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Thread: Sierra Tower & RAAL Clarification

  1. #1
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    Default Sierra Tower & RAAL Clarification

    Everything I've read about the Sierra Tower is very positive and as for the RAAL it is probably one of the best drivers out there. When I look at the Sierra Tower Measurements page...it appears that the very top end is within 2 db of the mid top end...which I would call flat compared to a lot of measurements you see on other well regarded loudspeakers tested by Sound Stage Access....and I assume Dave voiced it that way.

    I was pretty surprised when I saw a post on Audiogon suggesting that the Sierra tower has an intentionally tipped up top end to make it appear that it has great resolving capability.

    I'm hoping Dave can add some insight as to his voicing and as to the RAAL capability when it comes to soundstage and resolution.


    https://forum.audiogon.com/discussio...gn-moab?page=3


    tektondesign113 posts
    06-30-2019 11:31pm
    Nitrobob,

    Respectfully, your first post reads and looks to be more like an Ascend speaker ad to me than anything else, and none of the post really has anything to do with the Moab.

    I believe we talked a few months back and I can assure you that you are in a very slim minority - 4 out of 100 to be exact. I know the Double Impact is a great sounding loudspeaker. Furthermore, the Ascend Towers do not have any less distortion, lower distortion, cleaner and clearer sound or better resolution; they are simply voiced differently than I choose to voice speakers. The top-end of the Ascend Towers and the other speakers you've had the treble turned up and we covered this. Turning up the treble is an effect I've used for decades if I want the listener to perceive exacting resolution. There's a handful of speaker companies that live by this credo and I hope they never change.

    Eric Alexander

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Sierra Tower & RAAL Clarification

    If I'm not mistaken, the measurements on the main Sierra Towers page are for the NRT dome. The RAAL measurements (which are even flatter and more neutral) are here:

    http://www.ascendacoustics.com/pages...on%20Tower.pdf

    Edit: I see this link is listed under the RAAL section. If you click the measurements link on the left, it's for the NRT.

    Just looked at the first page of that thread and looks like the Tekton owner took got a little miffed when he saw the reviewer post:

    "Bottom line, they are no ways near as clear as the Ascends"
    Last edited by mikesiskav; 07-01-2019 at 01:26 PM.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Sierra Tower & RAAL Clarification

    You are absolutely right....I did look at the measurement page for the NRT and as you said...the RAAL looks pretty close to dead flat.

    I guess now that I think about it...the really strange part is that Eric Alexander is taken aback when one of the posters says a number of good things about his speakers but ends by saying he prefers the Ascend Towers because the RAALs are clearer.

    Which then causes him to defend his speakers by saying that the Ascends are tipped up...

    Again, thanks for the link

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Sierra Tower & RAAL Clarification

    My two cents:
    1. Take anything you read on Audiogon forums with a large grain of salt.
    2. Take anything you read from Eric Alexander with an even larger grain of salt.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Sierra Tower & RAAL Clarification

    Quote Originally Posted by Beave View Post
    My two cents:
    1. Take anything you read on Audiogon forums with a large grain of salt.
    2. Take anything you read from Eric Alexander with an even larger grain of salt.
    Ditto
    -curtis

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Sierra Tower & RAAL Clarification

    To his credit though, he did say that good loudspeakers have voicing with attributes that will appeal to different people... which to me says some people prefer Ascend, some prefer Tekton, some prefer Salk, some prefer Maggie’s, etc.

    I don’t doubt that his “midrange tweeter” array have a planar like midrange sound but I doubt that the lone unit being used as a tweeter is in the ballpark of the RAAL when it comes to extension, soundstage and detail.

    One thing for sure... if you buy a 150# speaker... it’s going to be harder to resell and you are likely to get hammered on price as buyers deduct the shipping costs from their offer price.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Sierra Tower & RAAL Clarification

    Quote Originally Posted by Snapsc View Post
    Everything I've read about the Sierra Tower is very positive and as for the RAAL it is probably one of the best drivers out there. When I look at the Sierra Tower Measurements page...it appears that the very top end is within 2 db of the mid top end...which I would call flat compared to a lot of measurements you see on other well regarded loudspeakers tested by Sound Stage Access....and I assume Dave voiced it that way.

    I was pretty surprised when I saw a post on Audiogon suggesting that the Sierra tower has an intentionally tipped up top end to make it appear that it has great resolving capability.

    I'm hoping Dave can add some insight as to his voicing and as to the RAAL capability when it comes to soundstage and resolution.


    https://forum.audiogon.com/discussio...gn-moab?page=3


    tektondesign113 posts
    06-30-2019 11:31pm
    Nitrobob,

    Respectfully, your first post reads and looks to be more like an Ascend speaker ad to me than anything else, and none of the post really has anything to do with the Moab.

    I believe we talked a few months back and I can assure you that you are in a very slim minority - 4 out of 100 to be exact. I know the Double Impact is a great sounding loudspeaker. Furthermore, the Ascend Towers do not have any less distortion, lower distortion, cleaner and clearer sound or better resolution; they are simply voiced differently than I choose to voice speakers. The top-end of the Ascend Towers and the other speakers you've had the treble turned up and we covered this. Turning up the treble is an effect I've used for decades if I want the listener to perceive exacting resolution. There's a handful of speaker companies that live by this credo and I hope they never change.

    Eric Alexander
    Shame on Eric for that post, beyond unprofessional -- "reads like an Ascend ad"? Unlike Tekton, we have never paid for an ad or given away free or discounted speakers in exchange for a review.

    For Eric to make such claims without ever having measured our Ribbon Towers gives true insight into his character. No, we do not "tip up our treble response in order for the listener to perceive exacting resolution". That is a common excuse I have heard more times than I can count over my near 4 decades as a professional in this industry. And BTW, where exactly are the measurements of his speakers?

    The hypocrisy in all of this is that Eric's controversial patent, once someone is able to get past all the technobabble and hyperbole, promotes the benefits of low mass in order to extract more resolution. Really nothing new there, it's the main premise behind the design of true ribbon tweeters and electrostatic speakers.

    In fact, here is the abstract of his patent:

    "Improved speakers are better able to accurately reproduce sound through the use of low-mass transducers."

    Fact: the dome tweeter Eric uses in his designs has a moving mass that is ~44 times greater than the moving mass of the ribbon tweeter we are using. With regards to inertia (the lower the better), that is like comparing the handling, acceleration/deceleration of a motorcycle (our ribbon tweeter) to a semi-truck...

    Something to think about....
    .
    .
    .
    Good Sound To You!

    David Fabrikant
    www.ascendacoustics.com

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Sierra Tower & RAAL Clarification

    Quote Originally Posted by Beave View Post
    My two cents:
    1. Take anything you read on Audiogon forums with a large grain of salt.
    2. Take anything you read from Eric Alexander with an even larger grain of salt.
    There needs to be a "like" button on this forum, just for this post.
    Luna Duo V2 LR, Titan Horizon V2, and Rythmik L22 & L12 in HT, Sierra-LXs in study, S-2EXs and Duo V2 C in bedroom, S-1 NrTs in dining room, S-1s at work, HTM-200s in kitchen. Brother owns CMT-340s and dad has a pair of CBM-170s.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Sierra Tower & RAAL Clarification

    Quote Originally Posted by Beave View Post
    My two cents:
    1. Take anything you read on Audiogon forums with a large grain of salt.
    2. Take anything you read from Eric Alexander with an even larger grain of salt.
    Is that Sea salt, Himalayan salt, Kosher salt, Pickling salt, etc.? Makes a difference......
    Ed

    * Sierra-2EX's W/V2 crossover upgrade
    * (2) Rythmik F12's
    * Parasound Halo P6
    * Audio by Van Alstine DVA-M225 Monoblock Amps
    * MiniDSP 2x4HD For Sub calibration
    *World's Best Cables Canare 4S11 speaker cables

  10. #10
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    Mar 2013
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    8

    Default Re: Sierra Tower & RAAL Clarification

    We may never know but it would seem that Tekton is selling plenty of speakers...which means there is absolutely no reason to make untrue or overstated comparisons with any of their competitors.

    Near the end of Stereophiles review of one of Tekton's loudspeakers, they make their own comparison...I will only quote two sentences...and I believe that this is why Ribbons are well loved....because of their clarity and tonal accuracy.

    "As I frequently remind you, the best test of any loudspeaker is how tangibly lifelike it can make a recorded piano sound. Nojima's Hamburg Steinway sounded a touch soft and slightly smeared—not as precise as through the DeVore O/93s or the Harbeth M30.2s".

    Yes, overall they liked the speakers...but as is the case with all audio products...nothing is perfect...nothing satisfies everyone.

    One more thing I will point out....you rarely see Sierra Towers with the RAAL option come up for resale on any of the marts...that is less the case with Tekton and other brands. Does that mean that they impress for a while and then not so much over time?

    Actually, I think...enough said on this subject. Dave, thanks for adding your Technical expertise and comparison.

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