cryptic message on sub page? [Archive] - Ascend Acoustics Community

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ebh

01-02-2007, 03:08 PM

http://ascendacoustics.com/pages/products/subs/subintro.html

All it says, is, "Stay Tuned For An Exciting Announcement Regarding Subwoofers for 2007 and Beyond!!!" At least nothing else loads on my computer.

the title of the page still says Hsu subs, so is this just referring to Hsu's new lineup... or something more? :cool:

BradJudy

01-02-2007, 03:19 PM

Well, Hsu did just release a whole new lineup. It could be that, or it could be Ascend subs.

If it is Ascend subs, David has been very tight-lipped. I've talked with him about subs recently in personal communications and he didn't give any indication that I should hold off in favor of upcoming Ascend subs. Of course, he's always tight-lipped about new products.

Wiluven

01-02-2007, 03:54 PM

I called to order a complete system and a Hsu Sub from Ascend and they told me that they are not authorized to sell Hsu Subs for the time being. They wouldn't give much information but said to go ahead and order from Hsu directly and they hope to have the matter worked out sometime in the next few weeks.

drewface

01-02-2007, 05:11 PM

oh man... if there is an ascend sub coming out...

:eek:

woo... i don't know if i'd be able to restrain myself.

davef

01-02-2007, 05:17 PM

BradJudy

01-02-2007, 06:05 PM

Any hint as to when these new options might be available?

muzz

01-02-2007, 07:37 PM

Well this is intriguing :eek: :D

Havelcek

01-03-2007, 06:03 AM

muzz

01-03-2007, 06:12 AM

Put a doilie on it, and a tough plant on top of that!! :p

Remote holder? heheheh

Havelcek

01-03-2007, 06:14 AM

Put a doilie on it, and a tough plant on top of that!! :p

Remote holder? heheheh

We got Verizon fiber optic TV installed the day after and with that picture quality on the new plasma she forgot about the sub pretty quick.

muzz

01-03-2007, 06:21 AM

We got Verizon fiber optic TV installed the day after and with that picture quality on the new plasma she forgot about the sub pretty quick.

:D

NICE!!!!

musicforme

01-03-2007, 11:35 AM

I just bought an SVS PB12-NSD to go with my Ascends and it is impressive, if not maybe even overkill. My wife was NOT happy with how big it was. It was really my own stupid fault...I had made a cardboard replica of the 340SE so my wife understood exactly how big the speakers were going to be but didn't bother with the sub, and its the size of a friggin coffee table.

I feel your pain. I bought a SVS PB10 a little more than a year ago and my wife still makes comments about it from time to time.

I have an order in for a pair of 340s and the matching stands. I made sure she saw a photo of them before placing the order. I was told inventory would be available around January 12th. I wonder if that date has anything to do with the pending announcement.

curtis

01-03-2007, 11:44 AM

If they complain about your sub....then tell them they are lucky you didn't get this: :D

http://changpics.smugmug.com/photos/117489779-M.jpg

muzz

01-03-2007, 12:07 PM

He didn't say that he wanted to be out on the street curtis!! :D

Havelcek

01-03-2007, 02:35 PM

My wife just got two remodeled bathrooms in our house, so I have some leverage.

muzz

01-03-2007, 05:07 PM

My wife just got two remodeled bathrooms in our house, so I have some leverage.

My GF just got a plasma for Xmas..... I smell leverage in the air myself!!:D

daman

01-03-2007, 06:33 PM

GF??? Godfather lol.
I know, I know, lol.

Later, Daman

muzz

01-03-2007, 07:58 PM

Well I already remodeled the 1 1/2 baths in our house, but it was never near Xmas/at a time I was looking to upgrade my sub.....so I got her a plasma, and I would think I have some leverage at this time......

I keep inching closer to giving Brian Ding a call!! :D

JackT

01-04-2007, 06:19 AM

Hi Guys,

We are currently evaluating a few different options regarding subwoofers. I can't mention what those options are, just yet, but I will say that we are excited about it :D

In the meantime -- if you need a subwoofer I strongly recommend evaluating products from SV Sound (SVS) and Hsu Research.

One thing that has changed in recent years is that these sub companies are now also directly competing in the loudspeaker realm. I wonder if that changes the kind of relationships compaines like HSU are interested in having with companies like Ascend. SVS will soon have multiple lines of loudspeakers. The current SBS/SCS look to be pretty good little speakers.

I guess what I'm saying is my guess is Ascend will be offering it's own subwoofer. Right now, it seems like EVERYONE does speakers AND subs. (SVS, HSU, Axiom, AV123, etc.)

Mag_Neato

01-04-2007, 06:30 AM

One thing that has changed in recent years is that these sub companies are now also directly competing in the loudspeaker realm. I wonder if that changes the kind of relationships compaines like HSU are interested in having with companies like Ascend. SVS will soon have multiple lines of loudspeakers. The current SBS/SCS look to be pretty good little speakers.

I guess what I'm saying is my guess is Ascend will be offering it's own subwoofer. Right now, it seems like EVERYONE does speakers AND subs. (SVS, HSU, Axiom, AV123, etc.)

Good point! Since Dave has some roots with M&K I think an Ascend sub is a real possibility.

muzz

01-04-2007, 06:43 AM

Quinn

01-04-2007, 10:54 AM

Even if it's just to complete a 'Package".
As stated above, people like a "Package" deal, and getting it from one Man. is easier.
If dave is doing a Servo type sub, like Brian Dings Direct Servo (NOT the other types), I think it'd sell like hotcakes...

Brian's philosophy of; speed, definition, and articulation would be what I'd expect from an Ascend sub since that is what those M&K subs Dave worked on are known for.

Keep in mind Ascend's value philosophy and what the Brian's kits sell for. Add a cabinet and assembly labor to that price then go against Hsu, SVS, and AV123 for value and it gets tough. I'd think an Ascend sub, to be in line with their speakers, has to come in at $500 or less.

JackT

01-04-2007, 11:12 AM

Brian's philosophy of; speed, definition, and articulation would be what I'd expect from an Ascend sub since that is what those M&K subs Dave worked on are known for.

Keep in mind Ascend's value philosophy and what the Brian's kits sell for. Add a cabinet and assembly labor to that price then go against Hsu, SVS, and AV123 for value and it gets tough. I'd think an Ascend sub, to be in line with their speakers, has to come in at $500 or less.

It would depend on what the sub offered. SVS only has one sub you can get for $500. If we're comparing to SVS, I would say the price range of the PB12-NSD to SB12-Plus would be a good target, which is $600- $700. Then again, even SVS has subs that cost 2 grand.

muzz

01-04-2007, 03:51 PM

I agree Quinn, probably not in the cards.

Thats what I want to build myself, I've come close to the "Submit" button a few times already, just haven't hit it!! :D

BGHD

01-04-2007, 06:49 PM

Well I already remodeled the 1 1/2 baths in our house, but it was never near Xmas/at a time I was looking to upgrade my sub.....so I got her a plasma, and I would think I have some leverage at this time......

You got HER a plasma. That's a cool Jedi mind trick. I'll have to remember that one for next time. :D

muzz

01-04-2007, 07:11 PM

hehehe
She hasn't even noticed that I have 2x 170's, and 1x 340 that have replaced the Boston Acoustics... I did that LAST month(2/3 finished basement, with my TV, computer, and Sound system, she doesn't come down here that often)!!

The Plasma goodwill has given me a window of opportunity, which I plan on turning into a new sub..... :D

"Think ahead, you do muzz"..........

Bahahaha

Jonnyozero3

01-06-2007, 08:33 AM

ebh

01-07-2007, 04:30 PM

i too would be hopeful to see a sub like the rythmik servo sub somehow put together in an ascend branding. i agree that the speaker philosophies of dave and brian seem compatible, and that is why i'm really champing at the bit to build a rythmik direct servo (probably will happen in late summer/early fall).

i also agree with quinn it's unlikely given the price range, but without knowing more about both companies' business models, anything seems possible. I have no idea what it costs ascend to build a cabinet, but a basic cabinet to hold a 12" rythmik sub doesn't seem like it would be that difficult to produce. and now that brian has a number of different lines (12", 15" and the push-pull orientation) there could be a nice spread of products and prices.

anyway it will be interesting to see what's coming.

JackT

02-01-2007, 10:10 AM

Any idea when we can expect to hear the exciting announcement? Will it be this quarter?

Jonnyozero3

02-01-2007, 05:34 PM

I just hope the announcement isn't that they'll be carrying SVS....

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29188

Why We Fired SVS as an Advertiser
Several things have gone on in the past few weeks that have caused us to think about what's important to us and how we want to treat the forum community. One thing that we have realized is that at some point, when people take advantage and do not heed implied requests and basic etiquette you have to make a decision.

SVS has been an advertiser at Audioholics for some time. We like their products and continute to believe they make some of the cheapest subs out there with a good "bang for the buck" factor. Regardless of not allowing them to advertise, this has nothing to do with them as a manuafacturer.

As a company, however, their marketing methods have gotten out of control - at least on our site. If you'll notice, there is likely not a single subwoofer thread on this forum that doesn't have people talking about SVS. There is a reason for this and it has to do with the marketing methods of SVS as a company. They freely admitted to us that forum participation of their staff and SVS owners is the driving force behind their marketing strategy. This is actually kind of intelligent - until it is abused.

It is being abused on our site - to the point that we were being told that attempting to keep review threads on topic for non-SVS products was basically unacceptable behavior on our part. We were being told how to behave on our own site.

We attempted to let it go and redirect threads as needed, but a recent discussion made it clear that this was unacceptable. We STILL were going to quietly let them go on their way until a recent post appeared on our forums regurgitating the exact conversation SVS had with Gene recently.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sjmarcy
I just joined this forum, and read a few threads. I note the declaration: "Where audio and video equipment undergoes rigorous objective and subjective tests by our staff, ensuring that marketing slogans aren't the only guidelines for your home theater choices"....yet I see the President posting encoutgement for Axiom products, a site advertiser. Hmmm. And another post where a member was called a fanboy by an Audioholic staff member on a different matter?

What's up with the difference between this sort of thing and the Forum's written mission statement?
Note the post count. This was written by someone who had a direct conversation with our contact at SVS. That pretty much did it for us.

As a result we have fired SVS as an advertiser and will enforce the following forum rules:

* We will not ban SVS threads about SVS products - they make some cool subs, so people are free to talk about them as they'd like - in their own threads.
* All SVS employees have been banned from the website.
* We will not allow SVS posts in non-SVS review threads. I'm sorry, but it has come down to this.
* Any critiques of this policy should be done via PM, not on the forums. We took a long time to come to this conclusion and we were willing to lose a lot of monthly income over this in order to make sure we don't allow our forums to become a marketing tool for a single advertiser. We are not the first (or likely last) website to enforce similar rules.

Thanks for your understanding. We hate making stuff like this public, but it seemed we were given no choice in the matter.
__________________
Clint DeBoer
Editor in Chief
Audioholics

JackT

02-01-2007, 05:54 PM

I just hope the announcement isn't that they'll be carrying SVS....

So Clint has a problem with SVS. That really doesn't mean anything to me. Didn't he come on these forums one time and rip us a new one because we were criticising Audioholics? If SVS made a deal with Ascend and it meant a great product, I would be happy.

IMO, that won't be the announcement, though.

chas

02-01-2007, 07:09 PM

If SVS made a deal with Ascend and it meant a great product, I would be happy.

Agreed.

Jonnyozero3

02-01-2007, 07:49 PM

Point taken. I'm no big fan of audioholics, and I've stated that before. That said, I don't like some of the things I've seen about how SVS does business. AH actually went up a notch in my book by not taking any crap from them and calling them out. I'm not saying some of their subs might not be decent, I just don't think their modus operandi meshes well with the integrity and honesty of ascend. That's all.

ebh

02-01-2007, 10:21 PM

the one thing that seems so strange to me is the heated and often nasty competition between the internet direct sub manufacturers (or maybe just their various fanboys). i just don't really get it. i would trust ascend to make a decision about subs or any other product based on quality alone (and bang for the buck), but i agree that things are getting out of hand in the marketing of the most competitive subs.

all the more reason for davef to design his own line of sub or partner with a more mellow 3rd party like brian at rythmik. ascend's current products stand on their own (i.e. quality, not slick marketing or anything else), and one of the great things about the ascend community is they are open to other people's opinions, respectful about disagreements and from what i see ultimately champion people to find out what speakers work for them regardless of whether they happen to be ascends or not.

anyway, i look forward to seeing what happens in the area of subwoofers for ascend. i'm not sure how things have gotten so out of hand on the various general purpose audio message boards.

davef

02-01-2007, 11:28 PM

Hey guys,

I just wanted to say thanks and I ABSOLUTELY value your opinions, especially with regards to the direction we take with subwoofers. I wish I did have some news to announce but absolutely no decisions have been made yet. As soon as we finish our year-end accounting mess, subs will have my FULL attention.

I will say this regarding SVS -- the guys over there have been nothing but absolutely professional and open with me over the years (besides being a lot of fun to hangout with) The online world of audio has been really heated lately but trust me when I say if you get all of these companies together in the same room (employees and customers) everyone is treated with respect and admiration. SVS make great subs and a wonderful speaker at its price point (I have become quite fond of the SB12-plus)

The competition between all the great sub manufacturers just means better subwoofers for all of you :D

bikeman

02-02-2007, 04:01 AM

As soon as we finish our year-end accounting mess,
Too much cash, not enough time to count? No problem. Give me a call. I'm your man. :D

subs will have my FULL attention.
OK, I'll wait. In the meantime, I'll spend some coin upgrading the fleet (9 bikes).

(I have become quite fond of the SB12-plus)
Cool. That's on my list.

David

JackT

02-02-2007, 08:27 AM

OK, I'll wait. In the meantime, I'll spend some coin upgrading the fleet (9 bikes).

David

You really do have a problem, don't you? :)

(BTW I lived in Syracuse for about 8 years. I love that town.)

audibleconnoisseur

02-02-2007, 09:10 AM

Bikeman,

I have a Marushi Aerolite triathalon/road bike if you are intersted!

BradJudy

02-02-2007, 09:15 AM

I generally don't worry about the decisions DaveF makes regarding business partners. He has really high standards for the products, service and the company's practices - higher than what most of us use when choosing a product (we only have to live with the item we bought, he has to live with all of the customer feedback about his business partners).

I hope things are going well Dave, we'll have to catch up via e-mail once you catch your breath.

muzz

02-03-2007, 06:55 AM

I think Dave should give Brian Ding a call, and see if they can work something out.
He's looking for resellers, says so right on his site, and maybe volume sales could help on the pricing.

I've talked to him on the phone, and have seen him post on forums, seems like a straight up guy, that cares about actual sound quality.
IMO, It's not ALL about the thunder, and after talking with Brian, he feels the same way.

shane55

02-03-2007, 11:20 PM

Well, regardless of the Audioholics situation, I had a great buying experience with SVS... both before and AFTER the purchase. Ron was completely responsive and helpful in tuning-in my excellent sub and giving reality to the term 'customer satisfaction'.

I've got nothing but praise for Ascend and SVS and am glad that I came upon these two great companies.

The best to them both !:D

shane

chas

02-04-2007, 06:16 AM

cyberbri

02-05-2007, 08:44 AM

I agree about commending AH about what they did. Personally I wouldn't buy an SVS sub, even if they are good subs, due to the past history of SVS, and their techniques and business practices more recently in the last few years. I won't get into that here...

But even so, to me SVS are more for people who want max SPL, and HSU (and AV123, ACI) and the like are for people who want both SPL and articulation, musicality, and detail. Some of the SVS may fit this, but some definitely do not, including the 20-39+ I heard (all boom and no detail).

JackT

02-05-2007, 08:57 AM

I agree about commending AH about what they did. Personally I wouldn't buy an SVS sub, even if they are good subs, due to the past history of SVS, and their techniques and business practices more recently in the last few years. I won't get into that here...

If you aren't going to get into it, then it's probably best you don't make the allegation at all.

cyberbri

02-05-2007, 09:01 AM

To me, business ethics are just as important as the product a company makes. If people bring up where sub cabinets are made, and that makes a difference to some people, I would hope that some people might take into consideration how a company acts when considering its products.

There is the guerilla marketing over the years on various forums, but there is more to it than that.

People are free to PM me...

audibleconnoisseur

02-05-2007, 09:04 AM

Hey guys,

First, let me express that these comments are with the utmost respect from me to you and for all involved.

I think that with the very positive nature of this forum and all of you, we should just let this one pass and leave the responses to the AVS forum and others, elsewhere. Both do a good job and both have their reasons for existing. All different people have great subs to fit their lifestyle and budget and personal taste. Let's let those guys talk to the issue, but keep it Ascend here. One thing I really like about this forum is it is moderated well and a lot of freedom is given to use for us here. Let's focus on the great systems that Dave is putting together and how they make us feel and not the SVS and AVS negativity that is flowing from there.

I hope you all know that I respect all that provide their opinions and this one is mine to the subject. Dave, I hope you are ok with me doing this but I think this could tilt the wrong way quickly depending on whom wishes to engage in the conversation. Our only agenda here should be to share and read information that can help us better educate ourselves to the Ascend and HT/Audio experience! Respect to you all ;)

cyberbri

02-05-2007, 09:08 AM

ac,

I brought it up because Dave said this:

I ABSOLUTELY value your opinions, especially with regards to the direction we take with subwoofers

and because I would be very disappointed if Ascend were to team up with SVS. I don't think it would happen anyway, because SVS makes their own speakers now anyways.

But I do think there is such a thing as karma.

audibleconnoisseur

02-05-2007, 10:00 AM

Based on what Dave said, I will recant a few of the comments, but this was mainly to hope that the conversation would remain with tact and discretion to professionalism within our arguments. We are pretty good at this but a few early on lead me to do this.

Dave, we love em and hope you can get them back or come to an agreement to make your own that will best the SVS and or the HSU - although tough to do for the $. :eek: Was that a challenge???

Quinn

02-05-2007, 11:44 AM

But even so, to me SVS are more for people who want max SPL, and HSU (and AV123, ACI) and the like are for people who want both SPL and articulation, musicality, and detail. Some of the SVS may fit this, but some definitely do not, including the 20-39+ I heard (all boom and no detail).

I was surprised at CES how much better the SVS plus series drivers are. I too had always felt that SVS' strength is building subs to win SPL drag races. With the sealed SB12 SVS has shown that they can do musical too as it is a very musical sub.

curtis

02-05-2007, 11:47 AM

just imagine if Hsu had a sealed sub. :D

audibleconnoisseur

02-05-2007, 11:52 AM

What if HSU did the 3.3 with dual ports and dual plugs with a three set toggle switch that was

music - music only
16Hz or 18Hz - max extension
25Hz - max output

That would be sweet. Worlds first three way variable tuning sub..... :rolleyes:

Jonnyozero3

02-05-2007, 02:57 PM

I think you can run the Hsu VTF series overdamped in a sealed with all the ports plugged (they'll sell you an extra plug for that). But, I haven't heard any impressions on how good it sounds, and what the differences are. I'm interested in doing so though. They're so cheap you can buy an extra one to offset any SPL loss and run them both sealed :p

I wish Ilkka had taken a sealed set of measurements on the 3.2 over on HTshack :(

audibleconnoisseur

02-05-2007, 05:17 PM

Maybe we can get the Dr. to do this or run a test or offer his opinion on the matter at the HSU site. Are you logged in over there as well? If so, what is your SN?

Jonnyozero3

02-05-2007, 08:27 PM

Look for the little blue picture of the plane and the name "JonnyOzero3" and you'll find me :p

audibleconnoisseur

02-06-2007, 08:34 AM

Yea, that would be a good idea. I know that many log on as another SN just to remain 'unknown.' You will find me the same there as well, just spelled "AudiblConoiseur" instead ;)

stimuli

02-08-2007, 04:35 AM

Hi Guys,

We are currently evaluating a few different options regarding subwoofers. I can't mention what those options are, just yet, but I will say that we are excited about it :D

In the meantime -- if you need a subwoofer I strongly recommend evaluating products from SV Sound (SVS) and Hsu Research.

Dave, any hints as to when we can expect an announcement? I'll be in the market for a sub soon, to compliment my CBM 170s, and am looking at Hsu and SVS. The lack of a subwoofer option from you seems like a glaring hole in the lineup.

If you are developing your own, you'd have to produce either something as good as SVS and Hsu, and cheaper, or better than them, but priced about the same. SVS in particular are heavy hitters performance-wise, with Hsu focused more on value and practicality (they are priced very reasonably in Canada). Does Ascend have something to bring to the table?

As a consumer of audio hardware, I'm ecstatic about all these high quality companies advancing the market rapidly with breakthrough products at bargain prices. Their competition with each other accelerates innovation.

Quinn

02-08-2007, 06:50 AM

Dave, any hints as to when we can expect an announcement? I'll be in the market for a sub soon, to compliment my CBM 170s, and am looking at Hsu and SVS. The lack of a subwoofer option from you seems like a glaring hole in the lineup.

If you are developing your own, you'd have to produce either something as good as SVS and Hsu, and cheaper, or better than them, but priced about the same. SVS in particular are heavy hitters performance-wise, with Hsu focused more on value and practicality (they are priced very reasonably in Canada). Does Ascend have something to bring to the table?

As a consumer of audio hardware, I'm ecstatic about all these high quality companies advancing the market rapidly with breakthrough products at bargain prices. Their competition with each other accelerates innovation.

I can't find the post but someone e-mailing Hsu was told by Hsu that they decided to consolidate distribution by elimimating authorized dealers. If this is the case, which I expect it is because it doesn't make sense for Ascend to stop carrying the subs without something else lined up, Ascend got caught unprepared. I wouldn't expect an Ascend sub anytime soon.

bikeman

02-08-2007, 08:16 AM

If this is the case, which I expect it is because it doesn't make sense for Ascend to stop carrying the subs without something else lined up, Ascend got caught unprepared.
Business isn't this simple. Lots more behind this that probably won't see the light of day. It's none of our business but it sure is our curiosity.

I wouldn't expect an Ascend sub anytime soon.
I agree but I do expect a partnership soon. Stay tuned.

David

stimuli

02-08-2007, 08:49 AM

Yeah, I don't see Ascend producing subs. SVS and Hsu sell speakers, but I don't know who is buying them. Axiom sells subs, but they don't appeal to me.

I like businesses that do one thing, and do it well.

cyberbri

02-08-2007, 09:21 AM

stimuli

02-08-2007, 09:53 AM

I've never heard either, but that's an apples to oranges comparison. The PB10-NSD is a 10" woofer with a 300 Watt amp, and the x is an 8" w/ 150 Watt amp. The rocket x-series sub does look cool, though.

cyberbri

02-08-2007, 10:00 AM

If you were responding to me, I wasn't referring to the x-sub, although it is a great sub. The Rocket and x-series are separate lines as well.

I was referring to the ULW/UFW-10s and 12s from AV123, and their upcoming monster subs (BMF and others).

You can get the UFW-12 without the RDES eq, but
http://www.av123.com/products_product.php?section=subwoofers&product=8.1
it has a built-in peq and a 1,000 watt amp.

bikeman

02-08-2007, 11:35 AM

And you'd be surprised how many people are buying the SBS-01s from SVS... For that price I'd definitely go with AV123's x-series speakers over them, for both looks and sound quality.
I have not heard the SVS speakers but I own the X-LS's and I've compared them at length to the Ascend 200's. The 200's, like the SVS are much, much smaller and sealed. The sound is very different. As a stand alone, the X-LS's have the big advantage of another octave lower. With a sub, the 200's demonstrate to me why they cost a bit more. I'd like to compare the SVS speakers to the 200's. That would be more informative to me.

David

Quinn

02-08-2007, 12:00 PM

AV123 / Rocket makes outstanding subs as well. As does ACI and many other companies. It's frustrating when people talk about subs and only mention the two companies, or only mention the one that starts with an S and ends with an S as if there are no other companies out there making good subs.

And you'd be surprised how many people are buying the SBS-01s from SVS... For that price I'd definitely go with AV123's x-series speakers over them, for both looks and sound quality.

I'd take the SBS-1s for sound quality. The SBS-1 is more accurate and "Ascend" like. The X-LS has the nicer cabinet and more bass.

I'd also take the SVS SB-12 over the UFW-12 for SQ. And if you know how critical I've been of SVS in the past those are words I never thought I'd be typing.

cyberbri

02-08-2007, 12:24 PM

I'd be interested in hearing the SB12, but the others don't impress me much (compared to other brands).

And I wish I had gotten a chance to hear the SBS-01s more that day, but what I did hear wasn't too impressive (at the time). I'd need to spend some time with them to get a better idea of how they sound.

I probably wouldn't mind the x-ls's "more bass" because I'd be pairing it with a sub anyway. I should be getting a pair of x-ls to demo pretty soon, so I'll be able to comment on them with some first-hand experience.

Jonnyozero3

02-08-2007, 06:53 PM

I'd also take the SVS SB-12 over the UFW-12 for SQ. And if you know how critical I've been of SVS in the past those are words I never thought I'd be typing.

Yeah, I just said "holy shit what?" in my head.

edit: wow I can swear!

JackT

02-10-2007, 07:00 AM

Jonnyozero3

02-10-2007, 07:08 AM

I thought everyone in the HT world had seen that by now ;)

shane55

02-10-2007, 11:18 PM

Interesting:

http://www.svsound.com/news-news.cfm

Indeed! ;)

Jonnyozero3

02-11-2007, 03:04 AM

"You can't fire me! I already quit!" :p

cyberbri

02-11-2007, 10:00 AM

I'm sure some of you have heard of bossobass. Anyway, I encourage you to read his post here (unfortunately I can't link directly to the post, just the page it's on) for another perspective. It's at the bottom of the page right now, but if other posts are added it will cease to be the last post on the page:
http://www.av123forum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=18804&perpage=30&pagenumber=4

bikeman

02-11-2007, 10:12 AM

The Boss and the guys @ SVS have been going at it for some time. The major issue that I've noticed over time is the SVS crew don't respect a difference of opinion. They have difficulty addressing the issue without attacking the messenger. I don't know if it helps or hurts their business. I just tend to ignore it.

David

cyberbri

02-11-2007, 10:20 AM

From bossobass's post, it's more than a difference of opinion. And I have seen some of the things he mentioned as well where he wasn't even involved..

chas

02-11-2007, 10:58 AM

I actually kinda liked DogWizard's post in the same thread at 123.

SteveCallas

02-12-2007, 10:20 PM

Most of that "list of complaints" is either fluff or just a matter of disagreement. I tend to agree with a lot of the things Tom has said. When your product is that popular, you will always have detractors and enemies, just for doing what you do. This audio game is chock full of bitter old men and it doesn't take much to get on their bad side - man do they hold grudges too. There is a group of such bitter old men who do their best to take SVS down a notch whenever they can, and I'm not referring to Bosso.

When it really comes down to it, there really aren't any commercial subs that are very impressive, all things considered. That's not "throwing down the gauntlet" or anything, it just is what it is.