CMT-340SE2 for two-channel music without a subwoofer

[DynamicRanger]

Has anyone used CMT-340SE2s for two-channel music without a subwoofer?

I'm currently using 3x HTM-200SEs and a SVS PB1000 sub in a 3.1 setup. My living arrangement has changed and I'd prefer to ditch the subwoofer entirely, if possible.

My audio use is 75% music, 25% movies and TV. If I have to make any compromises, I want it to be on the home theater side, not the music side. I don't particularly care for the floor-shaking, chest-thumping aspect of low bass in movies, but I don't want to lose clarity and power in bass for music.

I tried disabling the sub and as expected, the HTM-200SEs simply can't produce enough bass for music. As an admittedly flawed experiment, I applied a high pass filter at 45Hz to some of my favorite tracks, to coincide with the rated bottom of the CMTs' frequency range. In this experiment, the HTMs combined with the sub were producing an approximation of the frequency range available to the CMTs alone. I switched between the filtered and unfiltered tracks during playback.

With the filter in place, music sounded right to me. In some cases the difference wasn't audible and in others the sound actually improved because the sub wasn't wubbling around.

Can I expect a similar outcome (losing the rumble and little else) if I replace the HTMs and the sub with a pair of CMTs?

I'm sharing a wall with neighbors now, so bass shaking through is a concern. My living room is smaller and subwoofer placement is limited. I'm renting so no wall treatment is possible.

At the moment, I am only considering the CMTs. The cost of a pair with stands is as much as I'm willing to pay for speakers and the bang-for-buck of the CMTs means I'd rather make do with what I have than look elsewhere. I'm open to suggestions, they just might not be feasible unless they are similar cost.

If I do get the CMTs, I will keep the subwoofer and L and R HTMs in storage until I'm able to set up a proper 5.1 system with the HTMs as rear surrounds. In the meantime, I would have a 3.0 system: CMTs for L and R, HTM for C and no subwoofer.

Thanks in advance for your insight.

[racrawford65]

I've not heard the CMTs so not sure how they'd work w/o a sub - looking at the measurements, they do seem to be down quite a bit at 45 hz (like 25 db down vs 100 hz). My guess is they still might sound thin, depending on what type(s) of music you listen to.

The new Sierra 1 v2 look to be very close in price (especially on sale) to the CMT+stands. You could probably also use the same stands with the S1v2 or find something locally (and thus not have to pay shipping).

In the end, suggest you give Dave & Dina a call and discuss.

[MusicHead]

I have the "regular" 340SE, not the "2". Not heard the latter, but according to Dave it is a marked improvement. However, I believe the bass extension is very similar. As Dave stated in another thread, the high sensitivity of the 340 comes at the expenses of bass extension and he primarily designed it to be used with a subwoofer.

I did try my 340s without the sub and they do sound too thin for my tastes, even with music. I have a compact Rythmik L12 sub and it blends perfectly with the 340s L/R mains. I am a firm believer in the usefulness of a (good) sub for music listening. It is all about extending the lower octaves, not rattling the walls.

If you can stretch your budget another $150, I believe the Sierra 1 V2 is a great option for a no-sub music-centered system. The LX is probably the very best for a full-range bookshelf, but much more expensive than the Sierra 1 V2.

[DynamicRanger]

Thanks for your suggestions. Since I have an acceptable system now, I'll save up a bit and consider the Sierras when I have the budget for it.

[racrawford65]

makes sense. as they say, buy once, cry once.

[davef]

Has anyone used CMT-340SE2s for two-channel music without a subwoofer?

I'm currently using 3x HTM-200SEs and a SVS PB1000 sub in a 3.1 setup. My living arrangement has changed and I'd prefer to ditch the subwoofer entirely, if possible.

My audio use is 75% music, 25% movies and TV. If I have to make any compromises, I want it to be on the home theater side, not the music side. I don't particularly care for the floor-shaking, chest-thumping aspect of low bass in movies, but I don't want to lose clarity and power in bass for music.

I tried disabling the sub and as expected, the HTM-200SEs simply can't produce enough bass for music. As an admittedly flawed experiment, I applied a high pass filter at 45Hz to some of my favorite tracks, to coincide with the rated bottom of the CMTs' frequency range. In this experiment, the HTMs combined with the sub were producing an approximation of the frequency range available to the CMTs alone. I switched between the filtered and unfiltered tracks during playback.

With the filter in place, music sounded right to me. In some cases the difference wasn't audible and in others the sound actually improved because the sub wasn't wubbling around.

Can I expect a similar outcome (losing the rumble and little else) if I replace the HTMs and the sub with a pair of CMTs?

I'm sharing a wall with neighbors now, so bass shaking through is a concern. My living room is smaller and subwoofer placement is limited. I'm renting so no wall treatment is possible.

At the moment, I am only considering the CMTs. The cost of a pair with stands is as much as I'm willing to pay for speakers and the bang-for-buck of the CMTs means I'd rather make do with what I have than look elsewhere. I'm open to suggestions, they just might not be feasible unless they are similar cost.

If I do get the CMTs, I will keep the subwoofer and L and R HTMs in storage until I'm able to set up a proper 5.1 system with the HTMs as rear surrounds. In the meantime, I would have a 3.0 system: CMTs for L and R, HTM for C and no subwoofer.

Thanks in advance for your insight.

We do have many 340SE2 customers using them without subwoofers. I definitely recommend the use of a sub for home theater, but for music you can get away without one. It isn't so much the lack of deep bass extension, but more so that the EIR (estimated in-room response) follows that much lauded downward slope, which it does for the 340SE2. This assures the speakers do sound warm and full (proper tonal balance) even without a subwoofer.

That stated, the Sierra-1V2 is the better choice for a 75% music system.

Hope this helps!

[MDinno]

I have the 340SE2 center and plan on getting the mains. Although I'm for movies I have listened to music on them. No issues with bass whatsoever and I run them LARGE with Double Bass. Movies are much more demanding than music and I've pushed this speaker even with music full range. You wouldn't be disappointed. Kick drum everything is there.

[racrawford65]

I'm not so sure I'd generalize movies are much more demanding than music as it depends on the movie and music genres. Many movies (streaming, discs) are also "neutered" in the bass/low frequencies intentionally by the studios to protect the "soundbar" crowd. That said, there are work-arounds for that (e.g. ezBEQ - see AVS).

[DynamicRanger]

Thanks to everyone for your insights. David seems confident that the CMTs are not a bad place to start. If they don't produce enough bass for me, I still have the subwoofer, even if I'll be in the same situation of bass that is boomy and inconsistent due to placement limitations. I won't be getting rid of anything I have currently. I don't foresee any problems integrating the CMTs and HTMs into a more ambitious surround system down the line. And of course, the reality is that i'm probably just planning a plateau before eventually continuing up the upgrade mountain.

If it makes much of a difference, I listen mostly to jazz (35% acoustic/65% electric) and rock (prog, slower metal, post-punk) from digital sources. My listening is more focused on instrumentals, although using the HTMs for a few months has given me a new appreciation for vocals.

[curtis]

If they don't produce enough bass for me, I still have the subwoofer, even if I'll be in the same situation of bass that is boomy and inconsistent due to placement limitations.

I meant to ask earlier on the reason for wanting to get rid of the sub. Boomy and inconsistancy are the reasons?
Do you currently use an AVR? It seems like it from what I have read above. Does it have room correction of any sort?
I do not have any experience with the PB1000 sub, but I do have a friend that got one and was not happy with it.