Holy Crap!

[greggle31]

I just got my speakers! The 170 se is soooo much bigger than I thought! Im starting to question using it as a rear lol Do these omnimounts really hold them???

[Kingrsl]

LOL-I know the feeling. I made some mockups from the specs listed. I think my wife is in for quite a shock moving up from the **** cubes we had on the walls. 340's up front and 170's in the rear. My speakers arrive tomorrow! Let me know how the mounting goes. I take it that finding a stud and using wood screws would be better for drywall? I purchased the Omnimounts as well.

[greggle31]

I may return the mounts and make some shelves, they are really big lol Definitly need a stud no matter what in my opinion, these things are beefy. Everything is at least 50 percent heavier than i was thinking. Very well made very solid. The UPS guy was throwing thr boxes around and i got upset, but now that i see what was inside i realize he'd need a sledgehammer to do any damage. lol Im in the middle of setting them up now, everything is really insane so far. Center is also wayyyy big and heavy lol may need a wall mount for that too.

[leon55]

I have the 170's mounted in rear with the omnimounts. You have to hit a stud and is very hard to tighten the allen screw, not much room. Good luck, but worth the effort.

[audibleconnoisseur]

If the 170's don't work with your setup and WAF, consider the HTM200's. They are a sealed box design so they need no clearance and are about 1/2 the size of the CBM's @ ~ 11" x 6.5" x 6.5". Also, something I am going to do b/c of WAF and so it looks better, is to actually cut a hole in the wall and place the speakers inside of that hole, where they are near flush with the wall. This will allow a better, cleaner look and will not degrade the sound (as agreed by James @ Ascend) as they are enclosed structure. I will let you know how it goes. I may have to use the mounts though b/c I have to tilt them down and in to have them sound the best for my LP (corner to corner). Hope this suggestion helps if WAF is 'unacceptable' with them. DON'T attempt this with the 170's or 340's though... they need 3"/8" minimum, respectively!

What's up Leon55!? I get them in Friday and am ready to set them up. I have since installed nice AR threaded banana plugs (very nice set for money) and cleaned up the wires even more, drilling holes and wiring them through my EU so you can't see them now. Sub wire and telephone wires are gone visually and b/t the baseboard and the carpet! Anyway, will have you over again if you can come back down and we can run another few tests with yours v/s mine, once broken in, on the Pio-81, Den-2807, HK 645 & my Den-1905! What do you think?

[BradJudy]

The Omnimounts do indeed hold the 170s, but make sure you mount them correctly (there is a top and bottom to the Omnimount) and tighten them good. I've been using the Omnis with 170 rears for years.

[leon55]

God, how do you get all this equipment? The cc or bb people see you coming and they start running. lol. I would like to hear the new Denon and Pio-81, I'm trying to decide if I want to try the Emotiva or Outlaw amp with my setup. Maybe you can snag an amp with the other equipment, ha. Yeah, we can do that sometime. Let me know.

[audibleconnoisseur]

Leon55,

If you can find me a location that has both of these and is willing to provide a 30 days, no questions asked return policy... I might go pick them up for you to hear! Certain won't hurt me to hear them either I suppose. I have two buyers for my Denon 1905 at $300-$350 so I will sell if I am satisfied with what I hear enough to make the change. I don't have a need to and according to Dave F., we are not necessarily near the "referenc level" of the Denon just b/c the volume is at +/- 0! This being said, he says I have more than enough power to push the 340's and 200's with so I really have no need to change. He explained certain reasons why or why not so I am listening to him about this. I am sure I am bugging the $hi_ out him but I need to know so I can and will never say "What IF!?"

Thanks again Dave for the time last night, I DO value your input. For others out there, do you have anything or can you post anything about the receivers and power and current, etc that would best explain what we talked about last night? I think it would help a lot of people who are not thinking to ask, or who won't ask to discuss the issue of 80W/ch v/s 100 or 100 or 125W/ch debate that continues to thrive out there. Also, you were telling me that the difference in the two was not as substantial for the purposes of cleaner and clearer sound (if I am recalling correctly) as much as one would think. I know that hearing and sound is subjective to our personal taste and preference but shedding light on the why to get a bigger amp for headroom v/s why we may not need bigger amp or more W/ch when our 80W/ch like my Denon 1905 is capable of outputting. Also the best way to tell if we are getting too close to the clipping arena or about to push the speakers to their limits. I feel with what I have I can't do this but I just want others to know as well that we are safe if we do not do "X."

[Gov]

Yes, I would love to hear more from others in reference to what Audible Con posted about.

BTW Audible, your choice in font and color is killin my eyes!!!!!!

[davef]

Hi Audible,

In reference to some of your questions:

* Power has nothing to do with sound quality within the limits of the amplifier's capability.

* More power = greater headroom at loud volumes. At normal listening levels, provided everything else is the same, a 50 watt/ch denon will sound the same as a 1000 watt/ch denon -- provided they use the same amplification and pre-amplification circuitry.

* It requires twice the power for each 3dB more of output. The 340SE has a sensitivity rating of 92dB per 1 watt at 1 meter in a typical room. This means, at only watt of power, a single 340SE will deliver 92dB of output if you are seated 1 meter back (subtract 6dB for 2 meters back) 92dB is LOUD.

2w = 95dB
4w = 98dB
8w = 101dB
16w = 104dB
32w = 107dB
64w = 110dB
128w = 113dB
256w = 116dB

As you can see, at even a clean 64 watts, the 340SE is capable of 110dB output -- that is a single speaker and this is far louder than I would recommend anyone to listen at.

What is more realistic, at normal to loud listening levels, your amplifier will be producing an average of about 1-2 watts of power. Music typically has 12dB peaks (sometimes higher) and it is these peaks in the source material that demand power capability. If you are listening at 2 watts, a 12dB peak will instantaneously demand 32 watts. If the receiver does not have the capability to handle this peak, the peak will either be slightly compressed or clipped (which will sound distorted).

The problem with most receivers today is that many exaggerate their power ratings, wattage is the # 1 marketing gimmick for audio electronics. The difference in capability between an 80 watt receiver and 100 watt is about 1dB of additional headroom -- that is not audible yet they will charge a nice premium for that extra 20 watts. Even worse, I have personally seen receivers that use the exact same power supply and output transistors but 1 might be rated at 80w and the other rated at 100w, even though they both deliver the same power. One is conservatively rated while the other is rated optimistically.

In my opinion, provided the receiver has a minimum wattage rating of 50 watts RMS per channel, features and sound quality should be the deciding factor when choosing a receiver -- not the power rating.

Hope this helps