340SEC in Closed Cabinet

[ChasO]

More newbie than anything else. I am putting in a plasma display and upgrading an old Time Windows stereo setup to HT 5.1.

I am auditioning Axioms M22s which are a little brighter and less warm than I would like but a friend brought over his sub and the whole thing sounds a lot better.

I am awaiting a set of 340se to compare to the Axioms and if what you all are saying here is more right than wrong, the 340ses will blow them away.

But, today I encountered a new problem. I have a small issue about where to position the speakers and I tried moving the M22s into the top of the built-in cabinet (about six feet wide) where the plasma will go. Immediately, things got less detailed and incredibly boomy as if the cabinet were an echo chamber for low sound, I assume are coming out of the port on the back of the M22s.

OK, so the speakers will not work in the cabinet, and I will have to do some fancy work to hang them, whichever ones get the nod. But the center channel MUST go in the cabinet just above the top of the screen.

Question. Since the 340SEC is a ported speaker, will it turn out to dislike being inside the cabinet as much as the Axioms did? Anybody got any thoughts about ported vs non-ported center channels and their placement requirements.

I have learned a lot by reading this forum, and through a couple of very kind and generously long emails from Dave F, and I am hoping that I am not running into a problem I cannot solve with Ascend.

Thanks for any advice you offer.

Charlie O.

[Charles D]

one thought depending on your cabinent of course. but you might be able to remove the back of the cabinent (from just the section where the center would be ) in such a way as you could replace it later if you wanted to. alot of them only have like 3/16 particle board for back. that would open up the back so the port might sound more normal. depends prob how deep it is and size of the erea. also will prob depend on if you are running them as large or X'ed @ 80

I'm sure this wouldn't be ideal but it might work or at least help. maybe if you can post some pics it will help people come up with ideas.

After rereading your post more carefully it says "built in" as in a wall right behind it ?? if so my idea abviously is out.. only other thought is if you could run it as small (as in crossed over at 80hz to sub ) and plug the port. ( ask Ascend about that for sure as i dont really know how it would effect speaker and sound ) or maybe run two htm-200's for center there sealed but i dont know how well they would keep up or match the 340's. hehe I'm prob ganna get all kinds of flames for that one :)

disclaimer: I am not all knowing so these are just ideas I'm throughing out.

let us know what you end up doing and how it sounds.
good luck :)

[Mag_Neato]

Putting speakers in a cabinet is pretty much audio-death! Avoid at all costs if possible. Speakers are designed as free-standing units to sound their best away from walls, out in the open. A friend, who is not an audiophile by any means, purchased some Infinty towers with the built-in powered subs. At first he was thrilled with the sound. After moving to a new house, his wife wanted a custom built-in entertainment center for the new room. The guy who built it made custom fitted speaker cabinets with nice grills that were removable. He regrets that decision, but has to live with it (and his wife!). When I was over there and listened, the bass was very dominant, and I thought the imaging was terrible.

If you need to have them on shelves, maybe the 200 would work better being a sealed design. Give Dave a hollar and get his opinion.

[Quinn]

Ask Ascend if the EXBAC crossover they use in the 340CC to compensate for the baffle effect would help you for putting them in a cabinet.

[Charles D]

I agree with Mag_Neato any speaker inside a cabinent is more than likely going to degrade the sound , sometimes a little sometimes alot (usually alot).

couple other ideas.. wall mounting above cabinent ( might make center to far from screen )

and this idea is not mine, i read it in another thread , i think here on this site.
someone was talking about mounting a sliding shelf to lay center on so when they wanted to watch movie with better sound they could slide out shelf and have the speaker "out of the box" still would kinda have a echo chamber behind it. but prob would be a deff improvement.

[ChasO]

Thanks for these thoughts. I am about to commit audio hari-kari.

The "cabinet" is a recessed box in the wall, and is absolutely built-in, like a big china cabinet except that is an audio-visual cabinet and has my "records" and some books at the very top. They will leave and we will rebuild the shelving. When the cabinet was first built, it held a Sony 32" XBR, but said Sony is on its last legs and it is time for Hi-Def TV. At the same time, I have decided to take advantage of a Yamaha tuner that I bought a few years ago for an HT setup and do everything at once.

The plasma will fit across the entire middle section of the cabinet with the electronics on pull out shelves beneath the plasma and a six-foot wide shelf across the top of the cabinet, above the plasma, for the center speaker and whatever else my wife decides to put up there like pottery or other space fillers (it is the necessary trade-off).

The top of the cabinet is eight feet high and there is a cathedral ceiling above it so theoretically, I could place the center channel on the wall at about 8 feet, six inches to the bottom of the channel. I have assumed that this is way high and have rejected the notion, but it now may be back in play.

The current idea is to put the center channel on the shelf above the plasma. It will be about six to eight inches higher than the top of the plasma because I assume that I will soon (four to six years) get a bigger, better display and move the first display into the bedroom at some time as determined by the emergence of bigger, better display formats (both as to pixel count and display type--OLED or SED).

The shelf extends to the back wall, a real wall, and will have a height from top to bottom of about 18 inches and a depth of about 20 inches. Thus, it forms its own box of 18" x 20" x 72".

And my choice is to put the center channel there or to mount it on the wall at 8 1/2 feet. If I read you all correctly, either choice is the functional equivalent of audio hari-kari, and I am hoping that someone here will throw me a lifeline.

[HBW]

I have just installed a 340cSE in a cabinet on top of a 32 inch monitor. Cabinet has a good bit of space (maybe 20 inches) behind the speaker. I was concerned about the performance as I was upgrading from a sealed design. I have center and 170SE mains set to small with crossover set at 80 and am using a HSU VTF2 sub. So far, it sounds great and is not base heavy at all. Based on my experience, I would give it a try and then consider wall mount if it does not work. By the way, the 170se's sound fantastic. Good luck.

[Lou-the-dog]

Although the placement is not ideal to start with I am just wondering if some sort of acoustical treatment inside the shelf area might be in order. If the sound turns out boomy them maybe some sort of bass trap behind the speaker may improve the placement situation. Maybe consider some research on this in case. Also make sure to angle the speaker to the listening position and make sure the speaker is not recessed back from the edge of the shelf.

Randy

[Asliang]

More newbie than anything else. I am putting in a plasma display and upgrading an old Time Windows stereo setup to HT 5.1.

I am auditioning Axioms M22s which are a little brighter and less warm than I would like but a friend brought over his sub and the whole thing sounds a lot better.

I am awaiting a set of 340se to compare to the Axioms and if what you all are saying here is more right than wrong, the 340ses will blow them away.

But, today I encountered a new problem. I have a small issue about where to position the speakers and I tried moving the M22s into the top of the built-in cabinet (about six feet wide) where the plasma will go. Immediately, things got less detailed and incredibly boomy as if the cabinet were an echo chamber for low sound, I assume are coming out of the port on the back of the M22s.

OK, so the speakers will not work in the cabinet, and I will have to do some fancy work to hang them, whichever ones get the nod. But the center channel MUST go in the cabinet just above the top of the screen.

Question. Since the 340SEC is a ported speaker, will it turn out to dislike being inside the cabinet as much as the Axioms did? Anybody got any thoughts about ported vs non-ported center channels and their placement requirements.

I have learned a lot by reading this forum, and through a couple of very kind and generously long emails from Dave F, and I am hoping that I am not running into a problem I cannot solve with Ascend.

Thanks for any advice you offer.

Charlie O.

A ported speaker is probably not gonna like being in a cabinet. I think sealed centers are often offered for this purpose.

[BGHD]

I had my 340c inside the center section of a Salamander triple and didn't like the sound of it. I did everything I could to let it breathe (removed the back & internal dividers), but it still sounded hollow to me. Not super-noticeable, but enough to bug me. Since I moved it out onto the top of the console below the wall-mounted tv, the hollowness is gone. I think you'll just have to try it out.

[bri1270]

I installed my 340 classics in the wall. I made custom boxes that are 20" deep. Dave told me they needed to be at least 14" so I figured I give them a few extra. No difference from the way they sound now to the way they sounded when they weren't in there. I cross over at 80hz, so there's not much bass going to them anyway, which I think is the key.