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Thread: Achieving much better sound could be just one component away :)

  1. #11
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    Default Re: Achieving much better sound could be just one component away :)

    Vodka suppose to have no taste because it's distilled, but some people still think some brand taste better than others. It's a mystery isn't it?

  2. #12
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    Default Re: Achieving much better sound could be just one component away :)

    Quote Originally Posted by sunlight99 View Post
    Vodka suppose to have no taste because it's distilled, but some people still think some brand taste better than others. It's a mystery isn't it?
    Hehe! Many have declared that all Vodkas, without any glaring defects and sipped within proper parameters, taste the same - like nothing.

    But really, from http://www.greatvodka.com/vodkaMyths.htm

    At the risk of shattering some dreams, here we attempt to debunk some of the great vodka myths!

    Myth #1 All vodkas are the same.
    All vodkas are not the same. While vodka is, by legal definition, “A neutral spirit without distinctive character,” without distinctive character does not mean “no flavor.” Vodka is a delicate spirit that can be easily overpowered in cocktails. Many different vodkas will taste the same in your favorite drink. However, when evaluated straight or with a little water, individual attributes will shine through.

    In addition, the nose and cleanliness — absence of “heads” and “tails” of the vodka — impact your experience.

    Big differences between vodkas result from the quality and type of the raw materials used, the distillation technique and the quality of the bottling.

  3. #13
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    Default Re: Achieving much better sound could be just one component away :)

    It's all subjective.

    Basically, what the vinyl/tube fans are saying is that intentional distortion in sound can be pleasing to the ears.

    They are willing to pay oodles of extra money to hear intentional distortion introduced into their sound system.

    I'm of the group that the best improvement comes from placement and treatment of the room itself.

  4. #14
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    Default Re: Achieving much better sound could be just one component away :)

    Quote Originally Posted by GirgleMirt View Post
    lol, u dont want to know where that bitterness came from

    It's always surprising, the tube thing also spread other places. Guitar for example, so many guitarists so deeply believe tubes sound better, some companies included tubes on some pedals where the tubes weren't even part of the circuit... Simply there for guitarists to believe they were analog and so better sounding than ss...

    Another 1000$ wager I'd do; real tube amp vs solid state with tube modeling. I'd bet nobody could tell them apart...
    Guitarists prefer tubes because of their overdrive behavior. Tubes soft clip when overdriven, as opposed to SS which hard clips. The result is two very different, and very easy to hear, types of distortion. How a guitar distorts plays a big part of the sound the player is looking to achieve.

    To an extent this is also true of audiophile tube gear. It isn't about what a tube amp does have but rather what it lacks: diode switching noise, odd order harmonics, feedback..... all of these things make music sound harsh and less realistic. A well designed tube amp doesn't sound "tubey" it just sounds neutral and correct only it has certain advantages over SS in terms of not creating noise that the human ear finds to be very unpleasant, noise that transistors all produce.

    The very first tubes for audio use, DHTs or directly heated triodes, are the most linear and distortion free amplification devices ever invented. This can be proven through measurement as well as listening. The reason they aren't still used widely is because they make very little power, are very inefficient, and are made by hand via craftsmen instead of being mass produced. Convenience wins over performance, much like how the world is dominated by mp3s today.

    Your comments sound like bashing based on things you've heard or read rather than actual experience with good examples of the products in question. I've had the pleasure of using both amplification types and find both to be excellent when well designed, but a properly implemented tube amp produces tone colors and harmonics in a way that is all but impossible to do with transistors.

  5. #15
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    Default Re: Achieving much better sound could be just one component away :)

    Was ASCEND Represented at AXPONA?

  6. #16
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    Default Re: Achieving much better sound could be just one component away :)

    Quote Originally Posted by Audiolover458 View Post
    Was ASCEND Represented at AXPONA?
    I don't believe Ascend does any shows. Shows are both money and time intensive, and Ascend prefers a different path than this type of advertisement (I figure).

    Mark

  7. #17
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    Default Re: Achieving much better sound could be just one component away :)

    Quote Originally Posted by markie View Post
    I don't believe Ascend does any shows. Shows are both money and time intensive, and Ascend prefers a different path than this type of advertisement (I figure).

    Mark
    It's really not the expense -- more so my own patience. I have been attending audio shows since the late 80's, and have thoroughly lost my taste for them quite some time ago. I enjoy going to CES in Vegas every year, but that is to meet with our many vendors and check out cool new gadgets. Even CES has soured for me a bit ever since CES and AVN no longer share the same time period. My cousin owns a few different companies that always display at AVN (Adult Entertainment Expo) Now those were some CRAZY times!
    .
    .
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    Good Sound To You!

    David Fabrikant
    www.ascendacoustics.com

  8. #18
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    Default Re: Achieving much better sound could be just one component away :)

    Here's another interesting and unexpected observation by a listener which I just saw over at AudioCircle.

    He has two external hard drives (with the same music files) which he has fed into his Bryston digital player via USB. They sound different, with one much preferred. The question is, why would this be so? Not sure just yet. His post is below.

    Mark


    I had been using a WD Passport portable 2.5" external HDD. I backed up my computer's HDD using an OWC external WD Green 3TB HDD and decided to try it in my BDP-1. I powered the OWC external with a linear power supply. I was very surprised to hear how different this sounds vs the WD Passport. The portable sounds much better - open, extended with great dynamic bass. The OWC was rolled off in both extremes, lacked dynamics and was very warm and soft sounding. I switched back and forth with the same results each time.

    I am now trying to figure out why they would sound so different.

    The WD Passport is powered by the USB 5v that it is receiving from the BDP-1 through a USB-3 cable.
    Perhaps it is the cleaner BDP-1 power supply?
    USB 3.0 cable

    The OWC/WD Green is powered by a linear power supply.
    Perhaps the power supply is noisy? (Keces)
    Perhaps the umbilical from the Keces to the OWC is picking up noise.
    USB 2.0 cable? I switched a couple of cables and they definitely sounded different from each other. A Belden was very warm while a generic was a little more extended.

    I am going to experiment further but am quite surprised by the difference.

  9. #19
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    Default Re: Achieving much better sound could be just one component away :)

    Quote Originally Posted by markie View Post
    Here's another interesting and unexpected observation by a listener which I just saw over at AudioCircle.

    He has two external hard drives (with the same music files) which he has fed into his Bryston digital player via USB. They sound different, with one much preferred. The question is, why would this be so? Not sure just yet. His post is below.

    [/I]
    The guy is hallucinating. Identical digital data is being passed from each hard drive to his DAC.

  10. #20
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    Default Re: Achieving much better sound could be just one component away :)

    Quote Originally Posted by GirgleMirt View Post

    I'd bet a thousand bucks that in a DBT test, a listener couldn't tell the difference between the same mix played on a vinyl pressing vs a WAV file with added snaps/crackles/pops & EQ'd as to match the vinyl+turntable FR aberrations.
    [/I].
    There are too many generalizations being thrown about in this thread. The debates about 'vinyl/analog' vs' 'digital' happen all too frequently with the threads often turning into a 'us' against 'them' (..not saying that happens in this forum, but other forums it does..).

    Referring to anyone as foolish and snobbish for enjoying and preferring the vinyl format to digital is itself a rather snobbish statement (just as any person who prefers vinyl looking down on a person who is all digital is snobbish).

    The quoted statement above does not take into account 'mastering' differences between different versions of albums (the same mix, but different mastering and possibly different source tapes were used if it was originally an analog recording).

    I have a vast collection of both vinyl and digital music (CDs, SACDs, DVD-As, BDs, and some downloads). I do not think vinyl is superior to digital or vice versa, but I do have many albums where the best mastering is the vinyl version. In these cases, the vinyl versions typically are not nearly as compressed as the CD or other digital versions. The statement about adding EQ to a digital version to match the vinyl and adding 'crackles and pops' would not account for any dynamic range compression differences. Those can't be undone.

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