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Hey guys.. so sorry for being somewhat out of touch lately. We have been swamped and are finally getting caught up.
Just wanted to let you know that I am keeping a close eye on this thread Your thoughts and ideas are very welcome on this subject....
Let's say the price point for the mythical Ascend Towers is $2000. Wouldn't we get more value for our money if Dave designed $2000 bookshelf speakers?
I realize that some folks just want towers, and you give your customers what they want. So, towers might be a great business move, and no one would be disappointed with some great Ascend towers.
I'm just thinking that if Dave was strictly looking at making the best speakers possible at various price points, bookshelf speakers are the best up to a higher price point, right? Or is that a false assumption?
If it is a good assumption, at what point do you think bookshelf speakers cannot compete with towers?
Tower or bookshelf, I don't care either way I guess. If we can get better sound for less money from a bookshelf then that's fine by me. What I do want is something that takes every aspect of the Sierra 1 up another notch (or two). Why, because it's sooo fun to upgrade!
I second the idea for giving the Sierra-1 the 340 SE treatment! But I say keep the bamboo. From an architectural specification standpoint I can tell you that the material is way better than MDF. If not bamboo maybe Corian? But I'm sure Dave has checked out that option (too expensive & not as good?). The bamboo floors and wall panels on our past jobs have worked out really well.
I would think a logical progression for a first Sierra-1 tower would be adding a second woofer (likely an MTM). The towers should be about the same dimensions of the Sierra-1s, for simplicity sake. They should also be no taller than about 40" or so, to save material and shipping costs. I realize, with an MTM, this might be pacing the tweeter up to 1/2 a foot below sitting ear level for most, but as I recall, the tweeters in the Sierras are more immune to moderate off vertical axis response issues (something to do with the waveguide and OPPIX as I recall). The actual box would have to be a bamboo laminate enclosure to match the Sierra-1s. To save some costs, perhaps the first 6 to 12 inches or so could be made out of fill-able MDF (or whatever) - basically stands - and could have a matching finish. Maybe this way something could be cooked up for less than $1500?
I suppose this is basically no different than a 340SE version of the Sierras as discussed above - with the only real benefit being more power handling and possibly slightly improved dynamics - that is if Dave can work the same magic with the crossover that hid did with the 2-way originals. I just don't see how anything significantly larger or more elaborate could be very viable given Ascend's current business model.
Edit: I suppose a 3-way design might work, with a 5.25 mid and two woofers (probably keep the same woofers?). This would allow the tweeter to be placed at the top of the speaker. But then you would need to source a new midrange driver, and start from scratch on the crossover, correct? You would have a vastly different speaker than the Sierra-1 - not that I know much about speaker design.
Last edited by cynan; 01-28-2010 at 03:41 PM.
One of the biggest features of the Sierra is the OPPIX crossover, which enables the speaker to mimic a coaxial driver with symmetrical vertical and horizontal dispersion.
One of the features of an MTM design is to limit vertical dispersion, so I wonder how this will come into play with OPPIX. Maybe a TMM arrangement would be more appropriate for a Sierra tower.
-curtis
I still don't understand what a floorstander is supposed to do that a satellite sub combo doesn't. Heard good things about the Def Tech Mythos STS but they look remarkably like a bookshelf sitting on top of a subwoofer in a common Aluminum enclosure and for the $3800 they list (if I had that kind of money to spend on more electronics) I'd have bought a couple of Rythmiks and the Sierra-1s or a MMT Sierra-2 if available. I could see how if my room was smaller I would worry about floorspace and might then see a floorstander like the Mythos as a cool thing, but if it didn't go all the way (to 20Hz or below) I wouldn't waste the extra money.
Well, for one, it could stand on its own without a pair of stands. Second, it would be a fit for all those people looking for floorstanders. Third, if the ~40hz of the Sierra isn't enough for some, and they wanted to get lower bass without getting a sub, it would, again, probably qualify... It could probably play louder on its own than the Sierras, given that it will most probably have more than 1 driver and 1 tweeter per speaker...
Personally, I'd be pretty lukewarm to Sierra towers. Realistically, I wouldn't really envision huge towers coming out from Ascend... I really also wouldn't envision very small towers... So that would leave medium sized towers...
Now, you have a medium sized tower, what's the driver arrangement? Making it a two way makes little sens to me, maybe slightly more extension, not really worth it since the Sierras go to ~40hz anyhow... And with subs, is there really a point? Making it a 3 way? Never was a 3 way from Ascend... Dedicated mid, bass woofer, does the drivers stay the same as the Sierra-1? Probably not, the Sierra woofer was optimized for a two way monitor, in a 3 way, it wouldn't make sens just to stick that driver in... So let's say there's a new mid, there's also a new bass woofer, probably, and since there's now a new mid, maybe there's a better tweeter around to mate with that new mid. So we have a Sierra floorstander which just has, maybe, the bamboo cabinet... Might as well give it a new name!
Or MTM, as cschang mentioned, would have to redo the crossover, lose the OPPIX? What's gained vs the Sierra1? SPL, ok... Do you lose some midrange quality? What about imaging? How much more does it cost than a pair of Sierra 1s?
Anyhow, can't say I'd be against a floorstander from Ascend, I'd be very, hell, not very, extremely curious to see what Dave would come up with... But I'd probably pass the upgrade...
I think monitors is where it's at for bang for the buck. Put the Sierras next to any 1000$ floorstander, what do the Sierras lack? Anything? How much more for Sierras floorstanders? Is it really better than Sierras + sub as Tushar mentioned? Certainly I'd see some advantages to a floorstander, but how much would it cost? For me, probably more than I'd want to spend...
Just for a quick comparison, Sierra-1 is <1000$. How much would a Sierra floorstander equivalent of say a Paradigm S8 cost? (cabinet 5 times the size and 10 drivers total instead of 2...). What about a 3 way with new drivers and against much larger cabinet?
Dave do we get some clues or anything? Price range? Driver configuration, etc.? That would help a lot What would be the improvements in a Sierra floorstander over the Sierra1?
Last edited by GirgleMirt; 01-29-2010 at 03:20 PM.