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Thread: Another RAAL v NrT question

  1. #1
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    Apr 2018
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    Default Another RAAL v NrT question

    I'm in my early 60's and understand that with age comes a decline in hearing with respect to upper frequencies. So my question is whether or not the upgrade to RAAL would be an advantage over the NrT, i.e., assuming my upper limit is 17 khz what would I be missing in the presentation of the NrT vs the RAAL. I've read a lot about the harmonics of the RAAL, with the term "airy" and "lingers" used quite a bit. But are those things we can still hear as we get older? I don't expect either one to be "harsh" or overly "clinical" based on what I've read which is good because that would be my primary concern. I know there's been a lot of debate about the characteristics of both and I am not looking for a "which one is best" response. Just any thoughts on whether or not I should even be concerned. Appreciate any feedback provided. And apologies if already asked and answered.

  2. #2
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    Nov 2014
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    Default Re: Another RAAL v NrT question

    It sounds like you're questioning if the perceived benefit might be out of your audible range. I believe the RAALs are crossed over in the 1.8-3.0 kHz range depending on model which means the RAAL would still be providing a very substantial portion of the sound you hear.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Another RAAL v NrT question

    Hey Jax,

    I'm mid-sixties and had both ear drums burst as a young jarhead, followed by seven years in road construction. My hearing is bad, especially the upper range (my Wife can't believe the things I can't hear).

    Having said that, I have a set of the RAAL Towers, and the RAAL Horizon in a HT setup that I use for stereo music about 50% of the time. I have never heard the upper range the way my speakers play it. It is beyond superb. If you close your eyes, you can tell exactly where each of the instruments is coming from. Have never heard the NrT Towers, but there is no way I would even think about giving up my RAAL Towers. Actually, that isn't true. I might be able to be talked into the RAAL Horizon's as main speakers. I think they may actually be a little better speaker. But no way would I do without the RAAL's, they are truly that good, and you will hear it.

    randy

  4. #4
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    Feb 2016
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    Default Re: Another RAAL v NrT question

    I'm 69 and have limited hearing above 2k in my right ear. In 2016 I also did the RAAL/NrT debate with myself about getting older and wondering if my hearing would get worse with time or that my hearing wasn't good enough to justify/appreciate a RAAL purchase (the additional cost was also a consideration).

    I'm a music lover, so I decided I might as well enjoy the best sounds while I can (and the wife gave the additional cost approval ), so I purchased RAAL towers and horizon and love them. They sound great whether I'm playing them softly or loud (an excuse for having hearing problems). And I agree with Randy, RAAL horizons as main speakers would be very tempting.

    I've read a lot about the harmonics of the RAAL, with the term "airy" and "lingers" used quite a bit. But are those things we can still hear as we get older?
    Can't speak for 70+, but I'm still appreciating these qualities at 69.

    Good luck with your decision!

    Jack

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2018
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    Default Re: Another RAAL v NrT question

    Quote Originally Posted by randyrlee2 View Post
    Hey Jax,

    I'm mid-sixties and had both ear drums burst as a young jarhead, followed by seven years in road construction. My hearing is bad, especially the upper range (my Wife can't believe the things I can't hear).

    Having said that, I have a set of the RAAL Towers, and the RAAL Horizon in a HT setup that I use for stereo music about 50% of the time. I have never heard the upper range the way my speakers play it. It is beyond superb. If you close your eyes, you can tell exactly where each of the instruments is coming from. Have never heard the NrT Towers, but there is no way I would even think about giving up my RAAL Towers. Actually, that isn't true. I might be able to be talked into the RAAL Horizon's as main speakers. I think they may actually be a little better speaker. But no way would I do without the RAAL's, they are truly that good, and you will hear it.

    randy
    Randy, thank you so much for responding. Very helpful and what I was trying to confirm. My assumption was that while the frequency range of our hearing might be reduced the various qualities and harmonics within the range would still be audible, thus making the RAAL or any other quality transducer a worthwhile investment. I think your experience confirms that. While I am at it, would you mind commenting on the bass quality. I will be two channel, no heavy metal, rap, pipe organs, etc. Mostly vocals and instrumental. A lot of Americana and acoustical stuff. So I am thinking bass would be more than adequate.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Another RAAL v NrT question

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack1949 View Post
    I'm 69 and have limited hearing above 2k in my right ear. In 2016 I also did the RAAL/NrT debate with myself about getting older and wondering if my hearing would get worse with time or that my hearing wasn't good enough to justify/appreciate a RAAL purchase (the additional cost was also a consideration).

    I'm a music lover, so I decided I might as well enjoy the best sounds while I can (and the wife gave the additional cost approval ), so I purchased RAAL towers and horizon and love them. They sound great whether I'm playing them softly or loud (an excuse for having hearing problems). And I agree with Randy, RAAL horizons as main speakers would be very tempting.


    Can't speak for 70+, but I'm still appreciating these qualities at 69.

    Good luck with your decision!

    Jack
    Well, your experience seems to mirror Randy's. I am not suffering (yet) any significant loss of hearing other than normal age-related as I try to take good care of it (ear protection when mowing etc). Although the NrT would likely handily best my current speakers I am only going to do this once going into retirement so I think RAAL is the way to go. Thank you Jack.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    37

    Default Re: Another RAAL v NrT question

    Hey Jax,

    Glad to help. Actually, everyone on this forum has most likely had questions like these before buying.

    I started as music only, then recently graduated to an Ascend home theater, with RAAL Towers, center, sides and Rythmik subwoofer (soon to be two). In pure stereo music-only mode, you will not be disappointed with the Towers bass. They outperform any speaker I've seen for the size of the speaker. In fact, the bass is much like the RAAL tweeters in that it is precise, on note, and doesn't linger or boom. I have two small Velodyne subs I was using with my prior speakers (Dahlquist DQ-10's) and I didn't use them.

    My taste in music is incredibly diverse, but not especially bass-heavy. Having said that, in the music I like that does extend the bass a bit, the Towers are superb. Honestly, in my opinion, you can't touch the sound these speakers manage in anything near the price point. I haven't actually heard any speakers I like better at any price point.

    That's my 2 cents. Hope it helps. If you get a pair, you won't be disappointed. Just make sure to give yourself a couple hours after you get them to let yours ears become attuned to what they are hearing.

    randy

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
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    USA
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    5,538

    Default Re: Another RAAL v NrT question

    Quote Originally Posted by jaxtitleman View Post
    I'm in my early 60's and understand that with age comes a decline in hearing with respect to upper frequencies. So my question is whether or not the upgrade to RAAL would be an advantage over the NrT, i.e., assuming my upper limit is 17 khz what would I be missing in the presentation of the NrT vs the RAAL. I've read a lot about the harmonics of the RAAL, with the term "airy" and "lingers" used quite a bit. But are those things we can still hear as we get older? I don't expect either one to be "harsh" or overly "clinical" based on what I've read which is good because that would be my primary concern. I know there's been a lot of debate about the characteristics of both and I am not looking for a "which one is best" response. Just any thoughts on whether or not I should even be concerned. Appreciate any feedback provided. And apologies if already asked and answered.
    The significant advantage of the RAAL ribbon we use is in its transient response. The moving mass (the part of the tweeter that resonates to produce soundwaves) is ~ 50 times less weight than the moving mass of a dome tweeter (even the best dome tweeters). This translates to as near perfect transient reproduction as a transducer is possible of -- which means less stored energy. In other words, there is much less overall energy produced (the stuff that isn't supposed to be there), which translates to more detail yet a smoother overall sound that is actually easier on your ears. I have learned from selling many thousands of RAAL ribbons - more than any other company at this point, that the older one's hearing, the more they actually appreciate these ribbons.

    I know at first glance this doesn't make sense since one's hearing gets worse with age - but with these ribbons, there is less "noise" so it turns out they are easier on our ears and the sounds are more distinct.
    (I say ours because I am getting old too )
    .
    .
    .
    Good Sound To You!

    David Fabrikant
    www.ascendacoustics.com

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2018
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    11

    Default Re: Another RAAL v NrT question

    Thank you both Dave and Randy for your responses. Assuming Dave has expresso cabinets in stock I am going to take the plunge.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2017
    Location
    Oregon
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    47

    Default Re: Another RAAL v NrT question

    as someone who has endured both titanium and 'soft' dome tweeters for the past 20 years, I can assure you the RAAL is WAY WAY WAY easier on the ears, resulting in a much more pleasant and engaging experience
    Example: Diana Krall's "S'Wonderful". On my dome tweeter speakers, every time she sang "S" (which is, obviously a LOT in this song), it really jumped out at you, in an annoying, distracting way. With the RAAL the "S" is very much there and extremely well defined, but it doesn't bring attention to itself. Hope that helps.
    Enjoy!

    PS- I have no experience with the NrT dome tweeter, no doubt a superior tweeter than I have experienced in the past, so I'm assuming the difference would less prominent.
    Last edited by Brady; 04-19-2018 at 11:54 AM.

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