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davef
05-16-2007, 05:19 AM
Perhaps the most unique feature of the Sierra is the cabinet.

While fiber board (MDF and HDF) is generally a good material for a loudspeaker cabinet, it is far from ideal. It is used because it is easy to cut, extremely affordable and it does an adequate job at minimizing resonance and isolating the back wave response and various mechanical noises produced by the drivers. Many high-end manufacturers have gone to extremes to improve cabinet materials, using advanced ceramics, extruded aluminum, epoxies, stone; all in the goal of reducing cabinet resonance and improving sound isolation. The results of these improvements can be dramatic at times, greatly improving accuracy, transparency and imaging.

The simplest and most cost-effective method to improve the function of the cabinet would be to use very thick MDF. We made an investment in setting up a dedicated measurement system specifically designed to test various cabinet materials. This in itself was a difficult task as it required quite a bit of research, requiring very specific electronics and various modifications in order to get everything to function together - accelerometers, multiplex controllers and a DSP based MLS system. I am pleased to say that we have now added this capability to our already impressive engineering facility.

Various testing confirmed my suspicions. I took measurements using 5/8", ¾", 1", 1.5" even 2" thick MDF sample cabinets. Obviously, the thicker the cabinet, the less measurable resonance but the reduction in resonance is what surprised me most. The cabinet with 2" walls was only marginally improved over ¾" walls, thus confirming why select manufacturers use materials other than MDF for their top performing products. MDF is adequate, inexpensive and convenient but I desired something that would result in a significant reduction to cabinet resonance and improve isolation without having to use 3" thick baffles. This was quite a challenge because I had already defined the external dimensions of the loudspeaker.

Perhaps it was fate or just blind luck but I was introduced to a wonderful piece of furniture about 3 years ago. This was a dining room table - an expensive, beautifully crafted unique piece of art that was stronger than any piece of furniture I had ever examined before. The manufacturer of this table approached me and explained that this was made from vertically laminated bamboo. Hundreds of solid bamboo panels, each about ¼" thick laminated together.

After a brief discussion with this custom furniture manufacturer (experts in the use of bamboo), they decided to build me a prototype cabinet for the Sierra made of the same material as the table. A few weeks later I had the sample in hand. The first thing I noticed was how rigid the cabinet felt. It is difficult to describe but after handling tens of thousands of loudspeaker cabinets, you get a feel when something is different. Second thing I noticed was that my production crew was not able to install the wood screws into the pilot holes using our normal torque settings. I was shocked at how difficult it was to actually install the wood screws to hold the various components, this material was incredibly strong.

My jaw dropped when I took accelerometer measurements of the cabinet. I could not believe what I saw, this cabinet showed DRAMATIC reductions in resonance, even when compared to the same cabinet made with 1.5” MDF. We found our cabinet material, finding a vendor to actually build these for us was another story…

The problem we found with laminated bamboo, besides being expensive, is that it is so incredibly tough that typical router bits used in CNC routers are not adequate. While they cut through MDF like a warm knife though butter, they would quickly dull and would not cut cleanly through the bamboo. After much frustration, we found a high-end OEM loudspeaker cabinet factory that was willing to use the highest grade router bits available (and constantly replace them). Of course, the cost of this type of cutting would ultimately fall on our shoulders but at least we found a company willing to undertake the project. This was "uncharted" territory for both us and them.

Years later, together with the cooperation of one of the worlds foremost authorities of bamboo products, we feel we have optimized the process to a point where we can now manufacture laminated bamboo loudspeaker cabinets at decent volume levels and keep costs reasonable. I am so pleased about this on many different levels, it is a truly magical material that offers unmatched performance and beauty and is truly an earth-friendly renewable resource.

While century old trees are being cut down in the great rain-forests of South America and Africa, here is a product that offers natural beauty while offering proven performance improvements without the dramatic and permanent hit to our fragile ecosystem. The loudspeaker industry's affect on our natural resources is one of those unspoken evils. Ascend Acoustics is proud to say that not a single tree is destroyed for the production of the Sierra and we hope we can continue this trend.

About the Sierra cabinet:

The cabinet is made from vertically oriented laminated bamboo paneling. We call it V-LAM™ for short. There are over 200 individual sheets of ¼" thick bamboo, each laminated to another using environmentally friendly epoxies and arranged such that each panel is vertical (imagine a row of ¼" thick books placed on a bookshelf) forming a baffle that is 3/4" thick. The cabinet is extremely rigid and tough. I have had a cabinet sitting outdoors for nearly 2 years, fully exposed to all the extremes of Southern California weather; intense sunlight, strong winds, rain and even some cold. The integrity of the cabinet has not been compromised in any way.

The inside walls are lined with top-grade damping material and each joint is well braced. We custom tooled a high-flow flared port tube which is flush mounted into the rear of the cabinet. All drivers are flush mounted to reduce baffle reflections and the front baffle vertical edges have a beautiful radius which aids in the reduction of diffraction.

The build and finish quality of the Sierra is unmatched. There is no veneer or wrap of any kind so there is no concern about peeling or cracking. We apply a semi-gloss lacquer to the natural wood to give some added sheen and enhance the natural beauty.

For those who don't desire the natural finish, we offer a stunning piano black finish. This was a difficult process since the bamboo we are using is non-porous (as compared to MDF) so a new finishing technique had to be developed. The results of which are just incredible, the finest piano black finish I have ever seen! True mirror quality.

Some info about Bamboo:


Bamboo is an environmentally friendly, renewable resource that has been used as construction material for thousands of years. Ecologically, the harvesting of bamboo does not affect the world's dwindling timber resources. Technically considered a grass, bamboo has the ability to grow to maturity in only 3-6 years. The intricate root system remains unharmed upon harvesting and allows for sustainable future growth.
It is incredibly strong and considered one of the most durable hardwoods. It has a tensile strength that is stronger than steel and the vertical orientation of the panels we use take full advantage of this.
The bamboo we use is completely moisture resistant. MDF will swell when exposed to moisture and this is often the cause for the cracking and peeling of the various finishes applied to MDF loudspeakers over a period of time.
Our bamboo is safe for factory workers and for you. MDF is a health hazard for anyone cutting or sanding it, so much so that places like Lowes and Home Depot will refuse to cut it for you.


A summary of features of the cabinet:


Exclusive V-LAM™ construction, cabinet is made from vertically laminated solid bamboo panels which provide extreme rigidity and less energy loss, dramatically reducing cabinet resonance while improving bass performance, accuracy and transparency.
Environmentally friendly and free of toxins commonly found in MDF cabinets.
Top-grade internal damping materials uses on all internal walls.
All joints are well braced.
All drivers are flush mounted to reduce reflections
Available in natural or piano black finishes
Top-grade 5-way gold plated binding posts.



Now for some cabinet measurements:

Measurements taken using an accelerometer attached to the middle of the side baffle. 7.5v bandwidth limited (2kHz) pink-filtered source signal. Speaker A is the Sierra, speaker B is a very highly regarded 2 way bookshelf speaker with 1" MDF baffles. The speakers are similar in size. Please note: Speaker B is considerably more expensive.


Impulse Response
http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/images/ascenduploads/IMPULSE.gif
Green = Sierra, Blue = Competitor


Spectral Decay, Sierra
http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/images/ascenduploads/SR1SIDE.gif


Spectral Decay, Competitor, 1" MDF cabinet
http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/images/ascenduploads/COMPSIDE.gif




You are seeing not only a significant reduction in resonance but also considerably faster recovery from various resonance modes; with the end result being less cabinet effects for greater accuracy, clarity and transparency.



And finally.. a few more pics :)

http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/images/ascenduploads/nat1.jpg

http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/images/ascenduploads/nat2.jpg

http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/images/ascenduploads/nat3.jpg

http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/images/ascenduploads/pair5.jpg

http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/images/ascenduploads/back1.jpg

sensibull
05-16-2007, 05:29 AM
Oh man, natural and piano black. Gorgeous. The one possible advantage other manufacturers could claim (finish) has just been taken from them. I foresee this speaker laying waste to a whole swath of pricier competitors.

BradJudy
05-16-2007, 05:41 AM
Very cool - I dig bamboo and the finished product looks great.

mziegler
05-16-2007, 05:53 AM
Hot Damn!

JackT
05-16-2007, 06:16 AM
So will this, in fact, be the first bamboo cabinet loudspeaker on the market?

BradJudy
05-16-2007, 06:27 AM
So will this, in fact, be the first bamboo cabinet loudspeaker on the market?

No, there are others, but not many.

GirgleMirt
05-16-2007, 06:39 AM
:eek:

Ok I must say that I'm shocked... I was expecting the usual "we used 1 inch thick mdf to to provide the most solid enclosure possible" we see from competitors, but I must admit I was not expecting that... Reading the thread on avsforums, looks like no one else was expecting it either... Really... :eek:

Seriously, major props thinking outside the envelope, that's what innovation is all about! Using plain old MDF would have been so much easier... And to think there's more announcements to come...

One thing though, I'm starting to worry if I'll be able to afford a pair of Sierras now lol

So the finish options, I take it the piano black will be the 'premium' finish option? The bamboo finish looks great, the different sheets really gives a very cool effect, very different from the usual wood veneers! Also, it really shows off the unusual bamboo material, which is somewhat of a shame to hide, even with an exquisite piano black finish! Ok well maybe not that much of a shame... Piano black looks to be really nice...

I can foresee a hard decision, which finish to choose!

curtis
05-16-2007, 07:01 AM
Oh man....you mean I have to make a decision on the finish?

curtis
05-16-2007, 07:14 AM
No, there are others, but not many.
Yup....and let us hope that the Sierra is not as expensive. I doubt it will be.

buddhadas
05-16-2007, 07:25 AM
Great news Dave. I finally had reached a point where I don't/didn't feel the need to upgrade my speakers. The natural finish is just beautiful, maybe instead of upgrading, I can look at this as a moral decision.
Can't wait for the next post, do you ever sleep Dave?

Jim

Quinn
05-16-2007, 07:27 AM
No, there are others, but not many.

Escalante Designs (http://www.escalantedesigns.com/viewer/home/products.asd/vts/design002) is the only one I know of.

ebh
05-16-2007, 07:48 AM
i absolutely love the natural bamboo finish! very sneaky with starting with that piano black. it's wonderful that you are also considering at least some of the environmental impact created by the company.

ebh
05-16-2007, 07:49 AM
Escalante Designs (http://www.escalantedesigns.com/viewer/home/products.asd/vts/design002) is the only one I know of.

but it sounds like that might be just a finish, at least on the one speaker i happened to look at.

Mike^S
05-16-2007, 08:11 AM
WOW!! That is beautiful!!! I love the little bamboo plant! :D :D

Quinn
05-16-2007, 08:24 AM
but it sounds like that might be just a finish, at least on the one speaker i happened to look at.

I asked them at T.H.E. and they said it wasn't a veneer.

Curtis where did you post those shots of the Escalantes?

merrymaid520
05-16-2007, 08:36 AM
Does anyone know or if maybe Dave F. can chime in on how they will blend in with the current 340se center channel? I have 3 340se across the front and might be interested in upgrading to the awewsome looking(and sounding hopefully:) Sierra's, but they would have to timbre match the current center unless there are more announcements expected in terms of other options?


Can't wait to hear more......litterally!


Congrats to Ascend!

Brandon

curtis
05-16-2007, 08:38 AM
I asked them at T.H.E. and they said it wasn't a veneer.

Curtis where did you post those shots of the Escalantes?
I think this is it:
http://changpics.smugmug.com/gallery/2340088#153267421

Quinn
05-16-2007, 08:44 AM
From this shot it looks to be a veneer over bamboo.

http://changpics.smugmug.com/photos/153267320-M.jpg

Mag_Neato
05-16-2007, 08:46 AM
I'm thinking the "-1" means maybe there's a center(-2) and surrounds (-3)??

Maybe even an awesome reference sub!!

JackT
05-16-2007, 08:50 AM
From this shot it looks to be a veneer over bamboo.



That's hideous.

Quinn
05-16-2007, 08:51 AM
Maybe even an awesome reference sub!!

Sub was my first thought when I saw there is no resonance in that bamboo below 150hz. Lets hope that is in the plans for the sub that Dave is teasing us with.

Maybe there will be a line of 10" or 12" Ascend bamboo cutting boards too.

zkaudio
05-16-2007, 09:23 AM
in for a cutting board. Can i get that in piano gloss as well?

clarke68
05-16-2007, 09:47 AM
Dave -- this is awesome. I knew the bamboo speaker cabinet revolution was coming, but I didn't expect you to be in the vanguard. Kudos not only for the decision, but for all your engineering diligence in demonstrating what a great material this is. Looking forward to seeing what other tricks the Sierra-1 has up its sleeve!

Oh and...make mine the "natural" finish... ;)




No, there are others, but not many.Nomad Audio (http://www.nomad-audio.com/) is the only one I know (knew) of...their "Ronin" is a completely different kind of product than the Sierras.

JohnMichael
05-16-2007, 12:14 PM
My vote is for the natural bamboo cabinet. I am curious to find out the price of the Sierra. Better enclosures, drivers and designed by Dave. Will be a great speaker.

davef
05-16-2007, 12:15 PM
The cutting board comments are great!

clarke68, I know I owe you a phone call - sorry I did not call you back yet. Besides the Sierra, I have a LOT going on in my personal life right now.

Send me an email and let me know what you had in mind regarding the message you left with James.

Sam1000
05-16-2007, 02:10 PM
Hi Dave,
what is that threaded insert for? Is it for wall mounting. The 170s have 2 of them...

curtis
05-16-2007, 02:22 PM
The 340 has the the same insert/same location, so my guess is it is for attaching to the stand.

I also wonder if that insert can hold the weight of the speaker if wallmounted.

jvillas
05-16-2007, 02:27 PM
Impressive, Thanks for your enviromental committment, and respect.

zkaudio
05-16-2007, 03:02 PM
The 340 has the the same insert/same location, so my guess is it is for attaching to the stand.

I also wonder if that insert can hold the weight of the speaker if wallmounted.

very good question, but the rear port would be wayy to close if this screwed into anything but a long arm type mount... again, when can we get these bad boys!

curtis
05-16-2007, 04:16 PM
very good question, but the rear port would be wayy to close if this screwed into anything but a long arm type mount... again, when can we get these bad boys!
In my room, it would work fine. My surrounds are mounted to ceiling beams with nothing but free-air to the port.

BradJudy
05-16-2007, 04:26 PM
In my room, it would work fine. My surrounds are mounted to ceiling beams with nothing but free-air to the port.

Hehe - we don't even know what they cost yet and Curtis is already planning them for his surrounds. :)

davef
05-16-2007, 05:03 PM
Hi Sam1000


Hi Dave,
what is that threaded insert for? Is it for wall mounting. The 170s have 2 of them...

For securing the speaker to a stand or just for your own personal usage (if you build a stand, or just want to secure the speaker to something). I have found it a convenient feature.

I would not use the threaded insert for supporting the entire weight of the cabinet.

jvillas
05-16-2007, 05:03 PM
Is it a possibility for the 200s, 170s, and 340s to recieve the same cabinet tretment as the Sierra? Perhaps as an option?

davef
05-16-2007, 05:12 PM
Is it a possibility for the 200s, 170s, and 340s to recieve the same cabinet tretment as the Sierra? Perhaps as an option?

The plan right now is to keep the V-LAM cabinets as a higher end option. V-LAM production is S-L-O-W. The 200s, 170s and 340s would definitely benefit from the technology - but I am uncertain if the higher retail pricing would be appropriate.

Of course anything is possible but we will have to evaluate the demand once the Sierra begins shipping.

curtis
05-16-2007, 05:55 PM
Hehe - we don't even know what they cost yet and Curtis is already planning them for his surrounds. :)
Yeah...I know...just thinking ahead! :)


I would not use the threaded insert for supporting the entire weight of the cabinet.
But with this info, I have to rethink how to mount them to the beam. I use the two threaded inserts on the CBM-170SE now....so that puts things off for a bit.

davef
05-16-2007, 06:10 PM
But with this info, I have to rethink how to mount them to the beam. I use the two threaded inserts on the CBM-170SE now....so that puts things off for a bit.

If you go with the natural (which I would for the rears, otherwise be prepared for using a step ladder once a week to dust them off) -- use the threaded insert and then just use a wood screw for the other mounting hole. No way you will damage the cabinet ;)

drewface
05-16-2007, 06:38 PM
In my room, it would work fine. My surrounds are mounted to ceiling beams with nothing but free-air to the port.what mounts do you use for doing this? i was thinking of doing the same thing when i move home in a couple days (they're going in the basement)

curtis
05-16-2007, 07:33 PM
what mounts do you use for doing this? i was thinking of doing the same thing when i move home in a couple days (they're going in the basement)
Simple "L" brackets from Home Depot.
http://changpics.smugmug.com/photos/13607329-M.jpg

curtis
05-16-2007, 07:35 PM
If you go with the natural (which I would for the rears, otherwise be prepared for using a step ladder once a week to dust them off) -- use the threaded insert and then just use a wood screw for the other mounting hole. No way you will damage the cabinet ;)
I don't know if I could bring myself to putting a screw into the cabinet...seriously.

davef
05-16-2007, 08:08 PM
I don't know if I could bring myself to putting a screw into the cabinet...seriously.

Understandable...

Since you have the 170 mounted without any angle, the force applied to the 1/4-20 insert is vertical so the cabinet absorbs all of it (no risk of the insert pulling free from the cabinet) For your method, the insert will support the speaker.

Quinn
05-16-2007, 08:21 PM
The cutting board comments are great!




You could sell the tweeter cut outs for cable risers or isolation feet. :)

nguay
05-16-2007, 08:28 PM
I love the new cabinets and the black finish especially. I bet it would look amazing as a floorstander. :D

Mike^S
05-16-2007, 09:42 PM
That cumulative spectral decay measurement is really clean. If you look at measurements taken of most other speakers (even speakers costing several thousands of dollars), you can see they have a lot more resonance.

http://stereophile.com/floorloudspeakers/index.html

DavidD
05-16-2007, 09:50 PM
If you go with the natural (which I would for the rears, otherwise be prepared for using a step ladder once a week to dust them off) -- use the threaded insert and then just use a wood screw for the other mounting hole. No way you will damage the cabinet ;)

Dust? If you just leave it alone, it gets a nice even coating which looks just fine...:D

zkaudio
05-16-2007, 09:57 PM
Dust? If you just leave it alone, it gets a nice even coating which looks just fine...:D

If you wait long enough between dusting, it may match the finish of the se series! BONUS

Thanks guys I'll be here all week.

curtis
05-16-2007, 11:36 PM
Understandable...

Since you have the 170 mounted without any angle, the force applied to the 1/4-20 insert is vertical so the cabinet absorbs all of it (no risk of the insert pulling free from the cabinet) For your method, the insert will support the speaker.
Actually, they are at an angle now...the picture is old. They are now about a 25 degree angle towards the listening position.

curtis
05-16-2007, 11:37 PM
You could sell the tweeter cut outs for cable risers or isolation feet. :)
Coasters!

Mike^S
05-17-2007, 01:55 AM
I notice that the spectral decay graph goes all the way down to -38dB.

On the graphs that Stereophile publishes, they only go down to -24dB. Does this mean that if you were to graph these measurements on the same scale, that they would look even better?

Quinn
05-17-2007, 02:55 AM
Coasters!

Perfect use for the driver cutouts! Or small cutting boards for say your home bar. Hmmm....what size would the port cutouts be?

muzz
05-17-2007, 06:23 AM
Vertical Bamboo huh?

Curtis, does this sound familiar?
LMAO!!

I can say without a doubt, how awesome Bamboo is, and it is WITHOUT QUESTION, a very difficult substrate to cut and keep from fraying.
Are they heating the bit to keep it from fraying?

I know this, because I used Carbonized Vertical Bamboo to do my dining room floor(and steps to Foyer and LR), and have had discussion about using the excess I have on hand(with Curtis), to cover a Ryhtmic sub I am contemplating.

These things will be VERY well received(as long as the folks have the dough), the beauty of bamboo is just incredible, and it is VERY strong.

WTG Dave!!

audibleconnoisseur
05-17-2007, 06:47 AM
Love 'em Dave! Chance to be truly vain with both performance and while I am blowing my ears off I can stare at myself in them while I listen and see my facial expressions while I enjoy Josh G or Sarah M to Cassandra W to the Eagles and also watch myself air guitar to some Metallica! Yea, not really THAT vain but they will look beautiful in the family room! ;)

Gotta say I am surprised NO ONE that I have read so far has mentiond the "WAF!?" Guys (and gals), a speaker that is wife friendly and sounds better!!!!! It is a decoration that really reaches deep and I don't mean into your bank account! :D

I have a question though Dave..... all the work and beauty and I know what the pro of the high gloss venir is. So I have to ask how easy these are to scratch when placed or bumped or cleaned. I had a set of Sapphires for a little while and even being careful I managed to scuff and nick them a little with minimal usage and was quite surprised to see the marks while being so careful. Can you speak to your high gloss and its resistance to these nicks and marks/scuffs?

Lastly, I haven't read everything you have posted yet but if you haven't already, what are the numbers? Freq resp, max output, rms, etc? If you are saying it sounds bigger than the 340SE's, I can't wait to hear them, especially with only one woofer cone!

Quinn
05-17-2007, 07:36 AM
Lastly, I haven't read everything you have posted yet but if you haven't already, what are the numbers? Freq resp, max output, rms, etc? If you are saying it sounds bigger than the 340SE's, I can't wait to hear them, especially with only one woofer cone!

At the end of today's crossover info release Dave said tweeter and woofer info is tomorrow. I assume that part will include those specs and graphs.

JohnMichael
05-17-2007, 08:26 AM
The plan right now is to keep the V-LAM cabinets as a higher end option. V-LAM production is S-L-O-W. The 200s, 170s and 340s would definitely benefit from the technology - but I am uncertain if the higher retail pricing would be appropriate.

Of course anything is possible but we will have to evaluate the demand once the Sierra begins shipping.


Or if we could order the cabinets seperately and remount our x-over, woofer and tweeter. I know that would void the warranty but I would be careful. Assuming I could drive the screws into the cabinet.

curtis
05-17-2007, 08:46 PM
Curtis, does this sound familiar?
LMAO!!
Muzz...might be a bit more incentive for you to build that sub now.

muzz
05-17-2007, 09:05 PM
Heheh
Just may be the kick I need bud. :D

dallas
05-31-2007, 01:29 PM
I apologize if this is covered elsewhere. In the pictures of the rear of the cabinet, below the wire terminal there is what looks like a threaded female insert. Is this for mounting purposes?

curtis
05-31-2007, 01:35 PM
I apologize if this is covered elsewhere. In the pictures of the rear of the cabinet, below the wire terminal there is what looks like a threaded female insert. Is this for mounting purposes?
That allows you to secure it to the TP24 stand that was originally designed for the CMT-340.

David also mentioned it could handle the weight of the speaker if it was used in a way that the insert would not pull out....ie. if the speaker was not tilted at all.

YNOS
05-31-2007, 08:46 PM
Anybody in canada want to get rid of their ols system in hope of buying the newer sierra contact me.

YNOS

hitmanr20
06-27-2016, 03:11 PM
I have had a cabinet sitting outdoors for nearly 2 years, fully exposed to all the extremes of Southern California weather; intense sunlight, strong winds, rain and even some cold. The integrity of the cabinet has not been compromised in any way.

Does this mean I could use this for outdoor use?

curtis
06-27-2016, 03:42 PM
Does this mean I could use this for outdoor use?
No. The electronic components are not for outdoor use. This was just to show the durability of the cabinet.

davef
06-29-2016, 11:24 AM
No. The electronic components are not for outdoor use. This was just to show the durability of the cabinet.

100% correct... This was just the empty cabinet, no electronic / mechanical components installed.

cel4145
08-16-2016, 08:16 PM
Got a cabinet strength question for you, Dave, regarding the Horizon center.

I currently have my much smaller Energy RC-LCR inside a small TV stand with my 50" plasma on top. The Horizon won't fit in side the stand. So I had been considering having a custom stand made (can't wall mount the TV). But after reading your opening post, I'm wondering if the Horizon cabinet isn't more than strong enough for my 51 lb TV? The stand on the TV is 13" deep, but has feet inset 0.5" in. The weight would be right close to the frame of the cabinet at the front and the back.

This also works better for me because right now, my TV is at an optimum height. I don't really want to raise it by building a higher stand. The difference between the Energy RC-LCR + stand height and the Horizon is really close. Perfect!

Don't worry. Won't hold you to a warranty on this. :)

Elessar
08-16-2016, 10:40 PM
Got a cabinet strength question for you, Dave, regarding the Horizon center.

I currently have my much smaller Energy RC-LCR inside a small TV stand with my 50" plasma on top. The Horizon won't fit in side the stand. So I had been considering having a custom stand made (can't wall mount the TV). But after reading your opening post, I'm wondering if the Horizon cabinet isn't more than strong enough for my 51 lb TV? The stand on the TV is 13" deep, but has feet inset 0.5" in. The weight would be right close to the frame of the cabinet at the front and the back.

This also works better for me because right now, my TV is at an optimum height. I don't really want to raise it by building a higher stand. The difference between the Energy RC-LCR + stand height and the Horizon is really close. Perfect!

Don't worry. Won't hold you to a warranty on this. :)

Are you sure your 50 inch plasma is only 51 lbs. My old 50" panny weighed abou 100 lbs(98 to be precise). Dont want you to damage that fantastic speaker :)

cel4145
08-17-2016, 01:42 PM
Are you sure your 50 inch plasma is only 51 lbs. My old 50" panny weighed abou 100 lbs(98 to be precise). Dont want you to damage that fantastic speaker :)

Mine was one of the last model series that Panasonic made. They greatly reduced the weight from the older versions.

Elessar
08-17-2016, 07:10 PM
Mine was one of the last model series that Panasonic made. They greatly reduced the weight from the older versions.

Oh sweet! I miss my old Panny :)

Mag_Neato
08-18-2016, 04:14 AM
I have a 58" Panny plasma that is wall mounted. It took a scene from The Ten Commandments to lift it and secure it!

14er
08-19-2016, 05:32 AM
Hey guys, I found this website (http://www.syracusetvrisers.com/index.html) for custom TV risers. Thought this might be another answer for some to get the full on awesomeness of the Horizon.

cel4145
08-21-2016, 10:35 AM
Hey guys, I found this website (http://www.syracusetvrisers.com/index.html) for custom TV risers. Thought this might be another answer for some to get the full on awesomeness of the Horizon.

Thanks! This is awesome. Exactly what I needed :)