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Thread: Svs Pb10-isd

  1. #21
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    Yeah I'm having troubles with localized bass as well. Now during pipe organ passages I can hear the PB10 struggling next to my couch, but the infrasonics presence is much better. Ron eMailed me today (on Easter, hows that for customer service!) and suggested I try a parametric EQ like the BFD before I make any decisions about returning/exchanging it.

  2. #22
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    A parametric EQ will help without a doubt, but imagine what it could do with a sub that sounded better to you in the first place.
    -curtis

  3. #23
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    I'm going to try a BFD parametric EQ. I'll use it to knock down that 60Hz peak, boost the 40Hz area a bit, and maybe play with cutting the 20Hz area some (although probably not because it will kill the infrasonics). This also will decrease the SPL of the Avia sub pink noise which will see me boosting the gain on the sub (which is already at 75%). I think I'm fast apoproaching the limits of the PB10-ISD.

    I'm not sure that the HSU VTF-3 MKII would work for me anymore either (although that is just an assumption). I think I need something along the lines of the HSU tube subs (which apparently are no longer on their webpage) or a SVS 16-46 PC-Plus tuned to 12Hz. I really crave those infrasonics that add so much realism and depth. I can tell the PB10 is struggling below 20Hz, and I want something that does the deed with less effort. A larger driver with a bigger enclosure tuned lower with almost twice the power might do the trick (at twice the price ).

  4. #24
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    When choosing a sub tuned very low, keep in mind that you are giving up substantial output to get those infrasonics. A sub tuned to 20Hz will give you strong output down to about 16Hz when you factor in room gain, so something like the upcoming PB12/Plus, PB12/Ultra, or VTF-3 HO might do the trick better with their multiple tuning options. Also, I believe you are reaching the limits of the PB10. The BFD will show those limits quickly, so be careful. What I mean is, you hear people talking about how boosting frequencies is a bad idea, but if you instead cut all the peaks until you have a flat response then turn up the gain on the sub, you've done the same thing as if you had left the peaks alone and boosted the nulls with respect to amplifier head room. If you already have the gain turned up to 75% on the SVS, then you are going to need a bigger sub. That's not just my opinion, as I've seen this effect with my own two eyes when EQ'ing my HSU, and have read Wayne Pflughaupt's posts on this. He's much more knowledgeable than I am when it comes to this stuff, but when you think about it, it makes sense. Whether you're boosting a null or cutting peaks and cranking up the volume to compensate, you're going to burn more head room the louder you go. You need a bigger sub.
    Last edited by Eddie Horton; 03-27-2005 at 10:22 AM.
    - EVH III

  5. #25
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    FWIW, a VTF-3MKII is flat to 18Hz anechoicly in max extension tune.

    The Hsu TN1220 is the best sub I have heard.....clean, well defined, and gets loowww. Dr. Hsu's philosophy is it has to sound good before playing low and loud. If either one compromises sound quality, it isn't worth it IMO.

    Can you explain the craving for infrasonics? Down that low, there really is not a whole lot of information, and DVDs that do have them I really do not think benefit from extra definition. What are you listening to that is below 20Hz and what percentage of your listening has information that low.

    If you want it all, and want to stick to SVS, I would look at the Ultra line.
    -curtis

  6. #26
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    "You need a bigger sub."

    I think you're going to find this true with everything you've written, Nicholas. Everything Eddie wrote has been my experience with EQ.
    I'm really enjoying you posting all your impressions. Keep it up. You may save me some time and expense when I decide to upgrade.

    David

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeman
    You may save me some time and expense when I decide to upgrade.
    I'm actually hoping you or Eddie will be in Los Angeles sometime soon to help me with a BFD for the same reasons.

    I will probably break down and do it sometime this month in any case.
    -curtis

  8. #28
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    If you want it all, and want to stick to SVS, I would look at the Ultra line.
    A few months ago, when I was considering a more ambitious system than what I ultimately decided on, I came to the conclusion that if I wanted a real quantum leap in performance beyond the PB10 in an SVS powered sub, I'd have to go all the way up to the Ultra series - specifically the PC-Ultra (although a box-style PB12-Ultra is now also available for pre-order). These units, with their unique TV-12 driver, are pretty much universally acclaimed, even by SVS-haters.

    This is a quote from some correspondence I had with Ron at the time, regarding the PC-Ultra:

    Gary,

    I’m painting my new SVS demo room out here in Colorado and listening to one right now.

    If you can afford it, I promise you will never regret reaching for one. I’m not sure if there is a perfect subwoofer, but if there is, I’d argue this one should be on the list. Little floor space use, easy to move, nice looking, fantastic power reserves, and just utterly seamless and accurate on everything I’ve ever thrown at it. They are very very good.

    I can have any SVS I want (as long as I snivel effectively ;^) and honestly I could be happy with one of these in all but the largest rooms you would ever put a single sub.

    Ron
    I'm very happy with my current system but am certainly enjoying reading about your experiences, Nicholas. I'm keeping an eye on this thread with great interest!

  9. #29
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    I'm actually hoping you or Eddie will be in Los Angeles sometime soon to help me with a BFD for the same reasons.

    I can't wait to hear your reaction once you get it dialed in. That might put me over the edge to get the VTF-3.

    David

    P.S. Last time I was in L.A. was in 1970. We made a run from Tucson to S.F. and back. They tell me it was a hell of a ride.

    David

  10. #30
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    Curtis, it's actually not that bad once you get going. It's doing all the research, printing out Sonnie Parker's guide, and doing the initial setup and charting that's time consuming. After you get rolling and get an understanding of how it works, it really does go fast. As a brief hijack and follow up, I will say that I'm still getting used to how it sounds for movies. I'd never watched a movie on a properly calibrated sub before, so I have years of bad sound etched in my brain that tells me what "normal" should sound like. For music, it hit me immediately that EQ'd was so much better that I wondered how I ever lived without it. For the life of me, I don't know why one sounded right from the get-go and one sounded not quite right at first. I guess it's because I was always a "music in the car" guy. Since getting married and settling down, I've only recently started listening to music at home. Nicholas, let us know how all this turns out. I'm really enjoying your reviews.
    Last edited by Eddie Horton; 03-27-2005 at 12:37 PM.
    - EVH III

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