Dazed and Confused...an average consumers take on audio shopping

[Couch Commander]

Hi all,
I have been looking at buying my first set up for my HT (80%) and audio (20%) I purchased my display (Sony 60" rplcd) by doing months of research on AVS. I felt like I learned what to look for, what my needs were, and what my need WOULD be after some time of research. Which brings me to my audio search.
I ...like most ascend owners....am looking for the "bang for the buck" and am willing to sacrifice looks for $ and sound. The search started as many do...in a Circuit City sound room. I listened to a very good sounding Polk/Velodyne set up and a nice sounding Infinity set up as well. So I went to AVS. I was quickly drawn to Ascends,Rockets, Aperion,Axiom and other bang for the buck companies. I really had my mind made up on Ascends (mainly because of customer service and high praises of the products but also because of its community both here and AVS. I am NOT an audiophile and I really (no matter how much I read) dont get how crossover,frequency response, nominal impedance,or most of what DaveF talks about (sorry Dave its all greek!)affect the final sound. I am lost with terms like bright,natural,etc. Like I said the TV was much easier to research because the needs are not as abstract or subjective as audio. I have listend to Polk ,Infinity ,Athena ,Paradigm(Not studio series), Klipsch,JBL(incl. Northridge),Boston,Martin Logan, and a few others I am sure I am forgeting. All of them sounded good....the more I listen the more confused I get! Although I did notice one thing with nearly all of them(at least it seemed) the bigger the speaker...the better the sound. For example the smaller Titans didnt sound as good as the monitors. The Klipsch Synergy didnt sound as good as the reference. The monitor 60 polks didnt sound as good as the monitor 70's. I went back to Ascends and started judging the 340's for the size...they are not floor standers and are smaller in measurements but are they smaller in sound?.......does size matter??? :rolleyes:
How do the 340's compare to actual floor standers?? The systems I looked at made my chest vibrate during explosions and the highs made two swords clashing together sound like they were in front of your nose. The music could get so loud you couldnt talk to the person next to you but it was still crystal clear.( to my noob ears!) Do the 170's and 340's give the same thing??
I took the advice of those on AVS and listened to as many as possible this last weekend....all it did was confuse me more as they all sounded good albeit slightly different. The horn tweeters on the klipsch were nice and bright sounding (I also looked into a great package ...BIC Acoustech (also with horn tweeters.) Am I making this choice more difficult than it needs to be or do I need to read and listen more??? Sorry for the long post. I may not have even asked any very good questions but I feel a ton better just having put all th info I have gotten the last couple months into words. Maybe this was more venting than asking a question. Still....Dazed and Confused

EDIT**** Havent even talked about Receivers yet......... :confused:

[Kurt C.]

Welcome. Your long post deserves an in-depth reply, but I'll be brief since you need to simplify.

First: limit your sources of information to honest experts. The 'experts' part eliminates most audio forums. 'Honest' gets rid those whose profits depend on your decision. So after you've read this reply, don't waste energy reading more opinions from people from me. :D

Second: continue learning how to listen critically. It isn't easy. So far you've identified is how important the bass response of a speaker is. The absolute depth of bass does depend, in part, on how big a speaker is. However, since most HTs have subwoofer, you should try to look beyond just the size/bass capacity to other important things like how realistically the speaker reproduces voices and music. For tips on how to listen to and compare speakers, read the following article:Battle of the Bookshelfs (http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/article.asp?section_id=2&article_id=196&page_number=1)

For a given price, smaller (ie bookshelf) speakers can do a better job of everything but producing the deepest bass.

Third: narrow your choices. Ascend, Athena, Infinity, Paradigm and Polk are a good start since you have access to them. Add the best speakers from the above article and narrow your list with recommended speakers from the above manufactureres at various price ranges (http://www.stereo-speaker-buyers-guide.com/stereo-speakers.html)

Finally: since the sound of a speaker depends critically on how it interacts with the room, you need to make your final decision by listening to your top two or three choices AT HOME. Ascend will give you a 30-day free trial period. Most electronics stores have a resonable return policy so you can simply take back the ones you don't want.

Best of Luck. (PS--Don't be swayed by the fact that I have Athena AS-B1s. After listening to them for 6 months, I'm saving for Ascend CMB-170s)

[Eddie Horton]

When I started putting together a serious HT, I listened to many of the models you mentioned from Klipsch, JBL, Infinity, and others. After reading for months on the various forums, I decided that the internet direct offers were more than worth considering. After having my Ascends for a little over a year, and in that year going back and listening to the ones I already tested previously as well as many more that I originally had not, I can honestly say that the Ascends are in a different class altogether. The drivers and crossovers are first class. Although they give up a little in the bass department, anyone with an HT will want a good sub, so this is a moot point. I cross my 340's and 170's over at 80Hz to my HSU VTF3-MkII. Pick out a couple of different B&M models and audition them, if possible, in your home against the Ascends or whatever internet-direct speakers you choose. This is the best way to be sure of your purchase.

[bikeman]

That's some good advice from Kurt. This especially.

"Finally: since the sound of a speaker depends critically on how it interacts with the room, you need to make your final decision by listening to your top two or three choices AT HOME."

I would not be overly concerned with the base response. All speakers are a matter of trade offs. It is my experience that the lowest octave is the most difficult to incorporate and to get it you will either have to pay a bunch more or live with the upper octaves being less than you bargained for. Also, in most cases, the "full range" speaker will not go low enough for HT. A good sub can fill in the bottom octave but nothing short of new speakers can fill in the upper octaves.
Ascends are not the best speaker on the market. I do believe they are the best value that I've heard if you're looking for a neutral speaker with an excellent frequency response.
The cost of return shipping makes the Ascends a bargain even if you only get to "rent" them for a month. They are an excellent speaker to use as a reference even if you wind up preferring a different speaker. The Ascends will give you a very good baseline as to why you prefer one over the other.
Take this with a grain of salt. I own 340's and I've been thrilled with them since day one.
Shopping for speakers should be a fun experience. Sit back and enjoy. Whichever speaker brings the biggest smile to your face, that's the keeper.

David

[BGHD]

I'm an "average consumer" too. I feel your pain/confusion. If anything, by auditioning, you should start to get a feel for a price range. There must be a point where you think you'd receive diminishing returns at increasing price points. That helped me narrow down the choices a bit.

FWIW, the Ascends can play cleanly at very loud levels. And, with a good sub, physical size of the speaker doesn't matter.

Good luck.