Does this equipment fit together?

[dgordon10]

Hi all,

After demoing some mid-range stereo equipment at Best Buy and finding myself to be a pretty critical shopper, I've decided to give an Ascend system a shot. For background, I first looked at Martin Logan 20's and B&W CM5's and CM8's. I thought the ML's lacked midrange and had a harsh over-emphasized tweeter, and B&W's sounded lifeless/boring, although maybe more detailed, more even in frequency response and closer to what I was looking for. I looked at the Pioneer Elite and Marantz A/V receiver in the $700 range, but also wasn't impressed with those...they clearly couldn't get close to the quality of sound of the higher end amplifiers and had pretty high noise floors at higher volumes.

Thus, for my mid-fi system I've ordered a pair of Ascend Sierra 2's and Emotiva XDA-2 and XPA-200 to drive them. They'll arrive next week, but knowing how critical I am I thought I'd go ahead and get some advice...is there any obvious weak point in this modest 2-ch system (primarily for music)? Later I plan to buy more amps, speakers and A/V equipment, but that's years down the road since I'm currently a PhD student with a limited budget.

Thanks!

[petmotel]

Hi all,

After demoing some mid-range stereo equipment at Best Buy and finding myself to be a pretty critical shopper, I've decided to give an Ascend system a shot. For background, I first looked at Martin Logan 20's and B&W CM5's and CM8's. I thought the ML's lacked midrange and had a harsh over-emphasized tweeter, and B&W's sounded lifeless/boring, although maybe more detailed, more even in frequency response and closer to what I was looking for. I looked at the Pioneer Elite and Marantz A/V receiver in the $700 range, but also wasn't impressed with those...they clearly couldn't get close to the quality of sound of the higher end amplifiers and had pretty high noise floors at higher volumes.

Thus, for my mid-fi system I've ordered a pair of Ascend Sierra 2's and Emotiva XDA-2 and XPA-200 to drive them. They'll arrive next week, but knowing how critical I am I thought I'd go ahead and get some advice...is there any obvious weak point in this modest 2-ch system (primarily for music)? Later I plan to buy more amps, speakers and A/V equipment, but that's years down the road since I'm currently a PhD student with a limited budget.

Thanks!

I could respond with a veritable book regarding this innocent appearing question, but after considerable consideration, what I think is not nearly so important as how this gear sounds to you. I find the term "mid-fi" somewhat offensive, a term cooked up by "high end snake oil salesmen" used to shame folks into spending more than they need to.

Make sure you let us know what YOU think about your new system after actually hearing it. I have a feeling your terminology might be somewhat different at that point. Just make sure to use very well recorded material, I think you will find you get back what you put in. Possibly your source material, and most likely the room acoustics will be the weakest links.

If your system is in a fairly small, or reflective environment, an AVR or pre/pro with a good room correction program might be a very helpful addition at some point. It's unlikely that system frequency response will be optimal in an average environment.

Jay

[choirbass]

It does seem like Jay covered a few needed things.. but, what are your preferences acoustically anyhow? If it's simply accuracy regarding audio components, the Emotiva gear is very good, no doubt, and with helpful additives such as double shielded interconnects to more eliminate electrical interference, and balanced vs unbalanced, et al. The specific speakers won't disappoint, but, that's to be expected. However, a typical disclaimer you could say (dun dun dun! lol), if the source material is poor quality (low bit-rate, highly compressed, sub-par mixing/recording quality, or simply 'too revealed', et al), then that will be unfortunately(?) exactly what you would hear. The exact opposite circumstances play an equally truthful role, Prior good = great, et al. Such are the drawbacks and benefits of accuracy. The general 'room-acoustics' certainly play their own part.. there's only so much that can be adjusted.

[dgordon10]

My impressions after several days of listening to this system:
Revealing/detailed
Too bright
Vocals lack body, especially male vocals...could it be the special tweeter? Is it only good for higher frequencies?

I do not know if break in will help, but I will give it a shot for several days before returning. I'm disappointed after reading initial rave reviews.

[dgordon10]

Also, I'm pretty sure you need a sub, as the bass is not substantial either...if the sound was spectacular, I would invest more. But it's not there to justify the cost.

[choirbass]

Still a bit lost, but subjectively, what would you consider 'spectacular'?

As far as opening up, each persons hearing does need its own time to eventually do so. Not listening to other speakers for the next while would aid, no doubt.

However, if you still are disappointed even after hearing 'breaks in', then it is understandable.

As far as the speaker objectively, its linear from ~40hz - ~40k hz. If it sounds unexpectedly disappointing, the above reasons would probably explain why.

[dgordon10]

Still a bit lost, but subjectively, what would you consider 'spectacular'?

As far as opening up, each persons hearing does need its own time to eventually do so. Not listening to other speakers for the next while would aid, no doubt.

However, if you still are disappointed even after hearing 'breaks in', then it is understandable.

My impression is the cabinet and tweeter combine to emphasize certain higher frequencies of the human voice, and there's a range that's not there due to it being out of the range of the tweeter and woofer. It could be a bad match with the electronics or something I have not thought of...but that is my best guess.

Spectacular would be adding large, room-filling sound for all vocal frequencies...even-sounding volume for lows, mids, highs...

Plus the detail and crispness that this system does have. If I had to make a choice, I would sacrifice the detail for the above qualities, though.

[choirbass]

About the only thing I can think of, is just spending the remaining trial to see if you still feel that way. What you are saying makes sense, tho.

Like I had said tho, the speaker itself is linear, from top to bottom.

Not hearing lower frequencies the same as mids and trebles is pretty normal. Takes getting used to.

Side note - referring to http://ascendacoustics.com/pages/pro.../srm2meas.html will explain much of the speaker, visual graphs w/ descriptions of each measurement

[markie]

Hi dgordon,

I appreciate your frankness. Dollars to donuts you have a pronounced room suckout or null at about 80 hz. You also are probably getting a room peak at some higher frequency and these two in combination will be the main reason for the unsatisfactory sound you are hearing. You have amazing speakers and excellent electronics. Since it appears you have a nicely critical ear and are starting to dive into this hobby for the long term, it behooves you to learn to identify and correct for the acoustic properties of your room (and future rooms!). This will be the most cost effective thing you can do for the great sound you are aiming for, imo.

Mark

[davef]

My impression is the cabinet and tweeter combine to emphasize certain higher frequencies of the human voice, and there's a range that's not there due to it being out of the range of the tweeter and woofer. It could be a bad match with the electronics or something I have not thought of...but that is my best guess.

Spectacular would be adding large, room-filling sound for all vocal frequencies...even-sounding volume for lows, mids, highs...

Plus the detail and crispness that this system does have. If I had to make a choice, I would sacrifice the detail for the above qualities, though.

Hi dgordon10,

As others have mentioned, the Sierra-2 are extremely linear -- they are certainly not missing anything from the range of about 60Hz on up to well past 30kHz. In fact, what they are producing is actually truer to the actual source material. The only thing they are missing is a considerable amount of excess energy -- information that we often get used to hearing and expect to hear, but does not actually belong there. This is due mostly to the rather amazing transient accuracy of the ribbon tweeter and is also a major factor in the design of the woofer. Over a 30ms time window, there is definitely going to be less overall energy when compared to most other loudspeakers -- the lack of this excess energy can make things sound like they have less body to them. In some ways, it is like getting used to listening to a speaker in a reflective room and then listening to a speaker in a very non-reflective room.

This can take a while to get used to, or you may simply prefer the non-ribbon sound - and that is absolutely OK.

What speakers have you heard in your room prior to the Sierra-2's? Also, a picture of the front of your room showing the placement of the speakers would be very beneficial to us -- please post this when you get a spare moment.

I look forward to hearing back from you!