do so meant rearranging my sub back to the left of my TV and of course the fun chore of running REW sweeps and EQing the sub all over again. Reason why, I felt like the Towers were being neglected like a redheaded step child, not being able to prove themselves by playing all frequencies. As a true 3-way design, there is no downside to letting the woofers play full range since the mids are unaffected being in a separate sealed enclosure. Like Dave mentioned early on, they have great mid bass punch and I felt I was missing just a bit of this although the Rythmik is no slouch in this area either.

Truly the only reason I had been crossing them over at 80hz was that it allowed me more room (frequency range) to EQ out any room anomalies. Many of these room dips/peaks fall below 100hz, so a higher XO allowed me to correct these by EQing the sub. To combat these issues with a narrowed playing field, I played around a lot with the 2100 preamps Low pass XO until I had a decent in room response.

The results I think are darn good! Results below(the crazy peaks after 100hz are likely floor bounce).....
First pic is the current full range plot
http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll4/bbriesath/towersfullrangeeqsubleft.jpgsecond pic is with the 80hz XO with the sub in the old location
http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll4/bbriesath/graph210080hzwithtowerssubright.jpg

[Sam1000]

One more update....


How do things look when your Yamaha room correction is engaged?

I'm using Audessey xt32 with Onkyo 5508 and very happy with it. I even questioned myself whether I needed to order Towers(but ordered then anyway :-) . The difference was that big with 5508 and audessey combination.

[merrymaid520]

How do things look when your Yamaha room correction is engaged?

I'm using Audessey xt32 with Onkyo 5508 and very happy with it. I even questioned myself whether I needed to order Towers(but ordered then anyway :-) . The difference was that big with 5508 and audessey combination.

Sam,
I am a believer of not using any room correction software to correct anything in the speakers response, I only EQ my sub. If the room needs work, I rather try treatments such as wall panels etc. I just cant see letting some mid level receiver and its software dictate the "sound" of my room. Again, just my opinion;)

I did forget to measure the response when using my Yamaha receiver, I will do that in the next few days. I am a bit nervous for the results considering I have now EQ'ed my sub for running the Towers full range through the 2100 preamp while the yamaha will be playing them crossed over small with a 60hz sub XO.
To me, I am more concerned with 2ch listening and how well the sub integrates versus movies. We shall see!

[Sam1000]

Sam,
I am a believer of not using any room correction software to correct anything in the speakers response, I only EQ my sub. If the room needs work, I rather try treatments such as wall panels etc. I just cant see letting some mid level receiver and its software dictate the "sound" of my room. Again, just my opinion;)


That's cool. Everyone's room is different and my room is one of the worst. I wish I could listen to parasound gear and do an A/B in my room with my pre-pro, but I have spent all my money with Tower upgrade and the pre-pro...

PS - Just listened to SACD of 'Brothers in Arms' and I think it is one the best recording I have heard so far. Competes with 'David Gilmour: Remember That Night' Blu-ray. Just trying to guess how these recordings will sound with the Towers. I'll be out for a week on a vacation, so the wait is less painful for a week :cool:

[merrymaid520]

That's cool. Everyone's room is different and my room is one of the worst. I wish I could listen to parasound gear and do an A/B in my room with my pre-pro, but I have spent all my money with Tower upgrade and the pre-pro...

PS - Just listened to SACD of 'Brothers in Arms' and I think it is one the best recording I have heard so far. Competes with 'David Gilmour: Remember That Night' Blu-ray. Just trying to guess how these recordings will sound with the Towers. I'll be out for a week on a vacation, so the wait is less painful for a week :cool:

Putting most of your budget into speakers is your best bet anyway, they make the biggest difference, save the electronics for down the road:) The Towers wont dissapoint;)

I almost forgot about my Brothers in Arms SACD, I will throw it in this weekend and check it out! The wait stinks, good luck!

[GirgleMirt]

That's cool. Everyone's room is different and my room is one of the worst. I wish I could listen to parasound gear and do an A/B in my room with my pre-pro, but I have spent all my money with Tower upgrade and the pre-pro...


Putting most of your budget into speakers is your best bet anyway, they make the biggest difference, save the electronics for down the road:) The Towers wont dissapoint;)

I almost forgot about my Brothers in Arms SACD, I will throw it in this weekend and check it out! The wait stinks, good luck!
mieh... Investing in room treatment, which really isn't that expensive especially if you do DIY, can make a huge difference, exponentially greater benefit than electronics... As for using room correction, I guess it depends on the correction and what has to be corrected... Better to fix the room with treatment/placement as you can only do so much with software. And with very good room/speakers there's not a whole lot to fix anyway.

I'd say room and speakers are about equal, they're both the usual bottleneck. Many amazing/great speakers can sound unimpressive in bad setups. And good speakers can sound better than those in a good/great setup. You really need both to have top notch sound! One without the other doesn't work...

Great job with the pics! Looks very good! Can't wait to see the other finishes :)

[scape]

ive gone back and forth on the xo, sometimes i feel as if it does bring out some detail, but sometimes i feel like running speakers full range is simply better sounding, i still cross over my sub itself-- seems like my speakers are more 'with-it'. i for one, and i'm absolutely sure i speak for many, am totally jealous of your tower experience. keep the details coming! :D

i'll say this again, i'm really excited about this center channel :)

[merrymaid520]

Here are my measurements from the Yamaha receiver...I had forgot to measure it and only did my 2100 preamp previously. These are after I tailored (EQ'ed) the Rythmik to run flat with the Towers full range.

First pic just Yamaha running with settings sub XO at 40hz Reverse phase, speakers set to small
http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll4/bbriesath/yamaha40hzReversesubleft.jpg
Second pic is Yamaha (same settings as above and the Towers through 2100 preamp.
http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll4/bbriesath/yamaha40hzReverseandtowersfullrangeeq.jpg

Also,
The new Parasound A-21 amp arrived and all is running! The things a beast but definitely has great control over the mid bass punch of the Towers. Not sure if its just me, but it seems a bit more open/clear sounding..slightly less muffled maybe?

[Jonnyozero3]

The new Parasound A-21 amp arrived and all is running! The things a beast but definitely has great control over the mid bass punch of the Towers. Not sure if its just me, but it seems a bit more open/clear sounding..slightly less muffled maybe?

Hmmm, interesting obsevation. I wonder if you were previously playing just loud enough that the other amp was beginning to run out of steam?

[merrymaid520]

Hmmm, interesting obsevation. I wonder if you were previously playing just loud enough that the other amp was beginning to run out of steam?

I don't typically listen loud enough for that ever to happen. As many believe, amps should sound very similar in nature unless they are running out of power. I imagine it was just me hearing things, but I can say its not any worse:D The whole setup with the new Towers, PS Audio DACIII, Parasound A-21 amp & 2100 preamp all have great synergy, I could not be happier!

[millerwill]

Now that the Towers are beginning to be delivered, I'm looking forward to the arrival of the Tower Center.

Any hints, Dave F, as to when it will appear?

[scape]

I think amps can run out of power pretty quickly as it takes a logarithmic amount of power to turn watts into decibels.
ateast that's from my knowledge of stage audio.

what's with the dip at 80hz? is that common for your room? just curious

[merrymaid520]

I think amps can run out of power pretty quickly as it takes a logarithmic amount of power to turn watts into decibels.
ateast that's from my knowledge of stage audio.

what's with the dip at 80hz? is that common for your room? just curious

The dip must be room related because it shows up no matter how I setup my XO points using the receiver or the preamp. If you look at the above graphs, the same dip occurs and my preamp is running the towers full range while the yamaha is set to small with a sub XO of 40hz. I have to believe the room as at fault here. If I look back at some of my older measurments, I believe it exists as well. Darn room interactions:)

[curtis]

Didn't you have those dips there with the Sierras as well? Definitely the room.

Can you move the subs around?

[merrymaid520]

Didn't you have those dips there with the Sierras as well? Definitely the room.

Can you move the subs around?

Curtis,
I believe the dip has always been there. I did try moving the sub to either the L or R of the TV and the results are best where its at. Unfortunately, its the only two options I have without it looking out of place. My room is open so I have limited placment options and the wife needs to approve:p

[joez28ls1]

Does anyone know if any other towers have shipped yet? Not that I'm impatient, just excited!

[ojready]

I didn't see any specs for these. Are these posted somewhere in this thread or on the main site?

[merrymaid520]

I didn't see any specs for these. Are these posted somewhere in this thread or on the main site?

Try the first few pages of this thread.

[markie]

Curtis,
I believe the dip has always been there. I did try moving the sub to either the L or R of the TV and the results are best where its at. Unfortunately, its the only two options I have without it looking out of place. My room is open so I have limited placment options and the wife needs to approve:p

I notice there is a dip at 20, 40, 80 (biggie) and perhaps 160. My highly advanced room mode calculation (1130/80 = 14.1, heh!) has me guess your room is just a touch over 14 feet long?

Would a specific panel that absorbs around 80 hz help? I have no idea....

Mark

[merrymaid520]

I notice there is a dip at 20, 40, 80 (biggie) and perhaps 160. My highly advanced room mode calculation (1130/80 = 14.1, heh!) has me guess your room is just a touch over 14 feet long?

Would a specific panel that absorbs around 80 hz help? I have no idea....

Mark

The other dips below 100hz besides the 80hz one are pretty small overall, probably not worth investigating. The ones beyond 100hz are likely floor bounce and are pretty much there no matter what I could do....unless I lived in an anechoic chamber:)

As for your E=MC/2 mathematics, my rooms about 17x17;) It really is much larger as it opens up into the kitchen and dining area though.

[markie]

The other dips below 100hz besides the 80hz one are pretty small overall, probably not worth investigating. The ones beyond 100hz are likely floor bounce and are pretty much there no matter what I could do....unless I lived in an anechoic chamber:)

As for your E=MC/2 mathematics, my rooms about 17x17;) It really is much larger as it opens up into the kitchen and dining area though.

Drats. You realize that you are putting the entire audio science edifice in danger? :D

Really, I think you room response is not too bad at all. Yet, I would like to hear from others about how to correct for dips like that. I recently saw an article on the DSPeaker Anti-mode 8033, but it corrects the peaks, not dips.

Happy listening!
Mark

[ojready]

Try the first few pages of this thread.

yeah, I looked over the thread a few times but didn't see what each woofer was and so on... Want to compare to other towers and my Sierras. Maybe the final details are still not posted or finalized?

[hearing specialist]

Just my .02 (my engineering education speaking) here on room standing waves. Depending on specific or certain delays chosen, say 30-50ms or 40-60ms for example, your standing waves will differ depending on said chosen ms delay. I measure 3 standing waves from same exact measuring locations and get different first, second, and third standing wave frequencies all based on the ms delay time chosen. Point is this, time alignment and full frequency phase control is greatly beneficial even with 2 channel listening. Timing is everything, heart beat, car engine, room correction, the list goes on...



Brian in Bakersfield...

[davef]

Now that the Towers are beginning to be delivered, I'm looking forward to the arrival of the Tower Center.

Any hints, Dave F, as to when it will appear?

The final prototype should be finished by the end of this week :)

[davef]

Does anyone know if any other towers have shipped yet? Not that I'm impatient, just excited!

The only set that has shipped yet is Brandon's (merrymaid520). The status as of today is that the local cabinet assembler is in the process of finishing all of the cabinets. They want to allow a few additional days of curing time in between the different layers of finish in order to ensure high quality results. This has set us back about 1 more week so I expect that we will start shipping within 2 weeks at the longest.

We will probably start final billing, invoicing and generate shipping labels at the end of this week so that we can fully focus all of our manpower on assembly, testing and packaging once the cabinets are delivered.

[joez28ls1]

Exciting! Thanks for the update!

[merrymaid520]

Drats. You realize that you are putting the entire audio science edifice in danger? :D

Really, I think you room response is not too bad at all. Yet, I would like to hear from others about how to correct for dips like that. I recently saw an article on the DSPeaker Anti-mode 8033, but it corrects the peaks, not dips.

Happy listening!
Mark

Ha!

I'm happy with my room as well. Its unlikely most open concept homes will have a ruler flat response when there's openings to kitchens, dining areas, hallways etc. Technically I could run my Towers crossed over at 80-90hz leaving myself more room to EQ out the dips/peaks up to the XO point, but that would defeat the purpose of me wanting to run them full range:) The 8033 does the same as my Behringer 1124 EQ, its just more user friendly. Most people prefer to just eliminate peaks, dips require lots of amp headroom to fix.

[millerwill]

The final prototype should be finished by the end of this week :)

Look forward to 'hearing' (i.e., reading!) more about it.

[RandomName]

So I'm guessing all the Towers from this first round are already sold? I just got my NrTs, and I'm really enjoying them, but when I consider that with stands I'm only like $600 shy of the full towers, it almost seems like I might as well start all in so I don't keep getting the itch.

Especially when i consider that the money is already spent since atm I'm sitting on both the NrTs and CM5s (both are open-box/b-stock so if I do return them I don't have to feel bad ^_^)

Blah... I hate making decisions...

Either way though, I must say Kudos Dave, I'm thoroughly impressed with the NrTs, there wouldn't even be any debate if I hadn't gotten the CM5s for so ridiculously cheap... and even knowing they cost me more, I will probably stick with them if I don't opt for towers.

Edit: I suppose I should also ask, which do you think would be better for a small room (mine is like 12x15x8) NrTs and like an F12 sub, or the Towers alone? Ultimately I will probably end up with a 3.1 system (no room for rears, though I wouldn't mind front wides, even if it would be overkill), but short term it's either 2.1 with bookshelves or 2.0 with towers.

[mariob33]

I'm waiting for the towers all the while really enjoying the noise coming out of a recently purchased non NRT sierras. The guy on the left shoulder keeps saying, wait till you hear the towers and the guy on the right is thinking forget the tower upgrade and turn up that Adelle....:)

Dave,

Any chance of getting an early sample of that center? I would love to be first on list - ready or not..Ah just send me the box unfinished with the xo and drivers. But really will there be the option for first run units to get put in the hands of a few with the understanding further refinment will be forthcoming?

I'm new to the Ascend club but man am I impressed. My only M253C00 was on the piano black...will I regret it? Hope not.

[davef]

One more update....sick of me posting yet?:p
After much debate (with myself only), I decided to go back and run the Towers full range and cross the Rythmik sub over around 50hz. To do so meant rearranging my sub back to the left of my TV and of course the fun chore of running REW sweeps and EQing the sub all over again. Reason why, I felt like the Towers were being neglected like a redheaded step child, not being able to prove themselves by playing all frequencies. As a true 3-way design, there is no downside to letting the woofers play full range since the mids are unaffected being in a separate sealed enclosure. Like Dave mentioned early on, they have great mid bass punch and I felt I was missing just a bit of this although the Rythmik is no slouch in this area either.

Truly the only reason I had been crossing them over at 80hz was that it allowed me more room (frequency range) to EQ out any room anomalies. Many of these room dips/peaks fall below 100hz, so a higher XO allowed me to correct these by EQing the sub. To combat these issues with a narrowed playing field, I played around a lot with the 2100 preamps Low pass XO until I had a decent in room response.

The results I think are darn good! Results below(the crazy peaks after 100hz are likely floor bounce).....
First pic is the current full range plot
http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll4/bbriesath/towersfullrangeeqsubleft.jpgsecond pic is with the 80hz XO with the sub in the old location
http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll4/bbriesath/graph210080hzwithtowerssubright.jpg

Brandon,

Congrats -- you are getting a fantastic in-room response!!!! If you ignore the peak and dip caused by floor bounce (nothing you can do about it), you are getting an in-room resonse of +/- 4 dB from just below 20Hz on up.

It really doesn't get any better than that and don't drive yourself insane trying to improve it -- trust me on that one ;)

[davef]

So I'm guessing all the Towers from this first round are already sold? I just got my NrTs, and I'm really enjoying them, but when I consider that with stands I'm only like $600 shy of the full towers, it almost seems like I might as well start all in so I don't keep getting the itch.

We can still accommodate a few more tower orders at the pre-order pricing (first production run). Sadly, we just received new pricing from our local bamboo vendor so prices will, unfortunately, be going up. Seems everything is going up these days :(

So glad to hear that you are enjoying the NrT's!!


Edit: I suppose I should also ask, which do you think would be better for a small room (mine is like 12x15x8) NrTs and like an F12 sub, or the Towers alone? Ultimately I will probably end up with a 3.1 system (no room for rears, though I wouldn't mind front wides, even if it would be overkill), but short term it's either 2.1 with bookshelves or 2.0 with towers.

I suppose it really depends on your personal tastes. I know if it were me, I would go for the towers but a pair of towers will not give you the bass response of your F12 subwoofer. If you go for the towers and have no plans to use a subwoofer, if your priority leans towards home theater I would stick with the Sierra-1 NrT + F12 subwoofer. If your priority leans more towards music listening -- I would go for the towers.

The best of both worlds = the Towers + subwoofer :)

[davef]

yeah, I looked over the thread a few times but didn't see what each woofer was and so on... Want to compare to other towers and my Sierras. Maybe the final details are still not posted or finalized?

Just let me know exactly what information you are looking for and I would be happy to post the info :)

The Sierra Tower has (2) 5 1/4" bass drivers -- these are located on the bottom of the tower. These woofers are similar to the woofer used in the Sierra-1 but optimized specifically for this new speaker. They are designed for excellent mid-bass "punch" and will be -3dB at 41 Hz anechoic. In-room response will be into the low 30's.

The Tower also has a dedicated 5 1/4" mid-woofer housed in its own sealed chamber. This is the top woofer. This woofer has an under-hung voice coil and neodymium magnet assembly with a very low mass PP cone optimized for midrange performance.

It will still be a while before we have a specific product page for the Sierra Tower as we want to fulfill all of the pre-orders first....

[scape]

It will still be a while before we have a specific product page for the Sierra Tower as we want to fulfill all of the pre-orders first....

The sign of a great business :)

[BinaryLinguist]

Just put in my order for Espresso towers... :D Can't wait!

Have to part with my less than one year old Espresso Sierra's but it's for a good cause. :D

[Mag_Neato]

Dave, would a ribbon tweeter version of both the Sierra-1 & Sierra tower be anywhere close to a possibility down the road? Seems there is a growing fan base for ribbons, and the cost does not seem to make the buyers' flinch. It would certainly be a build to order semi-custom thing I would think.

Just a thought. I am happy with my NrT Sierras right now, and I certainly don't have the coinage to consider something like that, but I'm sure many have thought about this!

[TomK]

The only set that has shipped yet is Brandon's (merrymaid520). The status as of today is that the local cabinet assembler is in the process of finishing all of the cabinets. They want to allow a few additional days of curing time in between the different layers of finish in order to ensure high quality results. This has set us back about 1 more week so I expect that we will start shipping within 2 weeks at the longest.

We will probably start final billing, invoicing and generate shipping labels at the end of this week so that we can fully focus all of our manpower on assembly, testing and packaging once the cabinets are delivered.

As a woodworker I know what the cabinet makers are going through. All that hard work can be ruined by a poor finish. If they are using solvent based products it is imperitive that it cure thoroughly before applying subsequent applications. As they say "You can't hurry love"...or "We will not ship any speaker before it's time".

[hearing specialist]

I do like a great ribbon as well as a great planar tweeter, very refined and defined sound. I also like the efficiency of those high freq drivers as it gives so many options in designing a setup. Good question sir and you earn a starbucks on me :D



Brian in Bakersfield...

[Mag_Neato]

I do like a great ribbon as well as a great planar tweeter, very refined and defined sound. I also like the efficiency of those high freq drivers as it gives so many options in designing a setup. Good question sir and you earn a starbucks on me :D



Brian in Bakersfield...

Why thank you, Brian!

Make it a McCafe' and you've got a deal!!

[BinaryLinguist]

Has it been mentioned what the thread size is for the spikes? I want to see if I can reuse a set of Soundcare Superspikes that I have before I try and sell them. Love the all-in-one design that doesn't harm the wood floor.

[davef]

Dave, would a ribbon tweeter version of both the Sierra-1 & Sierra tower be anywhere close to a possibility down the road? Seems there is a growing fan base for ribbons, and the cost does not seem to make the buyers' flinch. It would certainly be a build to order semi-custom thing I would think.

Would anyone care to take a guess at what this is a picture of :p

[davef]

Has it been mentioned what the thread size is for the spikes? I want to see if I can reuse a set of Soundcare Superspikes that I have before I try and sell them. Love the all-in-one design that doesn't harm the wood floor.

Spike foot insert thread size is 1/4 - 20. Spike feet with floor protectors will be included with the Sierra Towers.

[BinaryLinguist]

Spike foot insert thread size is 1/4 - 20. Spike feet with floor protectors will be included with the Sierra Towers.

Thanks Dave.

[Mag_Neato]

Would anyone care to take a guess at what this is a picture of :p

In the words of Gomer Pyle; "SHAZAM......GOLLY!!

WOW! My question regarding this was completely random. Leave it to Dave to be two steps ahead of us.

That ribbon tweet looks like a direct drop-in for the NrT tweet.....yes?

[davef]

In the words of Gomer Pyle; "SHAZAM......GOLLY!!

WOW! My question regarding this was completely random. Leave it to Dave to be two steps ahead of us.

That ribbon tweet looks like a direct drop-in for the NrT tweet.....yes?

It is not a direct drop-in as it will require some internal routing of the cabinet but anyone with a steady hand and a dremel tool should be able to install it.

We have been working with Aleksandar Radisavljevic for some time now with regard to offering our customers our own custom version of what is widely considered to be the best ribbon tweeter available... This is a 20mm wide ribbon with an Amorphous core transformer and the combination of this RT with the dedicated mid of the Sierra Tower is remarkable.

Anyone interested in this option should send me an email...

[joez28ls1]

Wow, huge surprise, email sent!

[Sam1000]

Would anyone care to take a guess at what this is a picture of :p

But, mine was Dark Cherry:) I do recognize that picture though. Can't wait to hear that one.

[scape]

It is not a direct drop-in as it will require some internal routing of the cabinet but anyone with a steady hand and a dremel tool should be able to install it.

We have been working with Aleksandar Radisavljevic for some time now with regard to offering our customers our own custom version of what is widely considered to be the best ribbon tweeter available... This is a 20mm wide ribbon with an Amorphous core transformer and the combination of this RT with the dedicated mid of the Sierra Tower is remarkable.

Anyone interested in this option should send me an email...

out of curiosity, wouldn't the xo have to be tweaked coming from the other tweeter?
edit: i mean to say, it'd be a replacement tweeter, but with different characterstics, so wouldnt that have to be taken into account on the xo?

[merrymaid520]

out of curiosity, wouldn't the xo have to be tweaked coming from the other tweeter?
edit: i mean to say, it'd be a replacement tweeter, but with different characterstics, so wouldnt that have to be taken into account on the xo?

I have to imagine the XO will differ from Ribbon to Dome versions. Ribbons usually require a higher XO point, they are not as robust as a dome tweeter. again, I could be wrong though.

[Mike^S]

Would anyone care to take a guess at what this is a picture of :p

WOW!!!

[Sam1000]

I have to imagine the XO will differ from Ribbon to Dome versions. Ribbons usually require a higher XO point, they are not as robust as a dome tweeter. again, I could be wrong though.

You are right. However, the dedicated mid driver allows higher xo point for the tower. But Dave had to change the xo for this option. I'm sure Dave will chime in on this.

[scape]

yea i understand, that's what i was curious about since dave simply said all that's needed is routing the baffle. the only ribbon tweeter i've heard is a carver silver edition's-- simply amazing high end on that speaker. i didn't listen for long so I'm not sure how it (ribbon tweeter) actually compares to a dome.

[merrymaid520]

yea i understand, that's what i was curious about since dave simply said all that's needed is routing the baffle. the only ribbon tweeter i've heard is a carver silver edition's-- simply amazing high end on that speaker. i didn't listen for long so I'm not sure how it (ribbon tweeter) actually compares to a dome.

I have heard the LCY ribbon in two different Salk Models and to me there are plusses/minusses. The Ribbon does seem to have better timbre accuracy...that delicate sound. Domes have much better dispersion and sound a bit more dynamic. All about tradeoffs:) From my understanding, Dave has said its much easier to implement the Ribbon into the 3-way designed Tower. The mid range driver plays much higher frequencies than the woofers in a typical 2 way. This creates better driver integration overall.

I hope Dave will chime in with specifics and his thoughts on how the two compare, so dont listen to me:D

[Mag_Neato]

The ribbon will have a very defined sweet spot if it is anything like the Martin Logans I listened to a few years ago. If you are in the sweet spot it was magic. When I stood up the highs disappeared. I guess that's great if you don't want ceiling/floor reflections. It was odd to me.

Anyway, I can't wait for the first owner reports!

[davef]

Hi Guys,

As expected, many questions and emails regarding the ribbon tweeter option. I will try to get to all of them so please be patient with me :)

I should mention this tweeter is being made for us by RAAL and is based on their OEM only 70-20XR model with an Amorphous core transformer. It is, in my opinion, a considerable step up from the Raal 70-10D, having twice the ribbon area. It is an extremely robust and dynamic ribbon tweeter.

As of today, the cost for the ribbon option is an additional $350 per each speaker ($700/pair). I should stress that costs are rising dramatically and if the dollar continues to fall against the Euro, the cost for this option will continue to rise.


out of curiosity, wouldn't the xo have to be tweaked coming from the other tweeter?
edit: i mean to say, it'd be a replacement tweeter, but with different characterstics, so wouldnt that have to be taken into account on the xo?

Yes, the crossover must be modified to accommodate the ribbon tweeter


I have to imagine the XO will differ from Ribbon to Dome versions. Ribbons usually require a higher XO point, they are not as robust as a dome tweeter. again, I could be wrong though.

One of the reasons we made a few changes to the crossover prior to production (besides improving performance) was to create a topology that will easily accommodate the necessary changes.


You are right. However, the dedicated mid driver allows higher xo point for the tower. But Dave had to change the xo for this option. I'm sure Dave will chime in on this.

Typical ribbon tweeters are a bit difficult to properly integrate with a mid but I must say that I was quite surprised at the ease of which this RT integrated with our dedicated mid.

The Tower ribbon option will be available as a factory upgrade for new and existing tower owners and also as a customer upgrade. However, I must stess that the existing internal cutout for the tweeter will need to be re-shaped. We will provide a template for this but it will require the use of power tools. The external cutout will not be affected as we are having our own custom faceplates tooled thus saving the cabinet finish :)

The ribbon tweeter option is available to anyone who has already placed a pre-order with us. It will delay shipping but I should know in about 1 week at how long the delay will be.

[scape]

i was reading up on raal, if anyone is interested: http://6moons.com/industryfeatures/roadtourserbia/raal.html
the bronze omni looks nuts lol

[davef]

As promised, here is a pic of the STC (Sierra Tower Center) next to a CMT-340C cabinet. This is the "official" first protoype cabinet. We still have to come up with a grille design while somehow trying to avoid increasing the cabinet height...

No doubt this is a large "boxy" center speaker but it is a perfect performance match with the Sierra Tower. Incredible dynamics and vocal clarity!

[millerwill]

As promised, here is a pic of the STC (Sierra Tower Center) next to a CMT-340C cabinet. This is the "official" first protoype cabinet. We still have to come up with a grille design while somehow trying to avoid increasing the cabinet height...

No doubt this is a large "boxy" center speaker but it is a perfect performance match with the Sierra Tower. Incredible dynamics and vocal clarity!

Boy, I would dearly love to replace my Sierra-Center with one of these, but I'm having a VERY hard time seeing how I could fit it in.

[hearing specialist]

Now that's a center!!! (snif...) I think I need a hug...




Brian in Bakersfield....

[Jonnyozero3]

As promised, here is a pic of the STC (Sierra Tower Center) next to a CMT-340C cabinet. This is the "official" first protoype cabinet. We still have to come up with a grille design while somehow trying to avoid increasing the cabinet height...

No doubt this is a large "boxy" center speaker but it is a perfect performance match with the Sierra Tower. Incredible dynamics and vocal clarity!

Charge my card now please! :D

I can definitely see the tough design challenge with the grill.

[davef]

Boy, I would dearly love to replace my Sierra-Center with one of these, but I'm having a VERY hard time seeing how I could fit it in.

Believe me, I know... I am not able to fit it into the theater in my own home :(

I am considering offering an optional "custom" version which would be a WMTW orientation with a vertical height of only 7.5".

WMTW

instead of

--T--
WMW

However, the length of the speaker would be increased and horizontal dispersion would not be quite as wide or symmetrical. This version would be more expensive because we would build less cabinets.

[joez28ls1]

I think it looks awesome (and it fits in my theater)!

[davef]

Dave,

Any chance of getting an early sample of that center? I would love to be first on list - ready or not..Ah just send me the box unfinished with the xo and drivers. But really will there be the option for first run units to get put in the hands of a few with the understanding further refinment will be forthcoming?

Once we finalize everything, this might be possible... I don't expect further refinement though once the center is finalized. Performance is designed to perfectly match the towers :)

[merrymaid520]

Very impressive Dave, love the STC! Has pricing been mentioned, I may have missed it?

Once I move and get my wall hung flat screen, the STC will be mine.......*cue evil laugh*:)

For now I have to "suffer" with the Sierra-1 NrT center.

[millerwill]

It's the width that's a problem for me; can't go wider than 23" (but could go even higher). Please think about a custom variation with this form factor.



Believe me, I know... I am not able to fit it into the theater in my own home :(

I am considering offering an optional "custom" version which would be a WMTW orientation with a vertical height of only 7.5".

WMTW

instead of

--T--
WMW

However, the length of the speaker would be increased and horizontal dispersion would not be quite as wide or symmetrical. This version would be more expensive because we would build less cabinets.

[Jonnyozero3]

However, the length of the speaker would be increased and horizontal dispersion would not be quite as wide or symmetrical. This version would be more expensive because we would build less cabinets.

In that case,
--T--
WMW
it is for me! I'll take a hacksaw to my center channel stand if required :D

[millerwill]

In that case,
--T--
WMW
it is for me! I'll take a hacksaw to my center channel stand if required :P

Looks to me like the two W's on the L and R sides could be moved in closer, to make it not so wide!

[davef]

Looks to me like the two W's on the L and R sides could be moved in closer, to make it not so wide!

Yes -- they definitely could but to get the same low end performance as the Towers, the cabinet volume needs to be the exact same as the tower...

As I understand it, you need 23" wide.... I will do some additional modeling and see what works. I would like to try and avoid increasing the depth (10 1/2") and height (10 7/8").

[millerwill]

Yes -- they definitely could but to get the same low end performance as the Towers, the cabinet volume needs to be the exact same as the tower...

As I understand it, you need 23" wide.... I will do some additional modeling and see what works. I would like to try and avoid increasing the depth (10 1/2") and height (10 7/8").

Wow, that would be fantastic, Dave! And I will be retaining the Sierra-1NRT's for the L and R speakers; HT is my thing, so having an exceptional speaker is so important.

PS And yes, 23" W max.

PS2 And since I have a SubMersive HP, low end output is irrelevant for the Center.

[gorthocar]

As promised, here is a pic of the STC (Sierra Tower Center) next to a CMT-340C cabinet. This is the "official" first protoype cabinet. We still have to come up with a grille design while somehow trying to avoid increasing the cabinet height...

No doubt this is a large "boxy" center speaker but it is a perfect performance match with the Sierra Tower. Incredible dynamics and vocal clarity!

Wow, looking good. I can almost see it in my home theater! It may be somewhat large and boxy, but if its performance perfectly matches the Sierra Towers, then that is what I want.

[joez28ls1]

Wow, looking good. I can almost see it in my home theater! It may be somewhat large and boxy, but if its performance perfectly matches the Sierra Towers, then that is what I want.

Couldn't agree more!

[RicardoJoa]

Just curious,
are the woofers desined to work in sealed box?
What is the purpose\advantage to have the low end just like the towers when it comes to center channel.
thanks

[markie]

Brian, lol! We're here for ya!

This centre is not something you try to fit into your home theatre, oh no. It's something you build your home theatre around! Love it!

I have a few questions:

From David's recent post I see that the prototype is 10.5'' deep and almost 10.9" high, but what is its actual width? (It's more than 23" I know.)

Would this centre channel also work well with two Sierra bookshelves as left and rights, if one didn't have the room for the towers, or would it overpower them? I've heard people say the centre channel is the most important, and this thing definitely looks important. :D

It looks like this centre is easily study enough, and fashionable enough, to use as a TV stand! Also, I think it would look better under the TV than over, because it is so large. The problem is, since I like the TV fairly low to the floor (zen style I suppose), perhaps just 1.5 feet off the floor, this would mean that the centre would be that much closer to the floor, and would have to be angled up quite a bit. Would this be a problem for the sound? (If angled, it could no longer be used as as TV stand, drats. Unless the baffle itself was angled. But that's probably a bridge too far... )

Mark

[hearing specialist]

Thank you Mark! The new crossovers, now the center, and now ribbon tweets...i'm really trying to be patient!

How cool would it be to use 5 of those bad boys...5.1??? Or even just as a L,C,R all at even levels, that would be perfect. All 3 front tweets even level...yum! I could just see my wifeys face as she walks in the room...:eek: and you bought what...:eek:



Brian in Bakersfield...

[BinaryLinguist]

Hmmm.... 7.5" height would work for me...

What would be the overall width and depth on this shorter version?

God bless my wife for putting up with me....


Edit: Come to think of it... would it be safe to sit a 50" Plasma (90lbs.) on top of this?





Believe me, I know... I am not able to fit it into the theater in my own home :(

I am considering offering an optional "custom" version which would be a WMTW orientation with a vertical height of only 7.5".

WMTW

instead of

--T--
WMW

However, the length of the speaker would be increased and horizontal dispersion would not be quite as wide or symmetrical. This version would be more expensive because we would build less cabinets.

[millerwill]

I have a few questions:

From David's recent post I see that the prototype is 10.5'' deep and almost 10.9" high, but what is its actual width? (It's more than 23" I know.)


Mark

28"W.

[malaplace]

Wow that center is a monster, but since my family room isn't a dedicated theater room, it looks like I'll be sticking with the smaller Sierra 1 center for now in an effort to keep the room somewhat livable :). I bet the new center's performance is fabulous.

[Mag_Neato]

That is one large center speaker! Performance should be spectacular.

I hope someone close to me buys a pair of towers and allows me to audition them!!:D

[davef]

Just wondering, is the Tower more suited (better sounding) for SS amp or tube amp?
Thanks.

The Sierra Tower has good efficiency and presents a very stable load to the amplifier. It will perform well with both SS and tube amps :)

[millerwill]

The Sierra Tower has good efficiency and presents a very stable load to the amplifier. It will perform well with both SS and tube amps :)

If you can come up with a variant of the TC that squeezes the width to </= 23", I'm ready to replace my Sierra-1 NRT Center with it!

[DavidD]

Believe me, I know... I am not able to fit it into the theater in my own home :(

I am considering offering an optional "custom" version which would be a WMTW orientation with a vertical height of only 7.5".

WMTW

instead of

--T--
WMW

However, the length of the speaker would be increased and horizontal dispersion would not be quite as wide or symmetrical. This version would be more expensive because we would build less cabinets.

The custom 7.5" version might be of interest to me. Beyond the dispersion, would performance be comparable with the standard speaker?

[gorthocar]

With the STC being 28" wide, it will be fairly close to my HTPC. This may sound like a dumb question because most of us have gone to LCD or plasma HDTVs, but is the STC going to be mag shielded? I don't want it to wipe the hard drive in my HTPC. :eek:

[RandomName]

Yes -- they definitely could but to get the same low end performance as the Towers, the cabinet volume needs to be the exact same as the tower...

As I understand it, you need 23" wide.... I will do some additional modeling and see what works. I would like to try and avoid increasing the depth (10 1/2") and height (10 7/8").

I'm a bit surprised by this statement, honestly I'd gladly sacrifice a bit of depth (1-2 inches) for a shorter (narrower would be nice too, but far less important to me) center channel.

even at 12 inches, it wouldn't be that unusually deep for a center channel.

Paradigm has several centers from 12-14in deep, as does B&W and several other speaker makers, depth can be hidden in a shelf, or under a tv, height and width are always going to be visible unless you happen to be using a projector with a speaker behind the screen, but then you would just use a tower anyway.

Increasing the depth just to 12 would allow you to bring the width down to 24.5. Though honestly if there was room, it would be far more beneficial to lose some height and keep some of that width (something like 27w x ~9.85h x 12d), but it looks like with the mid/tweeter stacked like that there isn't much room for choice unless you actually redesigned the housing of the tweeter which seems like more room than it's worth.

Any chance you guys have considered a W-M-T-M-W configuration? I know it would take some tweaking to balance it with the towers and it wouldn't be an EXACT match for the towers, but I'd think the increased midrange from dual mids would be beneficial for dialogue. Plus it would allow for the tweeter to stay in the center vs the W-M-T-W config you described and maintain symmetry (I R OCD about such things ^_^, I love the freedom W-M-T-W would give regarding size, but the idea of an off-center tweeter just wigs me out, at least any more than 1-2 inches since i know the directionality would wig me out on higher frequencies.)

Anyways, sorry to ramble, I love the idea of the Center, and I'm sure it sounds just as good as the towers, it just seems like in the current configuration, the options for fitting it into a system would be extremely limited. For me it wouldn't make a huge difference since the only way the speaker would fit in my current console is if it somehow was only 9" tall, so I'm going to end up having to go with a Sierra-1 center for the near term.

I also think you could help with the look of the speaker if the woofers were vertically centered, but that's just my ocd again.

I'm gunna shut up now.

[millerwill]

I'm a bit surprised by this statement, honestly I'd gladly sacrifice a bit of depth (1-2 inches) for a shorter (narrower would be nice too, but far less important to me) center channel.

even at 12 inches, it wouldn't be that unusually deep for a center channel.

Paradigm has several centers from 12-14in deep, as does B&W and several other speaker makers, depth can be hidden in a shelf, or under a tv, height and width are always going to be visible unless you happen to be using a projector with a speaker behind the screen, but then you would just use a tower anyway.


I agree, deeper is not a problem.

[Tower]

David ,The tower 8 ohm 6 ohm or 4ohm? David, can you ship my tower as soon as before my wife change her mind

[Jonnyozero3]

David ,The tower 8 ohm 6 ohm or 4ohm? David, can you ship my tower as soon as before my wife change her mind

See the 2nd post in this thread:


5. Minimum impedance = 4 ohms with a nominal impedance of 6 ohms. The impedance response is smooth and free of any artifacts (wrinkles) which would indicate potential resonance problems, thanks in part to the bamboo cabinet and exceptional transducers In addition, the electrical phase angle never exceeds +/- 30 degrees which means despite the 4 ohm minimum impedance, the speaker will work well with most 8 ohm rated receivers.

[choirbass]

I do somewhat agree more with the above comments about depth not being as much of an issue as height or width; currently having plenty of space available behind a CMT-340 SE, compared to the width of a few inches at most. Hopefully a dimension change like that wont impact SQ, though that may just be wishful thinking.

[millerwill]

I do somewhat agree more with the above comments about depth not being as much of an issue as height or width; currently having plenty of space available behind a CMT-340 SE, compared to the width of a few inches at most. Hopefully a dimension change like that wont impact SQ, though that may just be wishful thinking.

Well, Dave seems at least to be THINKING about the possibility of a less-wide option. That's certainly encouraging.

[mariob33]

As promised, here is a pic of the STC (Sierra Tower Center) next to a CMT-340C cabinet. This is the "official" first protoype cabinet. We still have to come up with a grille design while somehow trying to avoid increasing the cabinet height...

No doubt this is a large "boxy" center speaker but it is a perfect performance match with the Sierra Tower. Incredible dynamics and vocal clarity!

Dave,

When can one preorder one of these as well:D. Even if kinks are being worked. Would be nice to match up with my soon shipping towers(I hope:o). I started this to replace family room setup but looks like this will be getting top billing in the dedicated theater.

[choirbass]

Well, Dave seems at least to be THINKING about the possibility of a less-wide option. That's certainly encouraging.

Differences would seem to be more preferable, albeit at a said cost increase. For me it's largely the height that is noticeable more than anything, and that in itself isn't even a big deal. It's more of a visual difference compared to current speakers than anything else. But just the same, in would seem a fairly large improvement acoustically too. A worthwhile tradeoff at that IMO.

[scape]

great looking center dave! it is indeed much larger, but it looks like a real performer that you'd stack behind a projector screen or be lucky enough to squeeze below a flatpanel tv. it looks like in the effort to build an amazing center channel, you just created the need for an inbetween ascend product (somewhere between the SC and STC). I guess we can't have it all ways (form factor and top sound quality). i for one would like to have the tweeter above that mid, as I read that is one of the best layouts for a center, but it also looks like you're out of room as far as squeezing it down any shorter.
either way, great work :) I have a feeling this new even higher end product will bring in a few more new comers to the ascend-owners family

[davef]

We just received all of the final packaging materials for the Sierra Towers and I am very happy with the quality.

Upon recommendation from the packaging company, we are not double boxing these speakers, instead we are using a single box which is double wall and has a 500 lb/sq inch burst rating. The box is more like a crate than a typical cardboard box and as usual, our packaging is overkill for these speakers. We prefer not to take any chances though ;)

Our flat rate domestic ground shipping per pair will be $96.00. We expect to finally start shipping later next week :) I can't wait and it will be very nice to finally come up for air ;)

Attached are some pics of the packaging.

[Spdr77]

Beefy looking boxes :)

Dave, have you considered a W-M-T-M-W configuration with the prototype center speaker?

[gorthocar]

... We expect to finally start shipping later next week :) I can't wait and it will be very nice to finally come up for air ;)

That's great news, but who said you could come up for air until you finish the STC? ;)

But seriously, it sounds like a major accomplishment to wrangle everything together to get the Sierra Towers rolling. Sometimes my projects at the office drive me into the ground until I wrap up a major milestone, and afterwards I desperately need some down time to catch my breath.

[davef]

Hi Guys...

Spent much of the afternoon at our cabinet maker inspecting the finishes and going over some final details on how to ship the cabinets to us. They expect to deliver the cabinets to us by next Thursday and we hope to start assembly and shipping that same day :)

BTW, the cabinets simply look fantastic and they nailed the finish color for the naturals, espresso and dark cherry. The satin espresso is my new favorite, but this seems to vary every month.

I only had my iPhone with me but I did manage to take some pictures to share with you.

Enjoy!!

[Sam1000]

just out of curiosity. Is there no damping material for the mid driver enclosure?

[davef]

just out of curiosity. Is there no damping material for the mid driver enclosure?

We use a different kind of damping material for the midrange woofer enclosure. It is a pillow stuffing type of Dacron rather than an adhered batting material. The precise amount is weighed at our facility and we install it prior to inserting the woofer. The entire small enclosure is actually packed fairly tight with Dacron in order to reach our desired "Q" and absorb rear-wave reflections.

It is handled a bit differently since this is a sealed enclosure.

[bilesteve]

I really like the cherry finishes, I like reds.

[Jonnyozero3]

Great pics, Dave. Lots of work coming to fruition. :) The colored finishes almost make me wish I got one. That said, I can't wait to see the gloss black in person.

[davef]

With the STC being 28" wide, it will be fairly close to my HTPC. This may sound like a dumb question because most of us have gone to LCD or plasma HDTVs, but is the STC going to be mag shielded? I don't want it to wipe the hard drive in my HTPC. :eek:

Like with our Sierra-1, there will be an additional fee for magnetic shielding. However, you absolutely DO NOT need the speaker to be magnetically shielded even if your HTPC is sitting directly on top of the speaker :) This is one of the most widely misunderstood issues...

To cause data corruption to a hard drive, one must apply a minimum of about 2500 gauss to the external shell of the unit. I have never seen a typical loudspeaker radiate more than 100 gauss measured at only one inch away.

Here is a good example, our production line PC test station is only about 12 inches away from the loudspeaker under test. In the past 12 years, at least 50K loudspeakers have been tested in this setup and we often leave loudspeakers on the production line overnight and over the weekend. In other words, this PC has been subject to the magnetic field of our loudspeakers almost continuously for the past 12 years. Absolutely no problems :)

[davef]

It's the width that's a problem for me; can't go wider than 23" (but could go even higher). Please think about a custom variation with this form factor.

We are currently in the process of a quick redesign of the center. Since depth does not seem to be an issue, the redesign dimensions are 23" wide and 12.5" deep. This keeps the cabinet volume the same.


Just curious,
are the woofers desined to work in sealed box?
What is the purpose\advantage to have the low end just like the towers when it comes to center channel.
thanks

The woofers are not designed to work in a completely sealed cabinet. With the low end performance, keeping the cabinet volume for the woofers the same is important as it also keeps bass alignment the same as the towers and this is important to allow the Sierra Towers and the Sierra Center to achieve the same integration with a subwoofer... A low crossover point is highly recommended for both the Sierra Towers and the STC.


Would this centre channel also work well with two Sierra bookshelves as left and rights, if one didn't have the room for the towers, or would it overpower them? I've heard people say the centre channel is the most important, and this thing definitely looks important. :D

Most definitely -- this is a fantastic center!


It looks like this centre is easily study enough, and fashionable enough, to use as a TV stand! Also, I think it would look better under the TV than over, because it is so large. The problem is, since I like the TV fairly low to the floor (zen style I suppose), perhaps just 1.5 feet off the floor, this would mean that the centre would be that much closer to the floor, and would have to be angled up quite a bit. Would this be a problem for the sound? (If angled, it could no longer be used as as TV stand, drats. Unless the baffle itself was angled. But that's probably a bridge too far... )

Mark

The STC cabinet is made from the same bamboo as our Tower and Sierra-1. This laminated bamboo is ridiculously sturdy and the cabinet is well braced. I don't think this cabinet would have a problem supporting even a 35" CRT television :) Any size LCD, Plasma or DLP will not be a problem.

18" off the floor will be OK.

[avsnoob10]

Dave: Is there a Sierra-1 in high gloss (instead of Piano Black) finish to match Sierra Tower (ST) and Center's (STC) finishes if one wants to use Sierra-1 as surround speaker?

[millerwill]

We are currently in the process of a quick redesign of the center. Since depth does not seem to be an issue, the redesign dimensions are 23" wide and 12.5" deep. This keeps the cabinet volume the same

Wow, this is exciting, Dave! I'm would be interested in a bamboo 'natural'. Any possibility of trading in a Sierra Center? And height is still 10 7/8?

[davef]

Dave: Is there a Sierra-1 in high gloss (instead of Piano Black) finish to match Sierra Tower (ST) and Center's (STC) finishes if one wants to use Sierra-1 as surround speaker?

Not officially, but we can do this is as a custom finish for you. There would be some additional fees for the finishing but they shouldn't be too bad.

[BinaryLinguist]

Given that the STC can comfortably support my 50" Kuro, I am definitely in. Can't wait!

[Spdr77]

Yes -- they definitely could but to get the same low end performance as the Towers, the cabinet volume needs to be the exact same as the tower...

As I understand it, you need 23" wide.... I will do some additional modeling and see what works. I would like to try and avoid increasing the depth (10 1/2") and height (10 7/8").


Dave,

Any chance of a W-M-T-M-W design for the center channel? I know that it would take away a bit from being a perfect match for the towers but the reduction in height could be worth it? I can only speak for myself but I would gladly take more depth than height. As another user also pointed out, there are many different manufacturers that have centers in the 13-15 inch range for depth. I'm no expert but I would think that the reduction of height for an increase in depth would make the speaker a more attractive offering on a mass scale. Whatever is decided for the dimensions and design, I have total confidence that it will be a great speaker.

[TomK]

Dave,
Thanks for the pictures. My heart is racing, I see my Naturals in all their raging beauty. Would it be inappropriate to ask Dina Lynn to plant a kiss on each one for good luck!?

If not, how about your autograph on the back?

All My Best,
TomK

[Tower]

Anybody know where is my towers?

[Jonnyozero3]

Indeed. How is babby formed?!

[curtis]

Nice to come back from vacation to see some new pictures!

[davidknunes@yahoo.com]

Tower, it's pretty safe to say your towers are in Cal-i-for-ni-a (along with mine).

Just a few more weeks guys.....you can do it.......you'll survive the wait (most likely).

[davef]

Anybody know where is my towers?


Tower, it's pretty safe to say your towers are in Cal-i-for-ni-a (along with mine).

Just a few more weeks guys.....you can do it.......you'll survive the wait (most likely).

I am very happy to report that we have confirmed delivery of the Sierra Tower cabinets for this Thursday. Shipping of the towers will begin this Friday and aside for various special orders, we hope to have all of the backorders shipped within 10 business days. I absolutely do not want to rush assembly :)

Thankfully, as of today I believe we have completed about 95% of the invoicing / billing. This truly saves us a ton of time :)

Thanks so much for allowing us to proceed in this manner.

[scape]

I am very happy to report that we have confirmed delivery of the Sierra Tower cabinets for this Thursday. Shipping of the towers will begin this Friday and aside for various special orders, we hope to have all of the backorders shipped within 10 business days. I absolutely do not want to rush assembly :)

can't wait to have the website updated so i can drool over more details and reread over and over :)

[davef]

Dave,

Any chance of a W-M-T-M-W design for the center channel? I know that it would take away a bit from being a perfect match for the towers but the reduction in height could be worth it? I can only speak for myself but I would gladly take more depth than height. As another user also pointed out, there are many different manufacturers that have centers in the 13-15 inch range for depth. I'm no expert but I would think that the reduction of height for an increase in depth would make the speaker a more attractive offering on a mass scale. Whatever is decided for the dimensions and design, I have total confidence that it will be a great speaker.

The real key to the fantastic midrange performance of the Sierra Tower is the combination and integration of the midrange woofer and tweeter.

A W-M-T-M-W design, using the same components as the tower, will offer extremely poor off-axis performance, such that there would be a very large amount of lobing even at only 10-12 degrees off axis (horizontally).

The technique to solve this type of lobing issue with a horizontal MTM is to use a very low tweeter crossover point. We could do this as the NrT dome performs well down low, however, the low crossover point defeats the purpose of having the dedicated midrange driver...

I most certainly understand that the height might be too much for many people (about 10 3/4") but Ascend Acoustics has always been more about performance-per-dollar than looks. A W-M-T-M-W design will be extremely expensive and will simply not offer a performance-per-dollar ratio that I would be comfortable with.

A W-M-T-W (horizontal) would cost less and have better performance.

We have now redesigned the STC cabinet with a width of 23” and depth of 12.5” I am quite pleased with the result – it really looks much smaller and there has been no compromise on performance. We are just working on the best way to front port the cabinet, by either slot porting – which is now a bit more complicated, or by using (2) Sierra-1 port tubes.

[millerwill]

We have now redesigned the STC cabinet with a width of 23” and depth of 12.5” I am quite pleased with the result – it really looks much smaller and there has been no compromise on performance. We are just working on the best way to front port the cabinet, by either slot porting – which is now a bit more complicated, or by using (2) Sierra-1 port tubes.

This is great news! Really looking forward to this one.

[wired4sound]

Dave,

Just wondering if Ascend will be at RMAF (October), and if so, will the Tower and/or Center make its debut?

[hearing specialist]

Man, what I wouldn't give to represent Ascend at this event :D

[malaplace]

So did my Towers ship today? :)

[Tower]

So did my Towers ship today? :)

Just received tracking numbers,

[malaplace]

Darn. Guess I'm not in the first shipments.

[scape]

just out of curiosity, what amp are people planning on using with the towers?
and if dave's listening, i'd like to know what he's got in his listening room as far as amp goes :)

[davef]

So did my Towers ship today? :)


Just received tracking numbers,


Darn. Guess I'm not in the first shipments.

Hi Guys,

Sorry for being out of touch over the past 24 hours. I have some good news and some bad news.

First the good, the cabinets look terrific and I will attach a few pics I just took with my phone.

The bad news is that we felt that the grille cloth material on the grilles was too loose, that when they assembled it they did not stretch the cloth enough. The vendor was here today and confirmed our findings.

They are going to re-work the grilles and I will pick up the new grilles Monday evening. So nice to have our cabinet vendor local to us :)

The first shipments will be delayed until Tuesday. In the meantime, we are building up the cabinets as scheduled.

I sincerely apologize for this last minute delay... It is really a simple fix and our cabinet maker also wants you be very happy.

Also, after seeing the cabinets in our facility (finally), I think my new favorite finish is the naturals. They are stunning!!!

[millerwill]

Boy, the naturals do look beautiful!

[davef]

Boy, the naturals do look beautiful!

Yep -- gorgeous, and so worry free with regard to finger prints and dust etc. These are what will eventually be going in my home :D

[curtis]

Those ALL look nice!!


just out of curiosity, what amp are people planning on using with the towers?
and if dave's listening, i'd like to know what he's got in his listening room as far as amp goes :)
In the demo room, Dave has an ADA 6150 amp, and a Rotel pre/pro.

[TomK]

Who wants flabby grill cloth? Once again Dave has shown that NO speaker will be shipped until it meets his very high standards. My Naturals look great. But then again they ALL look great. As for amps used with the Towers; I'll be using a Rogue Cronus Magnum tube amp with 95 sweet, silky amps per channel. The Towers are only being used for SACD stereo. My 340 classics are being used for Front R, L, C and the old 240s for LS, RS Home Theater. Since I like action movies they have taken a beating. And when my wife plays music you can hear it in the next zip code. However they still sound so good!

[Jonnyozero3]

Great photos, Dave. Thanks for sharing! Everytime I look at these pics I rethink my finish choice (even though it is too late, lol)

I'm curious - why are the inside of the mid driver's enclosures finished? Hard to see, but it seems like the inside of the cabinet is unfinished otherwise. Any particular reason?

[davef]

Great photos, Dave. Thanks for sharing! Everytime I look at these pics I rethink my finish choice (even though it is too late, lol)

It is still possible to switch finishes, as long as we still have an available pair for the finish you are interested in.


I'm curious - why are the inside of the mid driver's enclosures finished? Hard to see, but it seems like the inside of the cabinet is unfinished otherwise. Any particular reason?

I think what you are seeing is just excess spray from the finishing process on the inside of the midrange enclosure. This section is a small sealed enclosure so when they spray, the excess does not dissipate as much and more gets on the internal walls as compared to the larger main enclosure of the cabinet.

[simple man]

simply amazing!!!! I want them!!

[millerwill]

Yep -- gorgeous, and so worry free with regard to finger prints and dust etc. These are what will eventually be going in my home :D

Any estimate, Dave, how long we have to wait to see similar cabinets for the new Tower Center?

[JustaSheep]

Great photos, Dave. Thanks for sharing! Everytime I look at these pics I rethink my finish choice (even though it is too late, lol)

I'm curious - why are the inside of the mid driver's enclosures finished? Hard to see, but it seems like the inside of the cabinet is unfinished otherwise. Any particular reason?

I am the same way! I've already called to change the finish once and I'm still not sure. The natural's are my first choice, but just don't fit the decor. :(

High-gloss is my second choice, very classic look, but the wife said she doesn't like it. :mad:

So, on to the safe satin black option. Maybe I'll just change to natural and tell her Ascend messed up the order!:rolleyes:

That's so simple, it just might work!

[davef]

We just finished assembling and testing a pair of custom finished high gloss dark cherry cabinets for a customer who will be picking them up tomorrow.

I took a few quicks pics from my cell phone... Wow is about all I can say, these look amazing! A very classy look...

[mariob33]

We just finished assembling and testing a pair of custom finished high gloss dark cherry cabinets for a customer who will be picking them up tomorrow.

I took a few quicks pics from my cell phone... Wow is about all I can say, these look amazing! A very classy look...
Wow that is one handsome devil..

[curtis]

That looks really nice!

[davidknunes@yahoo.com]

Okay, now I'm salivating, and joining the "can't wait" crowd.

Just a little more time..........hope I don't explode before then.

Let us know when you have any "black beauty" pictures to post (or any other finishes). :)

[davef]

Let us know when you have any "black beauty" pictures to post (or any other finishes). :)

I plan on posting a few pics of various finishes each day as we assemble. Today was not as productive as I would have liked, slow and methodical as assembly commenced. Tomorrow should prove to be much more productive as we now have various assembly procedures squared away.

I will also keep the "good camera" here at the office and ready to go :p

[mariob33]

I plan on posting a few pics of various finishes each day as we assemble. Today was not as productive as I would have liked, slow and methodical as assembly commenced. Tomorrow should prove to be much more productive as we now have various assembly procedures squared away.

I will also keep the "good camera" here at the office and ready to go :p

So do we expect a good nuber of these to ship tomorrow maybe :)

[kissell]

Those speakers look fantastic! Better start saving...

Any chance you could post some pics with grills on?

[malaplace]

Wow, those are stunning. If I didn't already have a piano black center and rythmik sub (which I will be keeping), I would reconsider that or other custom finish. Very nice.

[Jonnyozero3]

Wow, those are stunning. If I didn't already have a piano black center and rythmik sub (which I will be keeping), I would reconsider that or other custom finish. Very nice.

That's the boat I'm in too - I really like many of the finishes, but with other gloss black Sierra-1's and Rythmik's...they'd just be mismatched.

Though, a friend's wife did ask why my speakers had mirrors on them the other day while watching a movie. Doh!

[gorthocar]

That's the boat I'm in too - I really like many of the finishes, but with other gloss black Sierra-1's and Rythmik's...they'd just be mismatched.

Though, a friend's wife did ask why my speakers had mirrors on them the other day while watching a movie. Doh!

That's exactly why I chose the black sand / flat black finish. These will go in my home theater. All these shiny and glossy finishes look fantastic, but I know the reflections would be really distracting while watching movies.

[Jonnyozero3]

*I* don't find them distracting. Hehe :)

[mariob33]

I guess we are waiting another day..:). Getting a bit antsy just waiting..

[davef]

Crazy busy day today... Please be patient with us, it is a complex balancing act between working quickly and being extremely careful. We all worked close to 12 hours today and I am still going :o

We had several local pickups today, including 2 demos.

Here are a few more iPhone pics of a pair of Satin Espresso's with the custom RAAL ribbon tweeter upgrade. These pics are not good but I wanted to give you something. I do plan on taking some better pictures of these tomorrow, there simply wasn't enough time in the day today (or enough coffee)

To those who visited us today -- if you are reading this, please post your thoughts and pcitures of YOUR Sierra Towers :)

Thanks and enjoy!

[tmd24]

Hello all,

I picked up my high gloss dark cherry towers earlier tonight. I took some pictures but they are not great quality. I'm a horrible photographer and the lighting is not ideal at the moment. These will do for now. I'll try to convince my friend to come over this weekend to take better pics.

Before doing so, I'd like to thank Dave, Dina and everyone at Ascend Acoustics for these gorgeous speakers. The pictures do them no justice. You really need to see all the various finishes in person in order to appreciate how beautiful they are!

http://www.switchout.com/images/ascend/003.JPGhttp://www.switchout.com/images/ascend/004.JPG


http://www.switchout.com/images/ascend/001.JPG

http://www.switchout.com/images/ascend/002.JPG

http://www.switchout.com/images/ascend/005.JPG

[Mag_Neato]

Awesome pics guys!

Those ribbons have my curiosity. Can't wait to hear the impressions of them, especially compared to the domes.

[merrymaid520]

Tmd24,
Nice speakers and system! Do let us know how they sound;)

[khoi911]

I have been lurking and reading and I have a dumb question. There has been no mention of price? Did I miss that thread?

[billy p]

I have been lurking and reading and I have a dumb question. There has been no mention of price? Did I miss that thread?

Dave had mentioned some prices in this post..http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/showpost.php?p=37574&postcount=251


As for the new towers WOW...I am really enjoying my 1's and if I could switch my 2 listening rooms I'd almost certainly trade up...we'll see in the next few months what happens...but those things are beautiful.....

[davef]

Hello all,

I picked up my high gloss dark cherry towers earlier tonight. I took some pictures but they are not great quality. I'm a horrible photographer and the lighting is not ideal at the moment. These will do for now. I'll try to convince my friend to come over this weekend to take better pics.

Before doing so, I'd like to thank Dave, Dina and everyone at Ascend Acoustics for these gorgeous speakers. The pictures do them no justice. You really need to see all the various finishes in person in order to appreciate how beautiful they are!

http://www.switchout.com/images/ascend/005.JPG

Wow -- they look fantastic in your room!!! You definitely made the right decision in your choice of finish.

I hope you find some time over the weekend to enjoy them.

...And thank YOU :)

[tmd24]

Tmd24,
Nice speakers and system! Do let us know how they sound;)

My impressions so far are wow and wow. One for sound and the other for looks. I moved these towers in place of my Sierra-1 non-NRT bookshelves. The highs feel more open with the NRT tweeters and the output is just amazing. Bass is authoritative and mids are silky smooth. I threw on Eric Clapton's Unplugged and was just taken aback on the "Layla" track. These speakers are worth every penny. :)

[tmd24]

Wow -- they look fantastic in your room!!! You definitely made the right decision in your choice of finish.

I hope you find some time over the weekend to enjoy them.

...And thank YOU :)

Thanks! Yes, I'm loving them and am looking forward to this weekend. :)

[merrymaid520]

Dave,
Quick question. I bought some of the polish you had recomended and it works great. The only issue I struggle with is the finishing polish which leaves a bit of a haze. I have quite a few very good car waxes/polishes (very mild), are these acceptable to use on the Towers? I use all Zaino car products and they work very well.
http://www.zainostore.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=Z-AIO&Category_Code=Zaino&Product_Count=6
http://www.zainostore.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=Z-5&Category_Code=Zaino&Product_Count=10

The Piano Black is definitely high maintanence:eek:

Thanks,
Brandon

[kamaboko]

Any chance of an all bamboo speaker cab for the towers? I like that natural bamboo finish.

[bigyela]

any tower owners in virginia?

i'm in the richmond area, very curious about these speakers.

[merrymaid520]

Any chance of an all bamboo speaker cab for the towers? I like that natural bamboo finish.

They are all solid bamboo, and a natural version is available.
See this post..
http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/showpost.php?p=37920&postcount=419

[Jonnyozero3]

Dave,
Quick question. I bought some of the polish you had recomended and it works great. The only issue I struggle with is the finishing polish which leaves a bit of a haze. I have quite a few very good car waxes/polishes (very mild), are these acceptable to use on the Towers? I use all Zaino car products and they work very well.
http://www.zainostore.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=Z-AIO&Category_Code=Zaino&Product_Count=6
http://www.zainostore.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=Z-5&Category_Code=Zaino&Product_Count=10

The Piano Black is definitely high maintanence:eek:

Thanks,
Brandon

I'm interested to hear the answer to this as well. I've got a bunch of auto products in my garage too:

Ultima
Klasse AIO/SG
S100
Meg's NXT 2.0

[curtis]

Any chance of an all bamboo speaker cab for the towers? I like that natural bamboo finish.


They are all solid bamboo, and a natural version is available.
See this post..
http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/showpost.php?p=37920&postcount=419
As mm says, the Towers (and Sierras) all have bamboo cabinets. The only differences are the finishes.

[sdheda]

To those who visited us today -- if you are reading this, please post your thoughts and pcitures of YOUR Sierra Towers :)

Thanks and enjoy!

I was one of the lucky ones to be able to pickup my speakers from Dave. I just set them up last night and only have a couple of hours on them, but I instantly noticed more detail and clarity compared to the sound I was used to from my regular Sierra-1's.

While I was at the Ascend facility I was also able to compare the towers with the dome tweeter to the ribbon tweeter. To me the most noticeable difference is in the vocals. The presentation from the dome tweeter was little more forward compared to the ribbon. The ribbon also seemed to have more "air" (don't know if that's the best word to describe it), which must be due to its higher frequency response. Both had detail, but the dome tweeter had more pop to it compared to the ribbon which was more subtle. An interesting thing we noticed was that in some tracks, there was hardly any difference between the two. While in others, you could hear the difference right away. In the end, Dave and I both agreed that the ribbon tweeter is for someone who does more critical listening, while the dome tweeter is good for someone who does a mix of home theater and 2-channel.

Overall, I am very satisfied with the Towers. I expect that they will only get better as they are broken in.

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-5aKuQDLpnp0/Tk3cbU4nepI/AAAAAAAAANU/rHUhOPqyAxI/s800/IMG_20110818_204103.jpg

[millerwill]

We have now redesigned the STC cabinet with a width of 23” and depth of 12.5” I am quite pleased with the result – it really looks much smaller and there has been no compromise on performance. We are just working on the best way to front port the cabinet, by either slot porting – which is now a bit more complicated, or by using (2) Sierra-1 port tubes.

I just re-read this post, Dave, and also looked at the pics of the Towers on pg 1 of this thread. From the pics, it's obvious that the Towers have a major rear port. How about the Tower Center? You note above that it has a front port; does it also have a rear port?

[GaryB]

Originally Posted by davef http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/showthread.php?p=37894#post37894)
We have now redesigned the STC cabinet with a width of 23” and depth of 12.5” I am quite pleased with the result – it really looks much smaller and there has been no compromise on performance. We are just working on the best way to front port the cabinet, by either slot porting – which is now a bit more complicated, or by using (2) Sierra-1 port tubes.

I suggest you reread the Dave's post again (I have quoted it above and emphasized the parts relevant to your question)... I think he expressed his intentions quite clearly. There's no mention of a rear port, nor should we expect to see one. :)

[JustaSheep]

So, I have a question that I have not seen addressed yet while I'm patiently waiting for the towers to arrive. What will (or should anyone) use for surrounds in a 5.1 setup with the new towers (and soon to be STC)?

Make that two questions...Given MM's findings regarding crossing over at 40hz (correct me if I'm wrong...wait, this is a forum, of course I'll be corrected:p) and running the towers as Large, would this change your approach to a subwoofer? I'm more interested in clarity from the bass than depth, so does the low reach of the towers affect your outlook on a sub or would you still base it solely on the size of room and listening habits(Edit: Assuming a high-quality sub like the Rhythmik product)?

Thanks in advance, all.

[johnk]

My family room is all set, just waiting for the Towers. While waiting, I moved my (non-Nrt) Sierra-1s into the spots that will eventually belong to the Towers, and I have to say I can't get over how brilliant the Sierra-1s are. I've listened (large, no sub) to Pink Floyd, Amy Winehouse, Brian Eno ("Apollo") and Van Halen, and if the Towers are noticeably better, then they will be something.

[curtis]

So, I have a question that I have not seen addressed yet while I'm patiently waiting for the towers to arrive. What will (or should anyone) use for surrounds in a 5.1 setup with the new towers (and soon to be STC)?

Make that two questions...Given MM's findings regarding crossing over at 40hz (correct me if I'm wrong...wait, this is a forum, of course I'll be corrected:p) and running the towers as Large, would this change your approach to a subwoofer? I'm more interested in clarity from the bass than depth, so does the low reach of the towers affect your outlook on a sub or would you still base it solely on the size of room and listening habits(Edit: Assuming a high-quality sub like the Rhythmik product)?

Thanks in advance, all.
I think any speaker from Ascend will work well as surrounds with the Towers. It really depends on what kind of level you want a match.

As for MM's crossover and subwoofer settings, it is really room and preference dependent. I would play around with different configurations/settings to see what works best.

[millerwill]

I suggest you reread the Dave's post again (I have quoted it above and emphasized the parts relevant to your question)... I think he expressed his intentions quite clearly. There's no mention of a rear port, nor should we expect to see one. :)

OK, very good--thanks. It just wasn't clear to me. (E.g., the Sierra's are rear-ported.)

[GaryB]

You're welcome. I just noticed that in my reply to you I referred to Dave as "the Dave"... a typo, I promise. The Donald, The Dave... :D

[mpod]

My Towers (in sand black) just arrived yesterday. Unfortunately there's some small problems with the bases, so no pictures yet, but in the meantime I had questions about using the included spikes.

The included instructions say "Use of the spiked feet is optional but recommended." My main question is probably "how recommended?" :) I'll be putting these on hard laminate floors (nice and flat, so leveling will not be an added benefit). It would be nice to be able to move the speakers for vacuuming and such. I was planning on just putting the included rubber feet on each corner until I read the instructions and saw the spiking info.

I'd never known of speaker spiking until this and now of course a complete expert after 30 minutes of web searching. Except for the small part that it's still unclear to me how much benefits they may or may not provide. I was also wondering if I did spike them and use the metal floor "protector" discs if any spike advantages would be lessened by putting the circular rubber pads underneath the discs (or something similar but better sized for the spike discs)?

If it helps at all, the speakers will be used for a combination of HT and music, probably more frequently for HT. They'll be 1-2 feet from the wall, and the primary couch seating position is about 10 feet from that wall. The overall space is 20x20, but includes a kitchen counter and hanging cabinets behind the couch forming more of a 12x12 living room area (with 8' of extra space to the one side). Laminate flooring everywhere, 8' ceilings, no real damping materials like an area rug or whatnot (although I have one I could potentially put under the couch/coffee table area).

Thanks for any input!

[curtis]

Try it both ways. If you like with the spikes, then decide if the trouble it take to move the speakers around is worth it. If you can't hear a difference, then don't use them.

[BinaryLinguist]

I have found benefits to using spikes when I had towers on a hardwood floor with a basement underneath. Then again, I might have wanted to hear a difference... :o

Other than that, I like spikes in order to protect the finish on the bottom of the towers so they don't lay on my floors. As you mention, cleaning and needing to move towers that are spiked and balanced on the discs can be difficult. In the past, I bought spikes from here:

http://www.taylorsales.com/SuperSpikes.htm

The spike and the disc are all one piece so they make the towers very easy to move. I haven't bought any yet for my soon to arrive Sierra Towers... Going to check out what's included first.

[GirgleMirt]

http://www.taylorsales.com/SuperSpikes.htm

The spike and the disc are all one piece so they make the towers very easy to move.
lol

The idea of spikes is that they can pierce through the carpet and get a solid foothold on the wood underneath. If you tried using pads on carpet, you might find the towers a bit tipsy and unstable as the towers float over the carpet...

So on hardwood, you really don't need spikes. Those superspikes seem like a ripoff because they essentially become regular feet. They are essentially useless as they could do away with the whole spike thing and it would make absolutely no difference! How twisted is the audio world that somehow spikes are now so important that you even need to put them on equipment stands (amps, cd players, etc..), and that you can even get feet which have useless spikes in them?! :eek:

[Blutarsky]

http://shop.bestwoodfloor.com/product.aspx?id=94

I use these on my speakers with wood floors. They make the speakers easy to move, even in tiny increments. I place small, round, removeable color coding labels to mark different spots for set-up. I used to have spikes over carpet. totally difficult to move and set up.

[davef]

Hi Guys,

Sorry for the delay.

As promised, some decent pictures of a pair of Satin Espresso Sierra Towers with the RAAL tweeter upgrade.

Enjoy!

[merrymaid520]

I'm liking the look with the RT upgrade:) Dave, can you address my question from a page back about automotive polishes on the Piano black towers?

Thanks!

[markie]

Wow! So elegant and stately. Amazing job!

[steven1110]

Oh seeing those espresso's pains me. I can't wait until all of my lightning damaged electronics are finally fixed so I can have my espresso pair shipped out. In the meantime, I'm just going to stare at the pictures for a while. :)

[malaplace]

Any thoughts on electronics to drive the new Towers? I have been using my Onkyo 3008 to drive the Sierra 1s in a 3.1 configuration in a large open room. I understand the Towers will present a slightly different load on my current amp. Am I going to be making excuses for getting a new amp soon?

[merrymaid520]

Any thoughts on electronics to drive the new Towers? I have been using my Onkyo 3008 to drive the Sierra 1s in a 3.1 configuration in a large open room. I understand the Towers will present a slightly different load on my current amp. Am I going to be making excuses for getting a new amp soon?

You are doing a fine job of that already:) The Towers are more efficient than your sierras, I recommend trying them first with your receiver before indulging in a new amp:)

[joez28ls1]

You are doing a fine job of that already:) The Towers are more efficient than your sierras, I recommend trying them first with your receiver before indulging in a new amp:)

I'm moving from a Panny SA-XR55 to an Anthem MRX300 to use with my soon to have Sierra Towers. Mainly wanted to move to an HDMI capable receiver and new speakers were a great excuse! Okay, felt like I had to tell somebody besides my wife who couldn't care less :)

[edmondwolfman]

Hi Guys,

Sorry for the delay.

As promised, some decent pictures of a pair of Satin Espresso Sierra Towers with the RAAL tweeter upgrade.

Enjoy!

I may have missed this somewhere but do the RAALs use the same crossover as the NrTs?

[Sam1000]

I'm moving from a Panny SA-XR55 to an Anthem MRX300 to use with my soon to have Sierra Towers. Mainly wanted to move to an HDMI capable receiver and new speakers were a great excuse! Okay, felt like I had to tell somebody besides my wife who couldn't care less :)

Let us know how the combination works with Anthem..

xr-55 was a good receiver for the money and I still have it in the garage as a backup :-)

[joez28ls1]

Let us know how the combination works with Anthem..

xr-55 was a good receiver for the money and I still have it in the garage as a backup :-)

Will do. Yes, I've been very hesitent to move away from the XR55 because I really like the sound of it. Hopefully the Anthem won't disappoint me!

[merrymaid520]

I may have missed this somewhere but do the RAALs use the same crossover as the NrTs?

Nope, different XO.

[Sam1000]

I may have missed this somewhere but do the RAALs use the same crossover as the NrTs?

See here..
http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/showpost.php?p=37768&postcount=352

[edmondwolfman]

See here..
http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/showpost.php?p=37768&postcount=352

Thank you. As much as I like reading the posts in the forum this thread is getting rather lengthy:D

[TomK]

Merrymaid520,
As Towers are beginning to ship, do you have any suggestions about breaking them in? How long did it take for you to beak in the Towers? Any special music? Loud, soft volume? How are they sounding? We need an update please.
Thanks,
Tom

[merrymaid520]

Merrymaid520,
As Towers are beginning to ship, do you have any suggestions about breaking them in? How long did it take for you to beak in the Towers? Any special music? Loud, soft volume? How are they sounding? We need an update please.
Thanks,
Tom

Hey Tom,
To be honest, I have never really been able to discern any noticeable differences while a speaker breaks in. To me, they always sound extremely similar new as they do after many hours of listening. On a side note, they sound awesome right now:) I have been messing aorund with placement and Toe in / out and think I have them right where they sound best to me.

I know some folks have taken delivery and even some Ribbon version owners, please keep us all updated on your impressions.

[hearing specialist]

Heh Tom, my opinion on "break in" is that most don't notice until they re-calibrate the room after a month or so and realize a different sound with all else the same. Now this is geared for more of the Home Theater bunch vs. the 2 channel guys where room correction is not used or not used the same.

Now because I'm into the room correction schemes and creating different "sound fields" is my thing, I do notice a measured difference when using the Pro EQ side of my Elite receiver when using new drivers and allowance of said drivers to "relax" their suspensions. Because a speaker is mechanical there will be a difference new vs. used a little and running electricity thru the voice coil especially calibrating with a 75db level consistently thru the first few months of use, imo.

For those of you fine gents that private message me, my newest thing in room correction is i've mixed my Elite "Front Alignment" program with the "All Channel Adjust" program (Flat) to achieve a "Audyssey" like program. In essence its allowing the mains to share their unique audio signature while forcing the rear side surrounds to maintain a flat response creating a very different high resolution sound while still keeping the time alignment, levels, full frequency phase control, and 3 point standing wave measurements. I don't want to "out-think" what I can't outhink there but providing trim adjustment in 1db steps for the side surrounds creating a huge, tall, and you'd swear there were height channels type sound. Took about 4.5 hours to make that sound. This would be awesome for the new towers! :D


Brian in Bakersfield...

[Sam1000]

I'm one of the Tower owner with the Ribbon.

I have not played with placement and did not have much time yesterday to listen to the music, however, we were watching a BBC serial last night on Netflix called 'ArchAngel'. I was having a hard time following the dialogs, so I changed the pre-pro to stereo mode thus engaging only the towers and could hear immediate improvement.

In some of the music I heard briefly, the drums and percussion instruments were airy and transparent.

Will listen to some female voice recording today and to a mental comparison with Sierra.
Imogen Heap - Track 'Blanket' from Jeff Becks Blu-Ray.
Diana Reeves - SOudtrack of 'Good Night and Good Luck'
Diana Krall - 'Live in Paris' dvd

[davef]

Dave,
Quick question. I bought some of the polish you had recomended and it works great. The only issue I struggle with is the finishing polish which leaves a bit of a haze. I have quite a few very good car waxes/polishes (very mild), are these acceptable to use on the Towers? I use all Zaino car products and they work very well.
http://www.zainostore.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=Z-AIO&Category_Code=Zaino&Product_Count=6
http://www.zainostore.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=Z-5&Category_Code=Zaino&Product_Count=10

The Piano Black is definitely high maintanence:eek:

Thanks,
Brandon

Hi Brandon,

Which finishing polish are you using?

With regard to the Zaino products, I have no experience with these but the polyester finish on your towers is tough and I would imagine that a good car polish should work great. Try it on the back of the speaker just to be safe.

[merrymaid520]

Hi Brandon,

Which finishing polish are you using?

With regard to the Zaino products, I have no experience with these but the polyester finish on your towers is tough and I would imagine that a good car polish should work great. Try it on the back of the speaker just to be safe.

Hi Dave,
I have both products on hand. The green bottle is a touch more "agressive" meaning it removes mild swirls imperfections etc. The other "Z-5" is for the final coat removing very fine/minor swirls etc. I am a car waxing nut, so if you feel like the Tower finish on my pair is that tough, these should be fine. I will try a bit on the back to make sure. Its the "haze" I am trying to remove after cleaning them up:)
edit - neither product I listed requires buffing meaning they do not remove the top coat in the case of auto finishes by introducing more blemishes. They are essentially just protectants that safely remove surface imperfections.
Thanks!

[edmondwolfman]

Hi Dave,
I have both products on hand. The green bottle is a touch more "agressive" meaning it removes mild swirls imperfections etc. The other "Z-5" is for the final coat removing very fine/minor swirls etc. I am a car waxing nut, so if you feel like the Tower finish on my pair is that tough, these should be fine. I will try a bit on the back to make sure. Its the "haze" I am trying to remove after cleaning them up:)
edit - neither product I listed requires buffing meaning they do not remove the top coat in the case of auto finishes by introducing more blemishes. They are essentially just protectants that safely remove surface imperfections.
Thanks!

Brandon, quit rubbing them with those tissues that are impregnated with lotion:D

[merrymaid520]

Brandon, quit rubbing them with those tissues that are impregnated with lotion:D

Ha! Actually I use a product Dave had recommended for polishing out little imprefections and it worked great but the final product (2 step process) always leaves a slight haze which is tough to buff off. I am very familar with my Zaino car products and thought why not try those, they dont leave any smears on my balck truck:D

[soundseeker]

Ha! Actually I use a product Dave had recommended for polishing out little imprefections and it worked great but the final product (2 step process) always leaves a slight haze which is tough to buff off. I am very familar with my Zaino car products and thought why not try those, they dont leave any smears on my balck truck:D

Hand applied or are you breaking out the Porter Cable? :D

[davef]

Ha! Actually I use a product Dave had recommended for polishing out little imprefections and it worked great but the final product (2 step process) always leaves a slight haze which is tough to buff off. I am very familar with my Zaino car products and thought why not try those, they dont leave any smears on my balck truck:D

Are you using the Novus polishing products? If yes, we avoid using # 1 as we also find that it leaves a haze. Novus # 2 removes the haze and also polishes quite well so we only use # 3 (only if deep scratches) followed by # 2.

Meguiars ScratchX 1.0 (do not use 2.0) also works well at removing the haze.

[merrymaid520]

Hand applied or are you breaking out the Porter Cable? :D

You know I use the PC7424:p

Darn black vehicles....I always tell myself I will never own another, oh well.

[merrymaid520]

Are you using the Novus polishing products? If yes, we avoid using # 1 as we also find that it leaves a haze. Novus # 2 removes the haze and also polishes quite well so we only use # 3 (only if deep scratches) followed by # 2.

Meguiars ScratchX 1.0 (do not use 2.0) also works well at removing the haze.

Yes, the Novus stuff. Its the #1 polish I have the issue with as well.....now you tell me:(:D
I have since just used the #2 polish (not tried #3 yet). I will experiemnt with the car polishes soon and report back.

[curtis]

Any one of you want to come detail my car? :)

[TomK]

Dave,
Where is the crossover located?

[davef]

Dave,
Where is the crossover located?

Inside the speaker cabinet, attached to the back wall of the cabinet about an inch or two above where the binding posts are located.

[johnk]

It may be in the thread somewhere, so I apologize if so, but can anyone provide guidance on whether Q-plugs are appropriate for the Towers, and if so, under what circumstances.

I would be using them without a sub, and they would be maybe a foot from the back wall, although that's not certain until they get here. Thanks.

[Blutarsky]

I wonder if a summary could be posted of the prices, options and specifications of the Towers with photos. I have told some friends about them and they commented on the hassle of viewing 50 pages of posts.

Maybe start a new thread?

Thanks'

[BinaryLinguist]

You know I use the PC7424:p

Darn black vehicles....I always tell myself I will never own another, oh well.

I am using Blackfire Wet Diamond and Collinite #845. :D


In other news, I got my shipping notice. :)

[davef]

Dave,

Just wondering if Ascend will be at RMAF (October), and if so, will the Tower and/or Center make its debut?

to be honest, I haven't even thought about it :o Perhaps we can share a room with someone else. At this point, my focus has been on getting the towers assembled and shipped and I haven't given any thought as to marketing (I rarely do.)