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  1. #1
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    Jun 2018
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    Default Sierra 2EX upgrade kit questions

    Dave,

    This kit sounds peaks my interest, but thinking ahead the possibility also raises a few concerns.

    1. How important is the fact that: 'Left / right pairs are matched by hand to within ± 1dB'? Obviously installing the upgrade kit in the Sierra 2 will eliminate the matched pair speakers.

    2. I have been amazed by the detail and wide dispersion of the Sierra 2 that results in a soundstage that is both higher and wider than anything I've experienced previously. My only minor grip is that, at times, the Sierra 2 can sound a little thin in the lower midrange. Your description of the EX sounds like it might address this which is great, but I hope not at the expense of what I enjoy about the original Sierra 2.

    3. After the upgrade I will have a pair of great Seas woofers and cross-overs just wasting away. Knowing me, I will either build a box or buy a knock-down flat pack kit of similar dimensions and configuration to the Sierra 2 and build another set of speakers. The only problem is I will need tweeters. Can you provide the specifications of the original cross-over to assist in finding an appropriate tweeter. Any recommendations other than your Raal, which is too expensive for my level of speaker building craftsmanship? Also, anything too expensive and it would just make sense to just buy a set of EXs instead of upgrading.
    Last edited by whitey019; 07-26-2019 at 11:05 AM.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
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    SouthWest of Cleveland
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    1,924

    Default Re: Sierra 2EX upgrade kit questions

    1. I'd imagine that the components will be matched regardless of whether you get them as an upgrade vs
    complete speakers.

    2. From reports I've "heard" they should still have the same qualities we love, but fuller mids as well.

    3. The crossover for the Sierra-2's was specifically designed to integrate the RAAL with the SEAS Curv
    Woofer and I'd suspect it would not work with anything else. Dave has traditionally taken the swapped
    components back as he'd rather have them vs someone reselling them and having them "out there".

    Each of us must weigh what makes sense regarding upgrading existing speakers vs selling existing speakers & buying new vs just buying new.
    Ed

    * Sierra-2EX's W/V2 crossover upgrade
    * (2) Rythmik F12's
    * Parasound Halo P6
    * Audio by Van Alstine DVA-M225 Monoblock Amps
    * MiniDSP 2x4HD For Sub calibration
    *World's Best Cables Canare 4S11 speaker cables

  3. #3
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    Aug 2003
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    USA
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    Default Re: Sierra 2EX upgrade kit questions

    Quote Originally Posted by whitey019 View Post
    Dave,

    This kit sounds peaks my interest, but thinking ahead the possibility also raises a few concerns.

    1. How important is the fact that: 'Left / right pairs are matched by hand to within ± 1dB'? Obviously installing the upgrade kit in the Sierra 2 will eliminate the matched pair speakers.

    2. I have been amazed by the detail and wide dispersion of the Sierra 2 that results in a soundstage that is both higher and wider than anything I've experienced previously. My only minor grip is that, at times, the Sierra 2 can sound a little thin in the lower midrange. Your description of the EX sounds like it might address this which is great, but I hope not at the expense of what I enjoy about the original Sierra 2.

    3. After the upgrade I will have a pair of great Seas woofers and cross-overs just wasting away. Knowing me, I will either build a box or buy a knock-down flat pack kit of similar dimensions and configuration to the Sierra 2 and build another set of speakers. The only problem is I will need tweeters. Can you provide the specifications of the original cross-over to assist in finding an appropriate tweeter. Any recommendations other than your Raal, which is too expensive for my level of speaker building craftsmanship? Also, anything too expensive and it would just make sense to just buy a set of EXs instead of upgrading.
    All good questions:

    Quote Originally Posted by whitey019 View Post
    1. How important is the fact that: 'Left / right pairs are matched by hand to within ± 1dB'? Obviously installing the upgrade kit in the Sierra 2 will eliminate the matched pair speakers.
    For upgrade parts, all components are electrically tested against our reference standard. We hold the individual component to a very tight tolerance against the standard (effectively equivalent to +/- 1dB). However, due to tolerances, it is possible that one component can be in the +1 range while another also in the +1 range. This means that when assembled, worst case is that the overall result would be +/- 2dB. Fyi, typical industry standard for high performance speakers is +/- 3dB. So, while we can not guarantee a +/- 1dB match for speakers that have been upgraded with kits, the matching is still very close and even in worst case, likely to be completely inaudible. Hope I worded this so it makes sense, been too many sleepless nights this past week

    Quote Originally Posted by whitey019 View Post
    2. I have been amazed by the detail and wide dispersion of the Sierra 2 that results in a soundstage that is both higher and wider than anything I've experienced previously. My only minor grip is that, at times, the Sierra 2 can sound a little thin in the lower midrange. Your description of the EX sounds like it might address this which is great, but I hope not at the expense of what I enjoy about the original Sierra 2.
    What you mention in the lower mids exactly what the Sierra-2EX addresses (as well as many other across the board improvements). I have not been able to detect any audible differences in dispersion, and on paper - technically the S2-EX is better. I do not suspect you would notice any differences in dispersion / imaging.


    Quote Originally Posted by whitey019 View Post
    After the upgrade I will have a pair of great Seas woofers and cross-overs just wasting away. Knowing me, I will either build a box or buy a knock-down flat pack kit of similar dimensions and configuration to the Sierra 2 and build another set of speakers. The only problem is I will need tweeters. Can you provide the specifications of the original cross-over to assist in finding an appropriate tweeter. Any recommendations other than your Raal, which is too expensive for my level of speaker building craftsmanship? Also, anything too expensive and it would just make sense to just buy a set of EXs instead of upgrading.
    Crossovers are complex circuits. I am not quite sure how someone defines specs of a crossover so that a different tweeter can be used. Crossovers are designed for a specific woofer and tweeter, never the other way around. Even if I published the electrical curves of the high pass and low pass circuits on the S2 crossover, I am not even sure how one would go about looking at tweeter specifications to see if that tweeter would "work"... Reason being is that every different tweeter model out there is going to have a different impedance profile, and the filter slopes of a crossover directly correlate to these impedances. Any difference in impedance from one tweeter model to another will have a dramatic effect on the filter slopes, thus having a major effect on the blend between woofer and tweeter. Add to that frequency response corrections and level matching (all of which the S2 crossover, or really any properly designed crossover should do) -- and it makes the job of finding a tweeter that will work as a replacement for the original tweeter pretty much impossible, and likely not even a possibility.

    If there is enough interest, I suppose I could design a new crossover for that S2 woofer to be used with our Sierra-1 tweeter. That could be one solution to the spare parts, but either way - that S2 crossover is effectively useless without the original components it was designed to be used with.
    .
    .
    .
    Good Sound To You!

    David Fabrikant
    www.ascendacoustics.com

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    146

    Default Re: Sierra 2EX upgrade kit questions

    Well, I am pretty certain I will be buying a kit for my new domestic cabinet Sierra 2’s. But I do not think I would have the heart to simply toss the Sierra 2 woofers into the trash so count me in on an interested party to send them back for such an Ascend special project.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
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    Default Re: Sierra 2EX upgrade kit questions

    Dave, would it be possible for those who will have no use for the original S2 woofers to return them to Ascend with free return shipping? Otherwise they would end up either tossed in the trash, sitting on a shelf/in a box/etc., or showing up on the used market. Don't know if there's any value in it for you, but would be a nice option to have available.

    I am hoping to be a EX up-grader at some point and will have no use for the old woofers, though I'm a ways out from being able to get the kits.
    Ed

    * Sierra-2EX's W/V2 crossover upgrade
    * (2) Rythmik F12's
    * Parasound Halo P6
    * Audio by Van Alstine DVA-M225 Monoblock Amps
    * MiniDSP 2x4HD For Sub calibration
    *World's Best Cables Canare 4S11 speaker cables

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    5,538

    Default Re: Sierra 2EX upgrade kit questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Mag_Neato View Post
    Dave, would it be possible for those who will have no use for the original S2 woofers to return them to Ascend with free return shipping? Otherwise they would end up either tossed in the trash, sitting on a shelf/in a box/etc., or showing up on the used market. Don't know if there's any value in it for you, but would be a nice option to have available.

    I am hoping to be a EX up-grader at some point and will have no use for the old woofers, though I'm a ways out from being able to get the kits.
    This is an interesting idea and I would hate for these parts to simply get tossed. Send me an email when you are ready and we can work something out.
    .
    .
    .
    Good Sound To You!

    David Fabrikant
    www.ascendacoustics.com

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    146

    Default Re: Sierra 2EX upgrade kit questions

    Dave, could 2EX Upgrade Kit buyers send back both the woofers and crossovers for you to pair with Sierra 2 ribbon tweeters? These paired Sierra 2's could be classified as Sierra 2 "C Stock" and priced lower than normal "B-Stock Sierra 2's. Just an option to avoid many tossed woofers and crossovers. I'd be happy to contribute to such a project rather than throwing these great units out.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2018
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    26

    Default Re: Sierra 2EX upgrade kit questions

    Returning the original Sierra 2s woofers and cross-overs sounds interesting.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Sierra 2EX upgrade kit questions

    Quote Originally Posted by rifmon View Post
    Dave, could 2EX Upgrade Kit buyers send back both the woofers and crossovers for you to pair with Sierra 2 ribbon tweeters? These paired Sierra 2's could be classified as Sierra 2 "C Stock" and priced lower than normal "B-Stock Sierra 2's. Just an option to avoid many tossed woofers and crossovers. I'd be happy to contribute to such a project rather than throwing these great units out.
    This would be something we would have to carefully consider. Ultimately, the Sierra-2EX will replace the Sierra-2 and sales have been brisk thus far such that using Sierra-2 cabinets for anything other than Sierra-2EX can possibly lead to inventory shortages.
    .
    .
    .
    Good Sound To You!

    David Fabrikant
    www.ascendacoustics.com

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    52

    Default Re: Sierra 2EX upgrade kit questions

    Hi Dave,

    I just received my upgrade kit, and managed to find one of the magnetic protectors for the RAAL. Is there a proper way to place the magnetic protector back on the RAAL? The warning about air pressure blowing out the foil is making me pause.

    Thanks,
    Ryan

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