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Thread: Controversial .... Why Spend $1,500 ona Receiver???

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
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    111

    Default Controversial .... Why Spend $1,500 ona Receiver???

    Hi there,

    I have been talking to people quite a lot and still don't have an answer to my question about receivers vs Amps, etc

    At the moment I am a bit confused. I already spent $3,000 on upgrading my
    home theater. Got the new Front and rear speakers as well as a Sub.

    My system.
    A/V Receiver - Yamaha rx-v465
    L/R - Ascend Sierra-1 NrT
    Center - Ascend Sierra-1 NrT
    Surrounds - Ascend HTM-200
    Sub - Rythmik F12
    TV - Panasonic TH50PX60U (50' Plasma)
    Blu-ray/DVD - Samsung BD 6000

    Room is 13x18 with 8.5 ceiling. Do 70% movies, 30% music.

    Now, people are saying that my receiver is killing the sound that my new
    speakers and sub can actually produce.

    One says .... get cheap receiver and buy Amp like Emotiva XPA-5. Total cost
    around $1,400 spent.

    My friend though tells me that separates is now too much hassle and if I
    want to keep it simple and not become a pro at this but get best possible
    sound from my current set up .. get a Yamaha RX-A2020 ($1,500) or Yamaha
    RX-A2010 ($900). He says ... it's all about quality of components, amp and
    features. He swears by the Avantage series of Yamaha and says Yamaha
    RX-A2010 is all I need.

    Now .... in order to find a solution, one has to first list a problem. My
    problem with current receiver ....

    1) Dialog is not as clear as I want it to be. I read that Yamaha RX-A2020
    has a new feature called "Dialog Level Adjustment". The A2010 doesn't have
    it. I read that this solves my problem.

    2) Seems like a receiver has lower THD. .. 0.06.

    3) I feel like better room correction technology may fix some issues I have
    with my current room. (bare walls, sound bouncing off, etc, etc.)

    4) "4K Pass-through & 4K Upscaling" is present on the RX-A2020 model. I am
    always for better picture.

    5) Sound quality .... they say Yamaha does great in that department.

    I don't care about zones, and I run only a 5.1ch system now. Don't plan on
    upgrading any time soon.

    So .... a bit frustrated and confused. Go, cheaper 2-3 year old receiver +
    Emotiva XPA-3 or -5 vs Yamaha RX-V2020 / 2010 or Marantz SR5007 ?

    Any feedback is much appreciated.

    thanks.

    P.S. I am not trying to build an all pro system. I am OK with upgrading my
    receiver every 6-7 years. Just want to get best sound possible for music
    and movies from my new gear.
    A/V Receiver - Denon AVR 4311ci
    L/R - Ascend Sierra-1 NrT
    Center - Ascend Sierra-1 NrT
    Surrounds - Ascend HTM-200
    Sub - Rythmik F12
    TV - Sharp LC-80LE650U 80-inch
    Screen - 135" STR-169135-G Silver Ticket 4K Ultra HD Ready
    Projector - Epson Home Cinema 3100 1080p
    SACD Player - Sony C222ES

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
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    Manhattan Beach, California
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    6,269

    Default Re: Controversial .... Why Spend $1,500 ona Receiver???

    Can you show us a picture of your setup?

    Dialog not as clear as you want it has me puzzled. To me, chances are it is a positioning problem.

    Lower THD is probably not going to be audible.

    4K pass-through and upscaling require that your display is a 4K display.

    Room correction will only do so much, so it is good for us to a pic of it.

    You may have posted a pic before, if so, I missed it.
    -curtis

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    111

    Default Re: Controversial .... Why Spend $1,500 ona Receiver???

    The thing is .... some movies dialog sounds awesome ... clear, crisp, and some .... sound effects overpower making me add just a little more volume on dialog scenes and then go a bit lower in volume with shooting starts.

    room is 13x18 with 8.5 ceiling. I sit about 8 feet away from TV.




    From the side .... but I already change stands to be shorter
    A/V Receiver - Denon AVR 4311ci
    L/R - Ascend Sierra-1 NrT
    Center - Ascend Sierra-1 NrT
    Surrounds - Ascend HTM-200
    Sub - Rythmik F12
    TV - Sharp LC-80LE650U 80-inch
    Screen - 135" STR-169135-G Silver Ticket 4K Ultra HD Ready
    Projector - Epson Home Cinema 3100 1080p
    SACD Player - Sony C222ES

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Manhattan Beach, California
    Posts
    6,269

    Default Re: Controversial .... Why Spend $1,500 ona Receiver???

    Is the back of the center channel right up against the TV? Are you using a Q-plug in it?

    So it isn't that dialog is unclear, but drowned out?

    Your room is about the same size as mine....well, maybe not...mine is 19x15.
    Last edited by curtis; 09-26-2012 at 02:08 PM.
    -curtis

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    111

    Default Re: Controversial .... Why Spend $1,500 ona Receiver???

    Yea, while I moves my left and right speakers away from the wall ... my center is almost touching my TV. I am not using Q plug ins. Should I do that for my center???
    A/V Receiver - Denon AVR 4311ci
    L/R - Ascend Sierra-1 NrT
    Center - Ascend Sierra-1 NrT
    Surrounds - Ascend HTM-200
    Sub - Rythmik F12
    TV - Sharp LC-80LE650U 80-inch
    Screen - 135" STR-169135-G Silver Ticket 4K Ultra HD Ready
    Projector - Epson Home Cinema 3100 1080p
    SACD Player - Sony C222ES

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Manhattan Beach, California
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    Default Re: Controversial .... Why Spend $1,500 ona Receiver???

    Quote Originally Posted by Pianist718 View Post
    Yea, while I moves my left and right speakers away from the wall ... my center is almost touching my TV. I am not using Q plug ins. Should I do that for my center???
    For the center, Q-plug A for sure.

    For the left and right, in that small of a room, I would try Q-plug B.
    -curtis

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    111

    Default Re: Controversial .... Why Spend $1,500 ona Receiver???

    I understand the Q plug for center, but for left and right to??? what do these things do to the sound?
    A/V Receiver - Denon AVR 4311ci
    L/R - Ascend Sierra-1 NrT
    Center - Ascend Sierra-1 NrT
    Surrounds - Ascend HTM-200
    Sub - Rythmik F12
    TV - Sharp LC-80LE650U 80-inch
    Screen - 135" STR-169135-G Silver Ticket 4K Ultra HD Ready
    Projector - Epson Home Cinema 3100 1080p
    SACD Player - Sony C222ES

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Manhattan Beach, California
    Posts
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    Default Re: Controversial .... Why Spend $1,500 ona Receiver???

    Quote Originally Posted by Pianist718 View Post
    I understand the Q plug for center, but for left and right to??? what do these things do to the sound?
    The description of the Q Plugs explains it....

    http://forum.ascendacoustics.com/showthread.php?t=3781

    The Q Plug A for your center will really help with the issues you are having during special effects IMO.
    -curtis

  9. #9
    Join Date
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    Default Re: Controversial .... Why Spend $1,500 ona Receiver???

    Quote Originally Posted by Pianist718 View Post
    The thing is.... some movies dialog sounds awesome ... clear, crisp, and some .... sound effects overpower making me add just a little more volume on dialog scenes and then go a bit lower in volume with shooting starts.
    This is actually a common issue with home theater and it is not attibuted to the speakers (unless the speakers have poor dynamic range). Just like CD's -- some movies are mixed well and others are not -- effects are sometimes just too hot and overpower dialogue.

    Many receivers and DVD players now have some form of dynamic range control (DRC, or also called nightmode). This reduces the dynamic range of those effects and thus often dramatically helps with dialogue intelligibility during those action scenes. I use this all the time for movies.

    Based on your positioning of the center, Q-Plug A will definitely improve overall center channel clarity but your best option, based on what you have just decribed is to enable/disable dynamic range control for those movies where the special effects are just too overpowering...
    .
    .
    .
    Good Sound To You!

    David Fabrikant
    www.ascendacoustics.com

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    111

    Default Re: Controversial .... Why Spend $1,500 ona Receiver???

    Quote Originally Posted by davef View Post
    This is actually a common issue with home theater and it is not attibuted to the speakers (unless the speakers have poor dynamic range). Just like CD's -- some movies are mixed well and others are not -- effects are sometimes just too hot and overpower dialogue.

    Many receivers and DVD players now have some form of dynamic range control (DRC, or also called nightmode). This reduces the dynamic range of those effects and thus often dramatically helps with dialogue intelligibility during those action scenes. I use this all the time for movies.

    Based on your positioning of the center, Q-Plug A will definitely improve overall center channel clarity but your best option, based on what you have just decribed is to enable/disable dynamic range control for those movies where the special effects are just too overpowering...

    good point. I have that option on my Samsung BluRay player. Should have enabled it yesterday but wanted to get the full effect of my Rythmik F12 for that movie.

    thanks guys
    A/V Receiver - Denon AVR 4311ci
    L/R - Ascend Sierra-1 NrT
    Center - Ascend Sierra-1 NrT
    Surrounds - Ascend HTM-200
    Sub - Rythmik F12
    TV - Sharp LC-80LE650U 80-inch
    Screen - 135" STR-169135-G Silver Ticket 4K Ultra HD Ready
    Projector - Epson Home Cinema 3100 1080p
    SACD Player - Sony C222ES

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