Finally got my Ascends

[Jorge59]

I finally got a pair of CBM-170 + CMT 340c + Hsu STF-2 sub. And a Marantz SR 8400 to run them.

They were double packed and survived well the trip from NJ to Brazil in the plane luggage.

First of all I must thank David F for all his support. Secondly, I must retreat my initial statement (based on the website photos) that the speakers looked like black coffins. I actually found them to be quite nice looking.

Then some initial impressions, as I still don't have my whole new set up in place. The Marantz/Ascends will replace my current system: Yamaha RXV-520 and Polk RM 600 speakers (5.1 HT package). These are small stellites 100Wpc with a 50W 8" active sub.

I started plugging the speakers and sub to the Yammi (like A/Bing the old speaker front set with the new Ascend/Hsu (the 2 surrounds remained).

I did not find a big improvement, if any. Although the 340c immediately showed his power and the 170 mains emphasized the highs and proved to be much more analytical, the overall imaging was worse. Of course, there must be something wrong with calibration and room placement, because $1.000 3.1 speakers can't sound worse than a 5.1 $380 speaker set.

I'm not an audiophile, but I felt like there was a big hole between the low end and the high frequencies. Where did the midrange hide? Upper bass almost disappeared, voice was laid back. No soundstage, bad imaging.

Then, I thought the Ascends did not match well with the Yammi and started connecting the Marantz. This was hard. It is no plug and play thing like the Yammi. The manual is not that good, the remote is too complex (and I have no patience for that). Finally, I connected and old CD player and played the Santana "Shaman" disk. Then I played a Sade CD through a DVD player (with digital input). Same feeling: where are the middles?

The STF-2 is respectable for the lower frequencies, like bass drums (it rocks the room), the 170 tweeters well reveal the cymbals. But where is the rest of the band? Something seems to steal the bass guitar, which I love (and play). Voice continued laid back though I had to increase the volume of the 170 mains because the 340c was overrunning them in the flat set up.

I will have to call some expert to help me set up the new system. Hope to return with better news soon. Any help in between will be appreciated.

[bikeman]

Wow. Something is definitely way off and I'd recommend getting Ascend involved for sure. Do you have a set-up disk like AVIA? Sorry to hear after all the wait.

David

[curtis]

remember to set the speakers to small, crossover on the Marantz to 80hz, crossover on the STF-2 set to "out".

[Eddie]

Holy cow!

Recently I have for the first time heard the Ascends being accused of various things, but lack of midrange is definitely not one of them.

There is something very wrong going on.

Did you check to make sure that the speakers are in phase?

[davef]

Hi Jorge59,

I am glad to hear that the speakers arrived safe and sound... Sorry that you are having some problems though..

Lack of midrange is definitely not a trait of the CBM-170... Try running only the pair of CBM-170 (no center, no subwoofer) with some good quality 2-channel music (no DSP processing). Just the CBM-170s....

Let me know what you hear and we can proceed from there... Also, are the speakers on stands?

Thanks!

[Nicholas Mosher]

Yeah, the best thing about the 170s is the midrange. Something is up with 'yer setup.

[Jorge59]

Bikeman, I don't have any AVIA disk to run this test.

Curtis, the speakers are set to small,the Marantz x-over is 80 Hz. To set the subwoofer to "out", I just have to turn the x-over freq to zero, right?

Eddie, I guess they're in phase. Red with red, black with black. :)

David, I put a Maroon 5 acoustic CD, just on 2-channel and it sounded more balanced. I still didn't get stands, so all the mounting is temporary (the CBM's sitting over old 3-way speakers).

It's probably not that I don't have midranges. Maybe the highs are more pronounced and the sub is stronger, so I feel that hole. I haven't yet devoted much time to explore the Marantz settings.

Next Sunday, I'll take the CBM's and CMT to an audiophile studio where I hope to a/b the Ascends against B&Ws 600 and 700 (that were my initial reference), in his ultra high end separates and stuff.

Later on, I'll have the guy come and make the whole installation and calibration.

I'll keep you informed and I'm sure I'll still "fall in love" with these speakers. I wonder if I'll regret the Marantz...

Thanks to all.

[curtis]

Curtis, the speakers are set to small,the Marantz x-over is 80 Hz. To set the subwoofer to "out", I just have to turn the x-over freq to zero, right?

The subwoofer has a crossover "in/out" switch....set it to "out".

[Eddie]

Jorge,

can you describe your room size and layout with respect to where the speakers are and where your listening position is?

Also have you had a chance to go through the whole Marantz instruction manual and done all the setup steps?

This is truly baffling.

I will be extremely curious to hear about the results of your A/Bing the Ascends with the B&Ws, and also about the guy who'll be coming over to your house to calibrate everything for you. Please keep us up to date...

[Quinn]

To set the subwoofer to "out", I just have to turn the x-over freq to zero, right?



In addition to turning the switch to out turn the crossover all the way up not down to zero.

[bikeman]

In addition to turning the switch to out turn the crossover all the way up not down to zero.

Yes, definitely. Good catch, Quinn.

David

[BGHD]

It's gotta be a calibration problem. For me, before and after calibration (mainly just distances and trim level), was a night and day difference. At first, I felt sorta the same as you. It took me a solid week to figure out my new HK receiver. But, once I did and I popped in a good SACD, it brought a smile to my face. Gotta read that Marantz manual and get an SPL meter, dude. Made a huge difference for me. It's impossible that it's the speakers :D

[shoboat90]

In addition to turning the switch to out turn the crossover all the way up not down to zero.

The crossover frequency on my STF-2 only goes from 30 - 90Hz.......where is this zero you guys are talking about???

thanks
jim

[FibreKid]

No not zero, 90 in your case.

[davef]

David, I put a Maroon 5 acoustic CD, just on 2-channel and it sounded more balanced. I still didn't get stands, so all the mounting is temporary (the CBM's sitting over old 3-way speakers).

Hi Jorge59

I think things will start improving dramatically once the system is properly calibrated and the speakers are properly positioned. Also, placing speakers on top of other speakers is generally not a good idea. (I know you mentioned this is only temporary). The pressures created by the active speaker will influence subtle movements in the unused speakers sitting underneath and this can cause all sorts of problems..

Also, it is important to understand that you are used to listening to a completely different type of speaker system. One that is designed not for accuracy but to sound impressive for its size. Usually, these type of sub/sat systems have large boosts in the 100-400Hz range to make them sound warm and "BIG"... While this might be enjoyable to listen to, it is not accurate sound reproduction.

Spend some time listening to good quality 2-channel music with the CBM-170 and the properly calibrated subwoofer, or even no subwoofer. Listen carefully to subtleties of the music, vocalists breaths, guitar harmonics, wind instruments resonances, try to imagine the actual locations of these individual instruments within the soundstage.. Try this for a few nights and then listen to the same recordings with your previous loudspeakers....

I have searched everywhere to try and find a frequency response graph of your old loudspeakers, I think there might be a reason I was unsuccessful. If you find one, please let me know... I would be curious as to what it looked like.

We are here to help!

[Quinn]

The crossover frequency on my STF-2 only goes from 30 - 90Hz.......where is this zero you guys are talking about???

thanks
jim

I suspect the zero is actually the phase switch.

[BGHD]

In addition to turning the switch to out turn the crossover all the way up not down to zero.
I thought once you set it to 'out', it disables the crossover so it didn't matter what the xover was set to.

[curtis]

It does...but it doesn't hurt to make double sure.

[Jorge59]

Hello guys,

Today I tested the CBM-170 against B&Ws, in 2 different professional set ups, utilizing an audiophile 24K gold plated CD (Patricia Barber) and van den hul speaker cabling. No sub used.

1) High end set up: Rotel amplifier + Rotel processor + Denon 3910 player with 3 different B&W models (705, DM-600 and DM-303).

2) Hi-fi set up: Denon 1905 receiver + Panasonic player, with 2 B&W models (VM-1 and DM-600) and two levels of speaker cables ($ 8/m and $ 25/m).

As far as I my perception could feel, I found the CBMs to compete with the lower B&W 300 line. Although the CBM middles stood up strongly, the B&W seemed to be more refined, detailed and a little brighter. Surely the B&W yield more soundstage and imaging (the voice seems to get out of the speakers as if the singer was standing in the middle of the room, while in the CBM she sang from inside the speaker). The B&W aluminum tweeters give much more presence and sustain in the cymbals and the bass seemed clearer. Anyway, I prefered the guitar on the CBM. Let's consider the handicap that my CBMs aren't yet burned in.

The DM-600 is one full step above the DM-303 and Ascend (still more soundstage, definition and frequecy balance).

The 705 are in a complete different league. It would be a coward match.

In the second set up, the feeling was the same. The B&W are more refined. The VM-1 has a different imaging too, but seems to be in the same league of the CBM.

Then, for a little while, we tested the CMT in one channel. The CMT tweeter presence stood up closer to the B&Ws. Their bass strength exceeded both the VM-1 and the DM-600, but then the stronger extremes maybe overcame the middles which seemed a little laid back compared to the CBM.

So, I must clarify: I found the excellent middles of the CBM. It's a great speaker. Most likely my initial problem (at home) was that I'm using crappy speaker cables (that make everything sound laid back). Probably, the "emergency" wires I used to test my new Ascends were killing the voice and so on.

Wondering how the cables may affect the sound, we tested the $8/m cables vs the $25/m one (these are the US$ prices in Brazil, probably twice the price in the USA). I must tell everybody who read the "Top 10 Audio Lies" article and believed that the cables have no influence in the sound: it does have an important influence. Each cable prints like a "sonic signature" on the overall result. Of course, it won't be noticeable if you're using crappy equipment, if the room acoustic is bad or if the source is poor. But, if the system is good, well calibrated and the listener pay due attention to the details, he may find the cymbals souding 'sssssssssss' i/o 'chchchchchchh', the voice and details clearer and so on.

At the audiophile's studio he made (in his computer) a common copy of the Patricia Barber CD which I brought home and played in 2-channel on my LG player + Marantz 8400 + CBM + STF-2. I'm getting used to it...and the sound was quite nice (even with the crappy cables). I put the SW to "out", speakers to small etc...

Next week the guy will come to my apartment to evaluate the HT room (WxLxH=3m x 3,5m x 3m) and help me plan the new set up. He will supply the stands and cabling and calibrate the Marantz.

I'm still far from a decent system. My LG player is too simple a source, I didn't bring the HTM-200 surrounds and the room acoustics is not that good. But one day I'll get there.

I'll keep you informed on new developments.

[Quinn]

The 170s shouldn't have sounded like the voice was coming from the speaker. Did you have anything between the speakers while trying them?

[Jonnyozero3]

I was just going to say - how were the speakers set up in your comparison? Was the ratio of the distance between the speakers to the listener close to .73 as specified by the Ascend manual? How far were they from the rear and side walls? How close were obstructions to the front face of the speaker? Did you level match each set of speakers with an SPL meter prior to listening?

Also, I listened to the B&W 603's looking for speakers and I found my CBM-170s to be AT LEAST as good, if not better. But, that was not a direct comparision and it was awhile ago. I just know I didn't buy the B&W's ;)

As for cables, I think that if any cable is changing the sound it is doing something wrong. A good cable is transparent, and does not distort or alter the signal going to the speaker in any way. Frankly, based upon my reading and how well I think my plain old SoundKing 12ga w/bannanas does, I would encourage you to do some double blind testing with "expensive" cables and some "regular" but quality ones from companies like: www.bluejeanscable.com

Again regarding cables, it is my opinion that science is very important. This site has a lot of reading that tends to agree with my thinking on the subject. I'm not aggressively challenging your opinion, but I want to offer another viewpoint to you other than what you are getting from the salesman at the B&M store:
http://www.audioholics.com/techtips/audioprinciples/cables.htm

Note, I can't say I've read everything listed there, but the genreal idea I agree with.

Anyhow, keep talking with the great guys here and with DaveF (who is also a great guy ;)) and I'm sure you will find a great deal of untapped potential in your CBM-170s.

[Eddie]

Jorge,

Wow, your experience with cables is even very interesting to me than with the CBM-170s!

I have 3 questions:

1. How much lag time was there between switching the two cables? Did the salesperson just hit a button and the output switched to a different set of identical speakers using the different wiring, or did he have to go disconnect the first cable and then reconnect the second cable?

2. Did you know which cable you were listening to each time?

3. Did the salesperson "help" you by telling you what to listen for when he switched to the higher end cable, or by telling you what HE heard was different about it?

[Kpt_Krunch]

Nice to read a different opinion on the speakers - at least the 170's.

I'm currently listening to some Acoustic guitar on my 340s' (with the 170's providing some ambient sound - a DVD-A in 'audience' mode as opposed to surround mode) and all I can say is WOW. I don't get a chance to sit down and just listen during summer and with my son (now 3 years old) taking up virtually all my spare time.

I guess not everyone's experience is the same. I'm sure you'll find once your system at home is calibrated properly the 170's will sound great for you. I'm sure they are a much better value than those B&W's as well. But, B&W makes a fine speaker, and can put a lot of other speaker manufacturers to shame.

[bikeman]

Some folks with normal hearing and very good audio systems hear a difference with expensive wire and some don't. If there was a difference with the wire, we'd all hear it. We don't. There are reasonable explanations for this and the one's I subscribe to have nothing to do with the wire.
Looking at the dimensions of Jorge's room (3m (10ft) x 3.5m x3m), is there a possibily that he's dealing with a null in the midrange?

David

[shoboat90]

Well, I finally got my front and center 340s set-up and connected. Powering them with a 200w x 5 Anthem and wowza!!!! These are in a very large room (17w x 30L x 15H) and the Ascends can take everything that amp has to offer to fill the room with magnificent sound!! I'm using the Hsu STF-2 as well. Pink Floyd Momentary Lapse of Reason in 2-channel is unreal....and U2 Live from Slane Castle DVD in DTS is insane. When Bono's voice comes from that center channel....you'd think he's in the room.

Yahoooooooo!!!

[bikeman]

Yahoooooooo!!!

:D

Welcome to all the enjoyment, Sho. That's a heckofa set-up you've got there.

David

[Kurt C.]

(order of quoted material deliberately changed)
Next week the guy will come to my apartment to evaluate the HT room (WxLxH=3m x 3,5m x 3m) and help me plan the new set up. He will supply the stands and cabling and calibrate the Marantz.

Wondering how the cables may affect the sound, we tested the $8/m cables vs the $25/m one (these are the US$ prices in Brazil, probably twice the price in the USA). I must tell everybody who read the "Top 10 Audio Lies" article and believed that the cables have no influence in the sound: it does have an important influence. Each cable prints like a "sonic signature" on the overall result. Of course, it won't be noticeable if you're using crappy equipment, if the room acoustic is bad or if the source is poor.

If your information is coming from this "expert", I'd recommend you find a new person to plan your setup. This audiophile may seem like a wonderful person, but he's either dishonest or foolish. If you were doing listening tests with someone who is both honest and a genuine expert in audio setup, I promise that you wouldn't 'hear' differences between good quality $8/m cables and $25/m cables.

You'll get much better sound if you find someone else to optimize your room/system, or better yet, do more reading here and at sites like audioholics.com to learn how to do it yourself.

[Jorge59]

Eddie,

1. We did both. Sometimes a/b click, sometimes immediate changing banana plug.

2. I personally found the difference subtle, but they seem different to me. I can't tell in terms of cost-benefit, but I think good sound is a sum of many things and details. Ears get educated as well.

3. Yes, he pointed out highs and imaging.

I didn't want to believe that cables could make big difference (except for bad materials), but if this was all bullshit, why industries producing so many types and qualities still exist? There must be a reason...

David,

I don't think there is a freq graph for my Polks. Thank you, but it's not worth spending time on this. They are entry mid-fi speakers. I must get my ears used to the the new system. Now, I'm more concerned in getting HTM surrounds.

Quinn asked if there was something between the CBMs in the test. In the high end set, YES. The B&W were in between, with the CBM right on their outer side. Could this be a salesman trick?

[Kurt C.]

I didn't want to believe that cables could make big difference (except for bad materials), but if this was all bullshit, why industries producing so many types and qualities still exist? There must be a reason...
There is a reason...cables don't cost much to make, especially compared to other audio components and, given the right salesman, can be sold for $$$.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for quality cables and use Blue Jean's component video cable in my system, but it makes me mad that snake oil salesmen make a fortune while honest audio experts are barely staying in business.

[Quinn]

Yes, putting something between speakers can and will mess with imaging. When doing A/B testing like that the speakers should not be A B...............B A but A B............A B so both are handicapped equally on imaging. Better yet try each without anything between.

[Jonnyozero3]

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for quality cables and use Blue Jean's component video cable in my system, but it makes me mad that snake oil salesmen make a fortune while honest audio experts are barely staying in business.

Amen.

[Jorge59]

I've been away for a while, but in fact I don't have much to add. Still did not install the definitive set up. I have been taking this time to follow David's suggestion to hear the CBMs in 2 channel, get used to its detailed sound and quality. Actually, now I can hear backing vocals and separation of instruments that I didn't before. This is good. However, the sound, though clean and correct still does not thrill me, but I'm starting to like it. I A/Bed the right channel between the 170 and the 340, just for curiosity. It looks like I prefer the tweeter of the 340. The 340 has some kind of "soul" that I don't feel in the 170. With x-over at 80 Hz, I set the speakers to OFF, to find that the sub wouldn't do maybe 5% of the job. There is almost no music down those frequencies. On the other hand, if I turn the sub volume up, the window glass start to vibrate only with the few notes played through the sub.

I'm also considering to put the new Marantz/Ascends set up in the wider living room (L shaped, 28 m2 - i/o the small 3 x 3,5m HT room.

Maybe this weekend I'll try the Ascends with the old Yamaha receiver, to do more testing. Also, will look for the stands and speaker wires.

When I have more news I'll let you know.

[Jorge59]

I've been away for a while, but in fact I don't have much to add. Still did not install the definitive set up. I have been taking this time to follow David's suggestion to hear the CBMs in 2 channel (2.1), get used to its detailed sound and quality. Actually, now I can hear backing vocals and separation of instruments that I didn't before. This is good. However, the sound, though clean and correct, still does not thrill me, but I'm starting to like it. I A/Bed the right channel between the 170 and the 340, just for curiosity. It looks like I prefer the tweeter of the 340. The 340 has some kind of "soul" that I don't feel in the 170. With x-over at 80 Hz, I set the speakers to OFF, to find that the sub wouldn't do maybe 5% of the job. There is almost no music down those frequencies. On the other hand, if I turn the sub volume up, the window glass start to vibrate only with the few notes played through the sub.

I'm also considering to put the new Marantz/Ascends set up in the wider living room (L shaped, 28 m2 - i/o the small 3 x 3,5m HT room.

Maybe this weekend I'll try the Ascends with the old Yamaha receiver, to do more testing. Also, will look for the stands and speaker wires.

When I have more news I'll let you know.

[Jorge59]

Hi guys

I found something: http://forum.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/1/159853.html

I think it's the receiver... Can any one help?

BTW, I'm loving the CMT-340. I wish I could've brought a pair. Sometimes I put it on the right channel just to hear how great any guitar sounds...

Also found that the small room has better acoustics for the HT. Maybe that's why I had the initial impression that the old speakers were closer to the Ascends...

[Eddie]

jorge,

hmm, weird. I certainly hope you didn't get a defective Marantz, that would be a real pain with you being outside of the US. Here's 3 things you can try:

1. what do you have the Hsu's crossover switch set at? If you are doing HT and using the LFE connection then make sure it's set to "OUT" (step 5 on page 5 of Hsu manual).

2. Also, on the Marantz what is the subwoofer level set at? Did you calibrate the subwoofer using the receiver's test tones or using a setup DVD like Avia or Digital Video Essentials (step 6 on page 5)?

3. you can also experiment by using the Hsu's high level outputs, (page 4 under Method B) with the Hsu's crossover set to "IN"---then play some 2-channel music that has lots of bass to see if it improves.

[Jorge59]

Eddie

I'm using the SW set to out. I cranked up the sw level at the Marantz, 3db above the front speakers. It sounds a little better (with either speaker sets), but I'm not fully satisfied with the sound yet.

I put the Marantz on the 5.1 Polk system (HT small room) and the Yammie on the 2.1 with the CBMs/Hsu (living room). I'm still confused on which receiver sound I prefer. It's natural that each amp behaves differently, so the calibration is important.

I'll keep fine tuning the set up. Maybe it's normal and just had never heard to the sub alone to find that it is not so important in music and only plays 10% of the lows.

I have ordered the stands for the CBMs and I will now buy the AWG 14 wires (decided for normal speaker cables US$2/m). Then I'll concentrate on reforming the bookcase where the system stays to insert the 340c and make the definitive connections between Marantz/Ascends.

[Eddie]

Jorge,

you might want to try maybe +6db on the subwoofer output, I had to do that when I was using my Marantz 5400.

Another trick that I found really helped me a lot was turning the Hsu so that the rear port hit the wall at an angle that bounced back towards my listening position. This unfortunately does mean turning the sub around so that its backside is visible with all the controls and connections, but in my room it made a significant improvement.

As for music, yeah the sub's importance really depends on 3 things:

1. how much bass you like to hear
2. how much bass you are getting from your gear (speakers, receiver, CD player) and room accoustics
3. how much bass there is in the music you're listening to

When I upgraded my CD player from a Sony ES to a Marantz 4300 the increase in bass was so dramatic that I started to use my sub less and less.

btw, congrats on not falling for the fancy cables trap!

You might also want to look at one of these, just for the heck of it:

http://forum.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/1/160136.html

[Jorge59]

I'm getting crazy. :mad: I found on the AVS forum that there are other Marantz 8400 victims on the LFE issue.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6188597#post6188597

I thought my new Ascends/Hsu deserved more than the old Yammie, but the 8400 is not up to the task...

[Quinn]

Call the Marantz rep. I had issues with figuring out my 7200 and they were great help.

[Eddie]

Holy sh1t! Man, I can't tell you how bad I feel for you Jorge. That is really horrible...when is your next visit to the States? You might have to go through the long and slow warranty repair process if you have a good friend in the US who'll take care of the shipping and receiving for you.

In the meantime, you might want to try this:

Run speaker wires from your Marantz's L/R speaker terminals to the Hsu's "high level inputs" and then run speaker wire from the Hsu to your L/R speakers.

That way you will at least get full bass out of your sub during 2-channel music. You will not get the same bass out of a Dolby Digital 5.1 dvd though, sorry.

And if you want a cheap replacement for your Marantz that might sound even better, check out this thread:

http://forum.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/1/160136.html

[Quinn]

Wow! Is there anything on that thread actually related to the Panny besides your OP?

[Eddie]

> Wow! Is there anything on that thread actually related to the Panny besides your OP?

Gotta sift through all the digressions, Chris...surely you know that by now about ecoustics.

Maybe 20% subject matter, 80% random tangents and verbal abuse, LOL.

[Lou-the-dog]

Yeah I've visited that forum a couple of times and noticed that there does seem to be a handful of members that really go at each others throats. Entertaining...for awhile. Anyhow, good info in your posts over there Eddie.

Randy

[Jonnyozero3]

Wow, that one rivals some AVS threads I've seen :eek:

[Jorge59]

I was owing you guys some conclusive information on my new system. After a few months getting used to it and breaking it in, I can tell I'm loving it. thats for everybody who helped and encouraged me to configure the settings.

I found that the "Sub out" of the Marantz is OK and each day I love more the STF-2. What a great sub! It sounds soft (but not boomy) and precise for music; thundering and realistic for movies. The bass is very natural and blends seamlessly to the CBM-170.

I got used to the 170 and even like the tweeter well now. It's great to hear the Marantz in stereo 2.1. Even my FM (with simple indoor anthena) sounds great.

The 340center is another wonder. I sometimes only regret not to have it all across the front. Or dream about 340SE mains... No need to say how good it performs on movies.

I wish I could've brought a pair of HTM-200 for surrounds, but I already had excess luggage. I'll try that asap.

With this system I increased the use of the HT for movies. But my pleasure with DVD concerts and music CDs decreased.

Then I tested a dedicated CD player (an old Pioneer 603) and it sounded very good. The definition was better, bass tighter and stronger, sound not tiring. So, I confirmed my suspicions that my DVD player is really crappy junk s*@t. and understood why I was prefering analog FM to digital CD/DVD.

Now, I need to add a good universal player or a good CD player and a honest DVDP. I'm looking for suggestions.

As to the comparison between the SR 8400 and my old Yamaha RX-V520, of course, they are in different leagues. The Yammi just sounds more "open" and brilliant while the 8400 is warmer and more refined.

Regards

[Eddie]

Jorge,

happy to hear that you're enjoying your system more and more every day.

I'm curious, what is your current CD or DVD player?

Are you going to be in the US again anytime soon? I had great luck with a Marantz 4300 cd player and it was a steal, I bought it here:

http://www.accessories4less.com/cgi-bin/item/MARCC4300

Made a huge improvement over my old Sony ES player.

[Lou-the-dog]

Mmm! That Marantz looks tempting. I have a XCD-88 which is a fine player but a carousel is very tempting. The older and lazy'er I get the less I like getting up to put in new CD's.

Randy

[Eddie]

Mmm! That Marantz looks tempting. I have a XCD-88 which is a fine player but a carousel is very tempting. The older and lazy'er I get the less I like getting up to put in new CD's.

Randy

too bad you live in Iowa, or I'd trade you...I love the Marantz's SQ but find changing between 5 disks, remembering which one is what #, is a pain in the butt. I would've bought the cc5400 but was told that it's plagued by QC issues and has equal or worse SQ.

[Jorge59]

I have a LG DZ 9311N player.

My 1st was another LG, that failed with 2 years use. Then, I bought a Sony but though the sound was OK, the image was dark, so I chnaged by this LG, which is probably the worst.

I saw great offers of refurbished Marantz on acessories4less. Maybe I'll have a friend going to US soon. But I intended to ask for the HTM-200 too.

[Jorge59]

Hi guys,

Today, I got my pair of HTM-200 surrounds, through a friend who traveled to US. I'm very impressed with them. I tested them in 2-channels with my old Yammie (playing CD) and they sounded great. Maybe the neutral sound of Ascends shows out a little better through Yamaha (bright, open) than Marantz (too warm, almost laid back). Of course, the Yammie is not as refined and musical as the Marantz but, anyway, the Ascends sound very nice through both.

Apart from the receivers issue, I found the HTM-200 very much dynamic (more than the CBM-170, though the 170's sound is heavier...) and with amazing imaging (very good dispersion). The tweeter appears more present (maybe because the speaker works in the upper frequencies), but I was also very impressed with the bass (very tight and clean, though missing the very bottom of course...). The middles are perfect. A very impressive small speaker that would make no shame in an all across/around HT set up.

I must also thank Dave for all the support with my order and congrat him on this amazing speaker. Now I'm a happy owner of 340c, 170 fronts and 200 surrounds.

Next plan is a pair of 340SE for stereo in the other room....

[Eddie]

Good to hear that. I also was very impressed by the HTM-200s when a friend of mine loaned me some for a week. Am hoping to find them really cheap on audiogon because I'd just use them as surrounds and I feel silly spending $200-300 for surrounds given my usage habits.

Next time your friend makes another trip to the US, ask him to bring you the Marantz 4300 cd player from accessories4less.com --- I think you'll also be very pleased with the results.

[Jorge59]

Yes, Eddie,

I want the Marantz 4300 CDP, but I was afraid as I read some people complained about problems with these refurb units (from here, I couldn't return a faulty one...). When the opportunity comes, I'll probably pick one. At the moment, I've seen accessories4less has run out of it.

I also need to upgrade my DVDP. I'm thinking of a Poineer 588, which can be found at a reasonable price for this banana republic standards.

As to the surrounds, I needed a new pair, cause I sold my entire Polk 5.1 set. Since I got some $500 on them (plus stands), I thought it was a good idea to spend about half of that on the HTM-200, to complete the system.

But I agree that, for HT usage, surrounds can be "anything" and I was tempted to keep the new Ascends for stereo on the second system (they sounded great with the Yammie on the living room). Would need a STF-1 though...

[Eddie]

Well since you're going to be replacing your DVDP, a safe bet for both music quality and video performance might be the Denon 2910 universal player but it's a bit pricey (around $600 I think). For that price you could buy the Pio 588 and TWO of the Marantz in case one of them is defective! :)

For the DVD player you might want to Google up reviews of the Oppo which I have read many good things about on these forums:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00078GLJY/sr=1-1/qid=1138371637/ref=pd_bbs_1/103-3152032-3370267?%5Fencoding=UTF8

Can you get your US-based friend to order the Marantz and test it out for you in NJ?

Also, browse Audiogon.com for used Ascend 170s and 200s, I think there are some very nice deals right now probably from people who are upgrading to the SE models.

[Jorge59]

Eddie,

Actually, I could get that kind of help from my NJ based friend. However, I don't know when we'll have another chance to get together.

These new speakers were brought from a brazillian relative who went to Las Vegas, Frisco and NYC, on holidays in the new year. He spent one whole week in NYC, in an apartment, so I had an address to order Ascends.

I was also interested in the Denon 2910, but I'm afraid it might not work in Brasil (region 4) and it's too expensive to stay without warranty here. Even the Denon 1920 should be nice to me.

Then, I thought the Pio 588 (region free) could be an honest option, in a cost-benefit pov. I don't care that much about image (what if Indiana Jones or 007 faces are a little more pale or shiny...?). To me, sound is more important.

Thanks for the link. I never took the trouble to read and understand about these HDMI, DVIx, upconvert etc kinda complication. I just plug the component video from the DVDP to the tube TV. It's not the moment to buy new TVs, because they're about to define Digital TV standards for Brazil. A plasma here is too expensive (US$4.000 for 42" HDTV "ready"). When I upgrade de TV, I'd probably go to a projector, in the middle term.

That "snake oil cables" guy has offered me a Rotel RDV 1040 (which impressed me well on both sound and image) by $ 700 with full warranty (it lists for $500 in US). This is a reasonable price for Brazil market standards (after tax etc), but I feel maybe silly paying that much on a DVDP....

There's also another american acquaintance, who lives here and regularly goes to US. He's not a close friend, but might be so kind as to take the disturbance to bring me something (Marantz CDP or a DVD...).

With patience, I'll keep setting my systems up. As soon as a new opportuniy comes, I'll do something...

BTW, if you like to spend wonderful tropical holidays and come to Rio de Janeiro, we may negotiate something...

Take care.