Help with my setup?

[endbegin]

Hi All,

This is my first post on these forums, and was wondering if I could get some advice on finding an audio setup that works well for me.

I have owned a pair of CBM 170SE's for almost a year now, and I bought the speakers after numerous listening tests in the price range (and some quite a bit higher too). I love the neutral sound of these speakers and find it "relaxing" even if sometimes listening to heavier stuff.

My music is either MP3s on a computer (256 - 320 kbps) or high-quality online streams (like mog.com). I used to have the speakers in a room hooked up to a Denon AVR 1609, with the music source being a desktop computer with an optical out. I have since moved to a new place, and sold off that desktop.

Currently I have the speakers hooked up to the same Denon in the living room (which is much bigger), but my laptop is the source. Unfortunately, the laptop does not have an optical output, and the Denon cannot handle audio via HDMI, so I have to connect the laptop's headphone out to the Denon. Furthermore, the laptop does dual duty as the home-office computer and the music computer - which means I cannot really play have the laptop in the home-office AND play music at the same time on the Ascends.

So that's the backstory.

I'm hoping for some advice on:

1. I have decided to go stereo only. However, I am hard pressed to find a good and affordable two-channel amp that can accept an optical input. Is this just never the case? Does anyone know of a good 2 ch amp that can handle audio over HDMI?

2. I was wondering if there was a solution to having to shuttle my laptop back and forth from the home-office to the living room if I want to listen to music on my speakers. Ideally, I don't to buy another clunky desktop and place that in the living room because that would mean more clutter, more peripheral equipment.

In terms of budget, I am quite budget-conscious which hopefully comes out by my choice of audio components so far.

I apologize for the long post. A lot of these things have been brewing for a while, and I am yet to come across a solution that works well. Hope someone can chime in with some advice. It will be greatly appreciated.

P.S. Have been reading about the upcoming Sierra NrT ... am tempted to upgrade to them because I feel they might be able to fill the living room better and go lower on the frequency response.

[markie]

Hmmm, your laptop which you use as your music source does not have an optical out, but yet you are asking for an amplifier that takes an optical input?

Anyways, what I would do is this. Presumably your laptop computer has usb ports. Get a good but inexpensive usb dac like a Music Streamer or a more expensive and much more excellent usb dac like a Tranquility Dac, and feed the output from that dac that into your Denon for amplification out to your speakers.

Let us know how it goes! Anybody else have suggestions?

Mark

[endbegin]

Thanks for the reply and the suggestions. The Tranquility DAC looks great, but is outside my budget and doesn't seem like it can handle wireless streaming.

All the moderately priced 2 channel amps I've looked at have analog inputs only. This is why I was wondering if there was one with an optical input - this way I'd need to rely on the DAC in my amp rather than the one in my laptop.

I've been doing some reading, and it seems like the upcoming Boxee Box might be a good fit for me. It has an optical out, I can keep it in the living room close to the receiver, and control the sound through it from my laptop anywhere in my home. The Logitech Squeezebox Touch is another option that does the same thing, but for audio only. (The Boxee connects to a TV too).

[markie]

Sounds like a great idea! Of course your first great idea was getting the 170SEs :)

[Too_Blue]

I'm waiting for one of these to arrive in the next few days:

http://cgi.ebay.com/USB-Digital-Sound-Card-Musiland-Monitor-02-US_W0QQitemZ260437930872QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_Defa ultDomain_0

USB DAC that also outputs digital via coax (SPDIF) and optical, and it has a built in headphone amp.

If all you need to do is convert a USB signal from your laptop to optical, this model is about 50% cheaper and will do what you want:

http://cgi.ebay.com/USB-Digital-Sound-Card-Musiland-Monitor-01-US_W0QQitemZ350224614201QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_Defa ultDomain_0

There are a lot of (user) reviews on the Musiland units. Here's one thread from the head-fi forums:

http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/443786/musiland-monitor-02-us There are others.

A bit higher priced at $399 (and what I'm going to use the Musiland 02 to feed a digital signal from my PC to), and also a USB DAC in its own right, with a supposedly kickin' output stage and volume control (I'll be using this as a preamp to drive 2 monoblock amps in a 2.1 system):

http://emotivalounge.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=preampdac&action=display&thread=12973

The Emotiva unit also has two sets of outputs, XLR (balanced) and RCA, which are both active at the same time, so you could drive your amp(s) and send the signal to a subwoofer too, if one or both have balanced inputs. This should be available in a few weeks and a lot of people are anxiously awaiting its release.

Hope this helps.

[endbegin]

The Emotiva unit looks great ... I'm assuming you will have a music server / NAS connected to the Musiland 02, which will feed the Emotiva which feeds the monoblocks ... I'm curious to know what you setup is like (or will look like) because it seems as if there is no wireless streaming involved? Another option I am contemplating is to have a NAS sitting next to the amplifier, but be able to access that NAS over the network. Most of the wireless streamers I've seen are 24/96, while the Musiland DACs you linked are 24/192 ...

I've been contemplating getting a 2.1 ch amp myself and going away from a surround system - perhaps an integrated amp. I hate the wiring and clutter required for a 5.1 system, and while the benefits of a surround system are clear, it somehow doesn't appeal much to me - dunno, maybe that's just me.

[Too_Blue]

Well, I'm just using an external hard drive to store music files (WAV, FLAC) and play them through Winamp right now (looking at alternatives, I'm not very knowledgeable about PC audio at this point - I use Winamp because I [and more importantly, my wife] am familiar with it, it isn't as "bright" sounding as Windows Media, and I can rip bit-perfect WAV files from CD's). I plan on exploring some high-res material once I get everything set up.

The Musiland is taking the place of the cheap sound card in the Gateway. For similar money, it's a better deal for me than a more expensive internal sound card. I like the external power (plug in), I like the headphone amp, and I like that I can move it to another PC when I upgrade.

My sources are all digital. Besides the Gateway is DirecTV DVR and Oppo DV 980H. So I really don't need an analog preamp. I'm moving from an Emotiva/PSB surround setup to an Emotiva/Sierra 1/Rythmik 2.1 system. The one advantage to many preamps, especially Emotiva's, is that they have a pretty good 2 channel bass management section with high-pass and low-pass filters. Going the route I am, the Sierras will have to be run full range and the Rythmik's crossover set to their roll off point. But after talking to Dave, I'm eager to hear the combo. His Q-Plug "A" will give me a shallower, 60hz roll off which will be easy to match.

So I'm looking at:


Sources > DAC > Monoblocks > Speakers.

> Subwoofer

As straight and pure a signal as I can get to the speakers and still enjoy the use a of good subwoofer.

I've been researching for a while and this is the highest-end solution I can come up with that fits my budget.

[endbegin]

Out of curiosity: why are you going with monoblocks instead of a stereo amp?

Something like an HK3490 has digital inputs (so the DAC is built-in, although I don't know what the specs on that are), and puts out plenty of power for both 8 ohm and 4 ohm loads, 2 subwoofer outs ...

[Too_Blue]

Mostly because I really like Emotiva's amps, especially for the price. Also, though the 3490 is a respectable receiver (I'll probably pick one up for a bedroom system later on) it has little more power into 4ohms than it does into 8, which implies a not-as-high current drive as the separates offer, if I understand correctly.

And monoblocks offer advantages over multichannel amps for stereo listening in particular. That and power to spare, which is always a good thing.

http://emotiva.com/upa1.shtm

Nice form factor as well. I like the svelte look of these amps and the sleeper quality of having huge sound coming from three slim little boxes and a pair of relatively small monitors (the sub will be hiding in the corner). They'll also fit my new stand better than a larger amp or receiver will.

Throw in a 5 year transferable warranty and great customer service and, for me, it's a winning combination.

[Sam1000]

So I'm looking at:


Sources > DAC > Monoblocks > Speakers.

> Subwoofer

As straight and pure a signal as I can get to the speakers and still enjoy the use a of good subwoofer.

I've been researching for a while and this is the highest-end solution I can come up with that fits my budget.

So, the XDA-1 also acts as a preamp?

[curtis]

Yeah...I was also wondering where the preamp function is/was.

[DavidD]

Yeah...I was also wondering where the preamp function is/was.

According to Emotiva, it sounds best without a preamp. Just use the DAC to control the volume.

[Too_Blue]

Yup. You got it.

I can always add one of their new analog preamps later. It'll have the same output stage as the DAC, which one of their head engineers says is better than in their current preamp.

He posted on their forum that he tried their ERC-1 CD player > XDA-1 DAC > USP-1 preamp > XPA-2 amp into their big tower speakers...

...then tried ERC-1 > XDA-1 > XPA-2, and this sounded better than through the preamp.

I'm gonna try it out after Christmas (gotta buy all that crap first, lol). The hullabaloo will have died down somewhat by then and some folks will have reviewed it in their homes.


Doin' homework. Bang for the buck. Just like here. I tried one of their 10" subs and sent it back because it was just too small for the room and my wife doesn't want two. Good excuse to go big. I'll work on the second later... :)

It sounded great, made the bass tighter than my PSB's run full range. But it didn't have the output for my room. They e-mailed me a shipping label and that was that, taking the shipping out of my refund. I requested all that and it was no problem.

Have had questions answered by their engineer(s) on the phone.

I like that.

[curtis]

How does the XDA-1 handle the volume control? Is it analog or digital?

[Too_Blue]

http://emotivalounge.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=media&action=display&thread=12059


Are you guys sure you can use a xpa-1 as a pre/pro connected directly into an amp? How will you controll the volume/gain?


From http://emonatics.com/XDA-1.shtml:


Emotiva XDA-1 - High Performance External DAC
Update: 2010-06-10

Specs, per Lonnie:

Frequency response: 5-50Khz
S/N: in excess of 110db
THD+N: 0.02%
Ground floor noise: 10uV
Output voltage: 1V nominal, 12V peak

Lonnie has also reiterated that the XDA-1 connected directly to an amplifier provides the highest quality of sonic reproduction, if that configuration works in your system.

Lonnie has given a time frame of 45 days. This would give us a delivery time frame of late July to early August, 2010.

Estimated price of $299.

Has full output attenuator (volume control) - preamp could be bypassed - a remote control is to be included for this purpose
It is 1RU (1 Rack Unit = 1.75 inches) in height
Cosmetics are currently being updated from early test models
Smaller black trim accessories are in the works for an all-black look

Inputs (both)
1) AES/EBU
2) Coax Digital
2) Optical Digital
1) USB (Should be PC & Mac Compatible)

Outputs
1) L/R Unbalanced RCAs
1) L/R Balanced XLRs (all outputs are hgh voltage)

Triggers (automatic on/off for amplifiers and XDA-1 itself)
1) 12v output trigger
1) 12v input trigger

Analog Devices AD1955 DAC, with 384k oversampling, and 1V rms (7V peak for extended dynamics), 24-bit, 192 kHz Sample Rate PCM Audio Data, 120 dB SNR/DNR (not muted) at 48KHz Sample Rate (A-Weighted Stereo), -110 dB THD+N (0.0003162%)
Burr Brown buffers coming out of the DAC
6 fully discrete output stages
Selectable inputs
Segmented power supply

The XDA uses a Dual dif input stage with crosslinked current sources, Darlington VAS stage and Darlington output stages, so the speed and current it can deliver is like night and day different from the ERC. So as good as the ERC sounded (and to be honest I thought it was amazing), the XDA is in a league all its own.


I believe that the volume attenuation used is based on the digital implementation in the DAC. What had been mentioned earlier about the implementation is Emotiva providing access to this function instead of setting it on full value, which is how the DAC would have been set if no preamp was planned.

The folks from Emotiva have mentioned in the past that best results would be attained by using the XDA-1 as a preamp. I would assume that this is in comparison to their own preamp and not necessarily all preamps out there (there are likely to be a few that do little harm). Bel Canto uses the digital volume control in their products with high degree of success. On their FAQ, they clearly point out the DAC3 using its digital volume control as a preamp outperforms the Pre3 as a preamp.


I think the digital volume control on their MMC-1 processor is fine. But I'm not an audiophile. It'll do until I can afford their XSP-1 analog preamp, with the superior output stage the DAC offers over the USP-1 preamp and the superior, analog volume attenuator the USP-1 offers over the DAC. And it has a pretty good bass management section too, so I could high-pass my speakers with it, take some load off them and the amps.

But I need the DAC first. All my sources are digital and I ain't usin' the DAC in my DirecTV DVR. The Oppo and the PC would be fine. And the savings over the X Preamp affords me two thirds of the subwoofer cost.

Only other solution is to ditch the DirecTV...

Anybody know anything about online TV? I don't watch the thing, it gets occasional satellite music duty and PPV movie once a month from me. The wife on the other hand pretty much records "her shows" from Bravo and Food Network to watch when she wants. If I could get those online, I'd save some money. TCM gets a lot of play from her too. But Netflix and the library have that covered, old movies galore. Old flicks are mostly background stuff anyway, while she snoozes on the couch.

Just curious.

[curtis]

So my question would be how does it manipulate the signal.

If you manipulate the digital input stream before it goes to the D/A conversion, my understanding is in order to do so, you have to sacrifice the bits in the stream to handle the volume. In other words, you lose some resolution of the music.

"Digital" attenuation is just how the control is handled, not that the signal stream is digital.

I saw this discussed in a thread about the Squeezebox, and connecting it directly to an amp.

Now in the spec you quote, it says there is an output attenuator, which would mean, to me, that the attenuation is done after the D/A conversion, which I think is the better way to go.

[Too_Blue]

"Digital" attenuation is just how the control is handled, not that the signal stream is digital.

That's right. Pretty sure Lonnie said that the control is handled digitally, but in the analog domain. Does that make sense? I take that to mean the signal being digitally attenuated has already been converted?

Anyway, I'm gonna try it. Like I said, I can always add a preamp later and get all analog volume control and bass management.

[curtis]

That's right. Pretty sure Lonnie said that the control is handled digitally, but in the analog domain. Does that make sense? I take that to mean the signal being digitally attenuated has already been converted?
Yup, that makes sense and the best way to do it.

It is not being digitally attenuated, just that the pot/resister is digitally controlled.

[Too_Blue]

Yup. That's what I got from it.

[endbegin]

Anybody know anything about online TV? I don't watch the thing, it gets occasional satellite music duty and PPV movie once a month from me. The wife on the other hand pretty much records "her shows" from Bravo and Food Network to watch when she wants. If I could get those online, I'd save some money. TCM gets a lot of play from her too. But Netflix and the library have that covered, old movies galore. Old flicks are mostly background stuff anyway, while she snoozes on the couch.

Just curious.

I've been keeping a close eye on this - The Boxee Box is coming out soon, and Logitech just unveiled their version of Google TV (called the Revue). The Revue can also be paired with Dish Network's set top box, but in the general case, I don't think cable programming is at a point where they are comfortable getting involved with efforts like Boxee. With Google throwing its weight into it, things might change soon - meaning we might be able to go the ala-carte route.

I just sold my Denon receiver, with the intention of never buying a generic 80-100W X 5.1/7.1ch type receiver again. So I narrowed my search down to the HK 3490, but I noticed today that Emotiva has their UPA-5 on sale! The upcoming XDA1 and the UPA5 might make a good combination - while it is more expensive than the 3490, it might also last me a longer time without getting the upgrade itch!

Of course, all this means I still haven't solved my initial problem - I am further away from listening to "real" music now than I was 2 months ago! Has the term "back to square zero" been trademarked yet?

[Too_Blue]

Yes! Ala-carte! That would be ideal.

As far as Emotiva goes, I love my Emo gear. Sure, there's been a lot of back and forth about their UMC-1 processor and I can understand the frustration some folks have experienced dealing with the firmware and other issues. But they've treated me right and my older processor has had zero problems. I mainly look at their amps and try to keep up with what they're doing with stereo, so the whole thing is a non-issue for me. But I take note of how they handle issues.

Keep in mind that the XDA-1 DAC only converts 2-channel signals. The UPA-5 is a 5 channel amp (125w/channel). They do make a UPA-2 however. But if you're looking to do 5.1 later, the UPA-5 would work fine. I'm only using 3 channels of my LPA-1 and that's never been a problem.

I've been running the LPA-1 (precursor to the UPA-7) and MMC-1 processor since February and couldn't be happier with their performance. But I'm moving back to a 2-channel setup and don't need all the channels or processing.

For 2-channel, they offer the UPA-1 monoblock (200w @ 8ohms, 350 @ 4 ohm) which would require 2 amps, one for each speaker, the UPA-2 (125wx2 @ 8 ohm, 185 @ 4ohm), the XPA-2 (300w x2 @ 8, 500w @ 4), and the XPA-1 monoblock (500w @ 8, 1000 @ 4).

Depending on the size of your room and volume preferences, the UPA-2 would probably do what you want. I like to get loud once in a while and like to run gear that doesn't have to be pushed hard to do what I want, so I'm opting for the UPA-1 monoblocks.

I have to say that most, if not all, of my business will go to ID companies like Ascend and Rythmik and Emotiva in the future. I like high performance/price ratios and solid products and great customer service.

All of the above offer all three in spades, as far as I can tell. As do other companies like Salk, HSU, SVS, etc.

Not knocking HK at all, but you can't call them and talk to the guy who designed the gear you're using. Same with any big company. Having said that, I wish I'd grabbed one of their 3490's from their e-bay store while they were selling refurbs. Could have gotten a solid 120w receiver for under $250 with full warranty. I'm going to need something to drive my PSB's when I move them upstairs...

Snooze = lose, lol.

[bdfin]

Back to one of your original questions. It appears that apple has this device which would accept your laptop stream and then connect optically or via analog to your receiver / amp in the other room. It appears you would have to run itunes player though on your laptop ( windows version ). Fairly cheap. http://www.apple.com/airportexpress/specs.html. I use a mac mini, ( 6" square form factor ) as my music server, it has optical/analog out so I can change source from analog in to digital in on my receiver when I feel like it. Some things still sound better analog to me. Not trying to push apple stuff, but just throwing it out there.

[curtis]

I have used the Airport Express before, and it works very nicely. It doesn't do FLAC though, unless something has changed in the last 3 years.

[endbegin]

Back to one of your original questions. It appears that apple has this device which would accept your laptop stream and then connect optically or via analog to your receiver / amp in the other room. It appears you would have to run itunes player though on your laptop ( windows version ). Fairly cheap. http://www.apple.com/airportexpress/specs.html. I use a mac mini, ( 6" square form factor ) as my music server, it has optical/analog out so I can change source from analog in to digital in on my receiver when I feel like it. Some things still sound better analog to me. Not trying to push apple stuff, but just throwing it out there.

Thanks for the suggestion - yes, I am aware of this, but I don't use iTunes, and generally steer clear of Apple. Using Airfoil https://rogueamoeba.com/store/ any audio can be sent to the Airport Express. The Squeezebox is another option for this. However, they both do audio only. With something like the Boxee, I could do both audio and video. I think I'll wait for that to come out and see the reviews.

[endbegin]

Yes! Ala-carte! That would be ideal.

As far as Emotiva goes, I love my Emo gear. Sure, there's been a lot of back and forth about their UMC-1 processor and I can understand the frustration some folks have experienced dealing with the firmware and other issues. But they've treated me right and my older processor has had zero problems. I mainly look at their amps and try to keep up with what they're doing with stereo, so the whole thing is a non-issue for me. But I take note of how they handle issues.

Keep in mind that the XDA-1 DAC only converts 2-channel signals. The UPA-5 is a 5 channel amp (125w/channel). They do make a UPA-2 however. But if you're looking to do 5.1 later, the UPA-5 would work fine. I'm only using 3 channels of my LPA-1 and that's never been a problem.

I've been running the LPA-1 (precursor to the UPA-7) and MMC-1 processor since February and couldn't be happier with their performance. But I'm moving back to a 2-channel setup and don't need all the channels or processing.

For 2-channel, they offer the UPA-1 monoblock (200w @ 8ohms, 350 @ 4 ohm) which would require 2 amps, one for each speaker, the UPA-2 (125wx2 @ 8 ohm, 185 @ 4ohm), the XPA-2 (300w x2 @ 8, 500w @ 4), and the XPA-1 monoblock (500w @ 8, 1000 @ 4).

Depending on the size of your room and volume preferences, the UPA-2 would probably do what you want. I like to get loud once in a while and like to run gear that doesn't have to be pushed hard to do what I want, so I'm opting for the UPA-1 monoblocks.

I have to say that most, if not all, of my business will go to ID companies like Ascend and Rythmik and Emotiva in the future. I like high performance/price ratios and solid products and great customer service.

All of the above offer all three in spades, as far as I can tell. As do other companies like Salk, HSU, SVS, etc.

Not knocking HK at all, but you can't call them and talk to the guy who designed the gear you're using. Same with any big company. Having said that, I wish I'd grabbed one of their 3490's from their e-bay store while they were selling refurbs. Could have gotten a solid 120w receiver for under $250 with full warranty. I'm going to need something to drive my PSB's when I move them upstairs...

Snooze = lose, lol.

The price drop on the UPA-5 got me thinking about it - it's just $50 more expensive than the UPA-2 and the same power per channel. You mentioned earlier that you were going away from surround sound to a 2 channel setup. I'm planning to do the same - wondering what made you want to "go down" to 2 channel?

From the Emotiva forum link you posted, someone said that the UPA-1 is really an X-series design. I looked through the X-series manual, and couldn't find something about why the X-series design was superior. It clearly puts out more power, but is there something else? Perhaps a more efficient PA?

I remember you saying all your music was on an external hard drive and that sits next to the DAC. Does your computer sit next to the hard drive, or is the hard drive network aware - thereby allowing you to access it from anywhere? I'm just looking into WD Live TV - it is something along those lines ... (http://www.wdc.com/en/products/products.asp?driveid=735)

[Too_Blue]

The price drop on the UPA-5 got me thinking about it - it's just $50 more expensive than the UPA-2 and the same power per channel. You mentioned earlier that you were going away from surround sound to a 2 channel setup. I'm planning to do the same - wondering what made you want to "go down" to 2 channel?

From the Emotiva forum link you posted, someone said that the UPA-1 is really an X-series design. I looked through the X-series manual, and couldn't find something about why the X-series design was superior. It clearly puts out more power, but is there something else? Perhaps a more efficient PA?

I remember you saying all your music was on an external hard drive and that sits next to the DAC. Does your computer sit next to the hard drive, or is the hard drive network aware - thereby allowing you to access it from anywhere? I'm just looking into WD Live TV - it is something along those lines ... (http://www.wdc.com/en/products/products.asp?driveid=735)

I'm moving to 2-channel mostly because my listening preference is music and 99.8% of my music isn't multichannel, so surround is of very little value to me. I watch few movies and few of those are loaded with surround data. Add to that my wife's preference for less speakers in her living room. Also, on my budget, I can afford higher quality gear, because I'll need less of it. And I'm a K.I.S.S kind of guy.

Comparing the X- and U-series amps, the X-series amp modules have 6 output devices per channel, vs. the UPA's 4. Each UPA-1 monoblock (which uses the x-series module) uses the same 300 va (volt/amps) transformer the UPA-2 uses, so two of them have twice the power supply for the same two channels (in effect, the same 600va the UPA-5 uses for 5 channels). Secondary capacitance (power storage for dynamics and headroom) is twice that of the UPA-2 (80,000uF vs. 40,000uF) and just below the UPA-5's 90,000uF. (I believe uF stands for "microfarad" and describes the type of capacitor used, but I'm no engineer and could be mistaken). So with the x-series amps (XPA-3 and XPA-5, the XPA-2 and XPA-1 take all this to another realm from the standard x-modules) you have a bigger power supply, more storage capacitance for increased headroom and dynamics, and more output devices to to deliver the power, if I understand all this correctly.

To me all this adds up to cleaner sound, especially at higher volume levels, because the amp doesn't have to work as hard to get there. And of course there should be a benefit when driving less efficient speakers. I know that I can tell a difference between my LPA-1 and a buddy's Yamaha receiver (90w/channel), even at low volume, where the higher output of the LPA-1 isn't really an issue (low volume doesn't use much power, a few watts). He's going to buy my MMC-1 and LPA-1 when I make this move, so I guess he heard a difference too.

Not all my music is on the hard drive, I have plenty of CD's as well. But I rip them to the PC for convenience and the ability to put together play-lists as opposed to listening to an entire album by one artist. The hard drive is a simple one with no software, plug and play, so to speak:

http://www.amazon.com/Western-Digital-Elements-External-WDBAAU0020HBK-NESN/dp/B002QEBMCI/ref=sr_1_1?s=pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1286654315&sr=1-1

It sits on a cabinet next to the CPU. I'm not very computer savvy, so kept it simple. I don't need wireless networking and such. Hey, I'm a dinosaur. I'm still amazed that speaker drivers are made from cool stuff like Kevlar and fiberglass and polypropylene these days! :eek:

On a side note, I just received my Musiland Monitor 02 an hour ago. I'll install it tonight and do some testing, including A/B-ing the analog output vs. the stupid 3.5mm>RCA adapter I'm using now. I'm certain the DAC in the Musiland is superior to that in my cheap internal sound card. Then I'll run digital coax out to my MMC-1 and see how that sounds (utilizing the DAC in the processor). I plan on this configuration to feed the new DAC when I get it. The whole point of buying this unit was to get digital coax out of my PC and it offers benefits (for my application) over swapping internal sound cards.

I love new toys...

[endbegin]

Sounds cool ... do share your thoughts on how the Musiland testing goes. And thanks for all the info you've shared too. It's been really helpful.

I've been looking at a setup kinda like yours ...
XDA-1 -> 2 UPA-1 (350W per channel at 4 ohms)
or
XDA-1 -> XPA-2 (500W per channel at 4 ohms)

Assuming the XDA-1 costs $300, the second option is ~ $150 more expensive but you get more watts per channel, although it isn't isolated as in the former's case.

I briefly looked at some of the musician/recording pro amps, for example the Yamaha P2500 or even the P3500
http://www.yamaha.com/yamahavgn/CDA/ContentDetail/ModelSeriesDetail.html?CNTID=15252&CTID=227600
You get close to the same amount of power as the Emotiva configs for a little cheaper, but they don't seem consumer-friendly, i.e. no remote, and look ugly! :D

[Too_Blue]

Lol.

It all depends on how loud you like to play things.

The extra wattage that the XPA-2 delivers amounts to about 2dB more headroom. But it comes at some small bit of cost. Headroom is where HT is king, while separation and low noise floor and imaging and smoothness benefits music more. It all depends on what your priority is, as far as listenig goes.

For me it's a no-brainer, as I am totally about the music and movies and TV are secondary.

I don't think there's a wrong choice here. But more power is always better, the way a 454 big-block sporting two quads is better than a supercharged 4 cyl, to use an auto analogy. It isn't going to have to work nearly as hard to get the desired results, which translates into longevity. But there's a point of diminishing returns as well. It's all about application and implementation.

No doubt about it, the XPA-2 is a beast of an amp and many a debate has been spawned over the choice of it and the UPA-1's for 2-channel.

In a perfect world, we'd all be running XPA-1's. :eek:

Best of both worlds. But out of my current budget and no doubt total overkill to drive a pair of bookshelves, regardless of whose.

That wouldn't stop me though, had I the bread. :D

[Too_Blue]

Got the Musiland up and running, after a minor glitch. I tried three different drivers and none of them like interacting with Windows Vista 64 bit. Or maybe it's the other way around. Stupid stuff, like the computer wouldn't shut down after I downloaded the driver software and tested the hardware on games, audio playback, and video apps like youtube. Sounded good, a bit warm maybe, but glitchy. Had trouble restarting the computer too. And everything wanted to take forever to load. I had to uninstall the driver software and reset the computer to a restore point three days back to get the old sound hardware enabled again.

So I pulled the DAC and external drive off that computer and hooked it to my other machine, a smaller, 3 gig Gateway that's in the same room. Gold. Vista 32 bit? No problem. No glitches. Digital out, analog out, and headphone jacks work great. And the sound is definitely superior to what it was. Separation, soundstage, imaging, detail, and clarity are all improved. The Musiland is a keeper for me.

Pretty sweet for $125 and a far better solution for me than swapping internal soundcards for something like an Asus.

Just finished listening to some Cowboy Junkies. Sweet. Tested some Sade, Jimmy Thackery, Tom Petty's newest release, Tom Waits, and Norah Jones today before work. All sound excellent. And the unit lost that touch of warmth (which I could get used to, but don't prefer) it had on the other machine. All neutral and detailed now.

Happy Camper, out. :D

[endbegin]

Nice! I use Win 7 64-bit, and am wondering if the Musiland drivers don't work nicely with 64-bit architectures.

By the way, you are surely aware of this already, but the XDA-1 is available on Emo's website for pre-order.

[Too_Blue]

Folks using Win 7 64 bit report no problems that I know of.

I saw that the XDA-1 is on the website now. Good deal. If I had all this stuff in one room, I'd just have gotten the XDA-1 and feed it USB from my PC. But the audio gear is in the living room and our computers are in the dining cum computer room. I run 25' of digital coax to my pre/pro, too far to run USB cable.

And I like having the headphone amp sitting on my desk next to my PC.

[Sam1000]

Folks using Win 7 64 bit report no problems that I know of.

I saw that the XDA-1 is on the website now. Good deal. If I had all this stuff in one room, I'd just have gotten the XDA-1 and feed it USB from my PC. But the audio gear is in the living room and our computers are in the dining cum computer room. I run 25' of digital coax to my pre/pro, too far to run USB cable.

And I like having the headphone amp sitting on my desk next to my PC.

have you considered 'squeezebox touch' to stream music to your living room?? I replaced my old SB3 with Touch and very happy with it. There were quite a bit of favorable reviews about it (including in sterephile).

[Too_Blue]

I haven't.

I started out with the PC audio thing because I got tired of hearing my wife's games and stuff through her crappy little speakers in the same room with me. So I decided to do something about it. Streaming music files wasn't my original intention. But it sort of worked out that way the more I looked into things.

I'll check it out, just for future reference. ;) Thanks.