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Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Hi all,
I've ordered a pair of Sierra-2s last week- really excited to get them. I'm very much a beginner in this audiophile world, but I've been reading a lot and listening to different setups whenever I get a chance. But I still feel like I have no idea what I'm doing. To describe my level of novice: my current setup is a PS Audio Sprout, KEF Q100s, a Rega P1 turntable, and a Sonos Connect unit for streaming digital. The room is 8x15 (I live in an open floor plan rowhouse). I have the Sierra-2s on order, as I mentioned, as well as a completely overhauled Thorens TD-160 Super turntable from Vinyl Nirvana. I do not expect to use this system for anything but vinyl or digital streaming- likely as a 2.0 system with the potential for adding a sub down the road.
While I love the Sprout, I'm a little worried it's going to be underpowered to handle the Sierra-2s and have been researching potential replacements. While I've read lots about the benefits of using separate components, but I'm pretty set on an integrated. In particular, an integrated amp with a nice phono stage. A DAC would be nice as well, but it's not imperative- I can use the built-in DAC on the Sonos. The benefit is that this limits my options, but I still feel a little bit lost. I've read about the options offered from Rogue, Peachtree, Roksan, Parasound, Rotel, Croft, and Creek among many others. I'm most intrigued by the new Peachtree Nova150 and Rogue Audio Sphinx V2 at the moment, but I'm open to all options.
I've tried to make my way through the Sierra-2 forum and looked for other thoughts online, but I haven't seem much on integrated amplifier recommendations for the Sierra-2s.
My top end budget is around $2k (but hopefully a fair amount less). And I'm perfectly fine with pre-owned, demos, and b-stock. Does anybody have any suggestions? Or experience with any of the models I mentioned above?
Thanks in advance for any thoughts you have. And happy new year!
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
I don't own / haven't owned any of the brands you mention, but have read good things about Rogue, Parasound and Creek Gear.
I have S2's and am using a Plinius 9100 to drive them. Very highly rated in the day, and I got a good deal on a pristine used model.
While there are pros/cons to separates vs. integrated amps, I feel the latter is less fuss in terms of hookup, matching of gear, etc.
Previously had a Yamaha integrated, and it sounded pretty good. You may want to hold off on new gear purchase, as you might be pretty happy with the sound you get from your current set up. The S2's are a huge step up in sound quality.
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Thanks Jaybeez- really appreciate your comments. And glad to hear others in the same space as me with separates v integrated. And thanks for the reminder that I won't know until I hear the speakers in my system. I can't wait to get t he S-2s and test them out with the Sprout.
The one thing I forgot to add in my original post was that I also have a pair of Hifiman HE-400i headphones that I like to use at night. I'd say the headphone amp is probably the weakest part of the Sprout- clear, but not very musical. So, that will be a consideration- if the S-2s sound good with the Sprout, I may get a decent Headphone amp to hold me over.
Any other thoughts on Integrateds welcome! I went down a rabbit hole looking at reviews of the Roksan K3 last night- it looks really interesting. Will look at reviews of the Plinius as well.
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Thanks for the suggestion, Ben. I really like the looks of Schiit stuff, but the lack of phono stage in the Ragnarok is a deal breaker for me. After some additional reading, I also think am partial to Class D Amplification, mostly for the efficiency and lack of heat- and since Class D sound has apparently improved immensely over the years, I feel comfortable with the trade-off. So, refining and simplifying a bit, my request:
Recommendations for Class D Integrated amplifier with quality phono and headphone stages that can sufficiently power the Sierra-2s and take advantage of the RAAL tweeter for under $2k.
Thanks again for your responses!
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2 Attachment(s)
Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Parasound Halo Integrated will cover all your requirements. Very good phono stage, very good quality DAC, a lot of power and incredible analog bass management. I have a Parasound Halo P5 + Emotiva XPA-3 that I use only for 2.1 music listening and it sounds awesome.
http://www.parasound.com/hint.php
Attachment 1404
Attachment 1405
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
You could always go with this thing:
https://www.amazon.com/Pioneer-SX-N3...EBK6VZTM6TJNPQ
And get for your Preamp for phono here:
http://schiit.com/products/mani
Puts you well under 2k and the Pioneer has good reviews.
Or do what Enrico did with the P5 and the XPA. That would be a killer combo.
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Hi all and happy new years eve!
I am pretty focused on class d now, so it appears the Parasound is out for me, being (I think) an AB amp. The Pioneer looks interesting. I didn't realize they were building class d amps/receivers. Searching around there site, I found a fully integrated receiver with phono and dac for $1000:
https://www.amazon.com/Pioneer-SC-LX...words=SC-LX501
It has many more features than I need, and I can't find any info about the phono stage, but I'm intrigued. Given my focus on Class D, I've narrowed my choices (for now) down to Rogue (Sphinx, or if I can get some kind of lucky deal, Pharoah), Peachtree (Nova150), or that Pioneer. Anyone have any experience with these? I know Rogue has a great reputation for phono stages, but not sure about the Peachtree or the Pioneer.
Thanks again for everyone's suggestions. It's been really helpful to hear from folks using the S-2s!
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Hey man,
Well, if you are personally interested in the Pioneer Elite, I can assure you, it is a great receiver. I have the SC-65 from a couple years ago. I love it. Took some time to get the MCACC to my liking (run MCACC with the FRONT ALIGN setting). But, after some tweaks, my CBM-170's and Rhythmik F12 sound amazing. I recommend the Elite you are thinking about. Mine, like I said, has been working well over the last 4 years on a daily basis.
Hope this helps.
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
I remember listening to a Home Theater Geeks episode about this amplifier.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=AZw-PZFpcxw
Performance-wise I think this amplifier might be though to beat. I really sounds similar to what Rythmik is trying to do with their subwoofers, but in a completely different way. How much of this is audible I have no idea. It is also over budget. But, if I were looking to control heat, have as much efficiency as possible and yet still have the goal of a class A sound, this is what I would be looking closely at.
https://benchmarkmedia.com/products/...ower-amplifier
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
I'd go with the Peachtree. A friend of mine has one with some CBM 340's and loves the combination.
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Hi all,
Thanks again for all of your input. While the parasound really does have all the features under the sun and I like the idea of room correction in the pioneer, I ended up ordering a demo unit of the Peachtree Audio Nova150- it has all of the features I'm looking for right now, has been getting great reviews, and I got a good deal. I'm pretty excited- will post back here with impressions once I have some time with it.
Cheers,
Chris
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Interesting, 2x150W and ICEPower Class-D. Please do report how it sounds with the Sierra 2.
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
I haven't ordered my S2s yet, but I'll be using them with a Pioneer Elite VSX-30 and I think it's great. I do have an external phono stage but otherwise it works very well. I use it for my turntable, TV, laserdisc player, and I've used it with my Xbox 360.
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Quote:
Originally Posted by
chrisdavid
Hi all,
I've ordered a pair of Sierra-2s last week- really excited to get them. I'm very much a beginner in this audiophile world, but I've been reading a lot and listening to different setups whenever I get a chance. But I still feel like I have no idea what I'm doing. To describe my level of novice: my current setup is a PS Audio Sprout, KEF Q100s, a Rega P1 turntable, and a Sonos Connect unit for streaming digital. The room is 8x15 (I live in an open floor plan rowhouse). I have the Sierra-2s on order, as I mentioned, as well as a completely overhauled Thorens TD-160 Super turntable from Vinyl Nirvana. I do not expect to use this system for anything but vinyl or digital streaming- likely as a 2.0 system with the potential for adding a sub down the road.
While I love the Sprout, I'm a little worried it's going to be underpowered to handle the Sierra-2s and have been researching potential replacements. While I've read lots about the benefits of using separate components, but I'm pretty set on an integrated. In particular, an integrated amp with a nice phono stage. A DAC would be nice as well, but it's not imperative- I can use the built-in DAC on the Sonos. The benefit is that this limits my options, but I still feel a little bit lost. I've read about the options offered from Rogue, Peachtree, Roksan, Parasound, Rotel, Croft, and Creek among many others. I'm most intrigued by the new Peachtree Nova150 and Rogue Audio Sphinx V2 at the moment, but I'm open to all options.
I've tried to make my way through the Sierra-2 forum and looked for other thoughts online, but I haven't seem much on integrated amplifier recommendations for the Sierra-2s.
My top end budget is around $2k (but hopefully a fair amount less). And I'm perfectly fine with pre-owned, demos, and b-stock. Does anybody have any suggestions? Or experience with any of the models I mentioned above?
Thanks in advance for any thoughts you have. And happy new year!
Parasound integrated is amp preamp and ess dac. As well a very good adjustable phonostage. And many other features in my opinion way better that the class d peachtrees. Plus the fact it's a John Curl designed amp and pre is awesome. In the review it drove Maggie's 3.7 with woofer compo had no problem. Probably the best amp for your situation. Also the new Yamaha integrateds are awesome I'm not talking about the Yamaha 801 I'm talking about the 2000'and 2100. I have the A-S2000 it's awesome a fifty pound beast. Another I would suggest is Pathos Inpol which I have not cheap but so sweet. . Also look at pathos classic and Primare excellent Integrateds. I also own Sierra 2's they are fabulous. Good luck have fun! That's what this is all about.
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wadia171i
Parasound integrated is amp preamp and ess dac. As well a very good adjustable phonostage. And many other features in my opinion way better that the class d peachtrees. Plus the fact it's a John Curl designed amp and pre is awesome. In the review it drove Maggie's 3.7 with woofer compo had no problem. Probably the best amp for your situation. Also the new Yamaha integrateds are awesome I'm not talking about the Yamaha 801 I'm talking about the 2000'and 2100. I have the A-S2000 it's awesome a fifty pound beast. Another I would suggest is Pathos Inpol which I have not cheap but so sweet. . Also look at pathos classic and Primare excellent Integrateds. I also own Sierra 2's they are fabulous. Good luck have fun! That's what this is all about.
There is a slightly used Halo Integrated on US Audio Mart for $1,900..FWIW, the amp section of Halo Integrated is better than A23 but not to the level of A21, but the DAC section is better than P5..
As far as Peachtree, I am not a fan, have seem quite a few cases of reliability issues with their previous gen of Decca and Nova and their new Nova300 and 150 seems to be a bit overpriced..
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Quote:
Originally Posted by
justthinking
There is a slightly used Halo Integrated on US Audio Mart for $1,900..FWIW, the amp section of Halo Integrated is better than A23 but not to the level of A21, but the DAC section is better than P5..
As far as Peachtree, I am not a fan, have seem quite a few cases of reliability issues with their previous gen of Decca and Nova and their new Nova300 and 150 seems to be a bit overpriced..
I agree with justthinking I owned a nova 125 the USB input quite working. And the pole piece out of the volume pot was to short and the volume knob would get loose constantly and fall of periodically. Sold it. The parasound is awesome piece heard it on a pair harbeth hl5 plus it was sweet. Also I bought mine from Best Buy it had no serial number. So when I called peachtree about repair it was a mess needless to say.
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
I run my computer speakers on Wyred4Sound mINT. Small form factor, plenty of juice.
As to the sound of amplifiers, I believe all solid state amplifiers sound the same unless distortion is introduced intentionally by the designer.
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bkdc
I run my computer speakers on Wyred4Sound mINT. Small form factor, plenty of juice.
As to the sound of amplifiers, I believe all solid state amplifiers sound the same unless distortion is introduced intentionally by the designer.
I am definitely not making a comment on that. Enjoy the Wyred4Sound. Just giving recommendations that's all. All the best.
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
I wouldn't rule out a class A/B just over heat and power usage. I run my towers with an SA-250, 250w per channel 8ohm / 400 per into 4ohm class A/B. I have ran it for a couple years with 4ohm towers and now the sierra towers and it barely gets warm even after long periods of high volume listening. My Pre-pro actually gets warmer to the touch than the amp does.
Actually I just checked it, its been running for 13 hours straight, lower volumes for the last hour since the wife went to bed and you can't even tell it's on by touching it. :cool:
An Emotiva Stealth DC-1 and XPA-Gen3 would be a very nice combo if you don't need HDMI support. The Gen3 is using the amp blades from their previous very pricy flagship XPR line and are supposed to be excellent. It's class H also so very efficient and it's modular so you can start with two channels and add more later if you want to expand :)
I know you said you're ok with using the sonos DAC but if you listen to a lot of digital music the DAC is the second most important part of the entire setup behind the speakers. Sierras are good enough speakers that a good DAC will be noticeable over an onboard chip, much more so than spending more on a pricier amp.
GL with your search!
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Quote:
Originally Posted by
rneill
I wouldn't rule out a class A/B just over heat and power usage. I run my towers with an SA-250, 250w per channel 8ohm / 400 per into 4ohm class A/B. I have ran it for a couple years with 4ohm towers and now the sierra towers and it barely gets warm even after long periods of high volume listening. My Pre-pro actually gets warmer to the touch than the amp does.
Actually I just checked it, its been running for 13 hours straight, lower volumes for the last hour since the wife went to bed and you can't even tell it's on by touching it. :cool:
An Emotiva Stealth DC-1 and XPA-Gen3 would be a very nice combo if you don't need HDMI support. The Gen3 is using the amp blades from their previous very pricy flagship XPR line and are supposed to be excellent. It's class H also so very efficient and it's modular so you can start with two channels and add more later if you want to expand :)
I know you said you're ok with using the sonos DAC but if you listen to a lot of digital music the DAC is the second most important part of the entire setup behind the speakers. Sierras are good enough speakers that a good DAC will be noticeable over an onboard chip, much more so than spending more on a pricier amp.
GL with your search!
Agree totally with rneill. I believe you can do better than a sonos. And I would have a lesser amp and a better dac, cdplayer/dac combo. The source is very important imho. In my bedroom system I use a Mac mini with oppo 105 and Audirvana software with all hdmi and video switching off. So it's basically streamlined for music. Sounds incredible with the S2's.
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wadia171i
I am definitely not making a comment on that. Enjoy the Wyred4Sound. Just giving recommendations that's all. All the best.
The only way to prove it is to run level-matched blinded tests. But these have already been done. No audio/stereo magazine will ever assert the claim that human ears cannot differentiate between/among solid state amplifiers which are driven well within their specified parameters. Why? It would send an entire sector of businesses out of business (including the advertising revenue for the magazine). But I will say it. Modern solid-state audio amplifiers that are designed for a flat response (not intentional coloring/distortion) that are driven well within their power limitations/specs sound the same. Or they are so similar that when tested on large group of self-proclaimed audiophiles, 50:50 is the typical score. They are TRANSPARENT. The theoretical differences will not pan out in a blinded level-matched testing situation. That is not to say your particular ears are super-human and better than the panels of audiophiles who have failed to prove a difference.
The change in sound due to room acoustics comb filtering by moving your speakers 2 inches to either side will be more than the change from swapping out any modern well designed solid state amplifier with another one.
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bkdc
The only way to prove it is to run level-matched blinded tests. But these have already been done. No audio/stereo magazine will ever assert the claim that human ears cannot differentiate between/among solid state amplifiers which are driven well within their specified parameters. Why? It would send an entire sector of businesses out of business (including the advertising revenue for the magazine). But I will say it. Modern solid-state audio amplifiers that are designed for a flat response (not intentional coloring/distortion) that are driven well within their power limitations/specs sound the same. Or they are so similar that when tested on large group of self-proclaimed audiophiles, 50:50 is the typical score. They are TRANSPARENT. The theoretical differences will not pan out in a blinded level-matched testing situation. That is not to say your particular ears are super-human and better than the panels of audiophiles who have failed to prove a difference.
The change in sound due to room acoustics comb filtering by moving your speakers 2 inches to either side will be more than the change from swapping out any modern well designed solid state amplifier with another one.
Sounds good to me. I'm happy with my choices and glad you are too:)
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
You may want to take a serious look at Belle's Aira Integrated amplifier US made and extremely well built and musical. Very tube like but with a punch.
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Menosavvy
You may want to take a serious look at Belle's Aira Integrated amplifier US made and extremely well built and musical. Very tube like but with a punch.
Having trouble finding this, can you provide a link?
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Thanks. Since this is an analog only design you would have to factor in a high quality outboard DAC for digital sources.
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mag_Neato
Thanks. Since this is an analog only design you would have to factor in a high quality outboard DAC for digital sources.
That isn't always the case. I am using an Oppo 203 UHD universal player with the Aria just fine.
I use an analog interconnect pair of cables going from the Oppo to the ARIA. HDMI from the Oppo to my TV. I have Clearaudio concept turntable that has a MM cartridge and the ARIA has the phono stage for it. This set up is really remarkable!
It's just that external DAC's are not ALWAYS needed, and certainly not a "need" when considering this outstanding integrated.
My 2 cents
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Menosavvy
That isn't always the case. I am using an Oppo 203 UHD universal player with the Aria just fine.
I use an analog interconnect pair of cables going from the Oppo to the ARIA. HDMI from the Oppo to my TV. I have Clearaudio concept turntable that has a MM cartridge the ARIA has the phono stage for it.
I personally don't want multi channels
It's just that external DAC's are not ALWAYS needed, and certainly not a "need" when considering this outstanding integrated.
My 2 cents
You're using the DAC in the Oppo. Buying an Oppo is kinda like buying a standalone DAC that happens to read discs too :)
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Menosavvy
That isn't always the case. I am using an Oppo 203 UHD universal player with the Aria just fine.
I use an analog interconnect pair of cables going from the Oppo to the ARIA. HDMI from the Oppo to my TV. I have Clearaudio concept turntable that has a MM cartridge the ARIA has the phono stage for it.
I personally don't want multi channels
It's just that external DAC's are not ALWAYS needed, and certainly not a "need" when considering this outstanding integrated.
My 2 cents
His point still stands. You are using the Oppo as an Outboard DAC. Not very many blu-ray players come with Analog outputs these days. He's just saying to make sure there is something outputting analog to the amp.
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
I get your point, but any quality player ( I think Oppo are the most musical) that has a quality internal DAC should suffice.
I was only stating that one doesn't need to always have an external DAC , and its not necessary with this amp depending on how it is set up and with what other components. Separately, I would contend the Oppo 203 is not your average disc reader as you put it either. Just sayin ��
Again, I believe that anyone looking at this amp probably has a quality DVD player that has an onboard DAC that should play just fine, and not REQUIRE the cost of an external DAC when considering this amp.
No worries
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Ah, yes.....onboard DACs will work for content played through that device (Oppo player, etc.), but if you play streamed content from Tidal or similar you would want a good DAC to decode that before sending to the Aria, no? All my music listening at this point is basically TIDAL Hi-Fi decoded by the internal DACs of my Marantz AVR.
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
I surrender! LOL
Yes, in cases like this you would need one. I have never used my USB ports on the back of my OPPO for such from hdtracks.com etc connected to my laptop, so I cannot comment. My other Blu ray players did not have such.
Either way..... This Aria amp is still VERY much worth an audition!!! That I stand by. This company makes the real deal and at a great price and sounds phenomenal with my Sierra 2's!
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Hi. You might also want to take a look into the following:
Cambridge Audio CXA60
Rega Brio
Emotiva TA-100
Sony TAA1ES
If you intend to add Sub(s) into your setup you might want to consider an integrated amplifier with the capability of actively crossing over to a sub, so as not to waste its limited power on amplifying the lower frequencies which can not be reproduced by your speakers (as I would with or without subs):
Bluesound Powernode 2
Elac Element EA101EQ-G
NAD D 7050
Best regards.
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Menosavvy
I surrender! LOL
This Aria amp is still VERY much worth an audition!!! That I stand by. This company makes the real deal and at a great price and sounds phenomenal with my Sierra 2's!
I am hunting around for a new amp for my Sierra Raal Towers. Have been using a Hegel H80 but it's just not working - flat soundstage and a little lifeless. I tried a Rega Elex-R last night and that was definitely a step in the right direction.
So wondering what other amps you have tried with your Sierra 2's in comparison to the Belles Aria? And how would you describe the soundstage/space/air of the Aria?
Thanks!
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
You tried a Rega Elex-R with your Sierra towers? Did you make sure to match levels so that you played it at the precise same levels you played the Hegel?
I've never found a technical explanation for how one properly functioning amp can have a different soundstage from another properly functioning amp. It's usually instead due to one of two things: 1)unmatched levels 2)listener subconscious affecting what the brain 'thinks' it's hearing.
Level matched, unsighted comparisons will probably show that what seem to be differences in soundstage between two amps actually disappear when those variables are controlled.
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Beave
You tried a Rega Elex-R with your Sierra towers? Did you make sure to match levels so that you played it at the precise same levels you played the Hegel?
I've never found a technical explanation for how one properly functioning amp can have a different soundstage from another properly functioning amp. It's usually instead due to one of two things: 1)unmatched levels 2)listener subconscious affecting what the brain 'thinks' it's hearing.
Level matched, unsighted comparisons will probably show that what seem to be differences in soundstage between two amps actually disappear when those variables are controlled.
I have also been of the school that all good amps will sound the same if they aren't being overdriven. But I also know that amps do have feedback systems and such that might affect the sound. Hegels in particular like to advertise their insane damping numbers - so they are doing something to try and control this, other than just plain and pure amplification of the signal.
I did not do level matching between the two amps and I fully understand that that can make all the difference. But I don't have the things necessary to quickly swap two amps in and out of a chain quickly enough to make useful A-B judgments.
I played the Rega at varying volumes and A-B'ed it against Kef LS50 Wireless - which I am using as my reference for a number of dimensions. And likewise ran the Hegel against the same reference. I am absolutely positive that there was a difference compared to the Hegel. Could it be expectation bias? Can't rule it out of course. I will try some other amps and see what else comes about ...
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
I wouldn't call the feedback in an amp a 'feedback system.' Maybe that's just semantics.
In any case, Hegel is just like most other audio manufacturers - they'll brag about some specific parametric or other and claim *that* is what makes their amp special. And many will believe it.
Damping factor is generally a non-issue with solid state a/b amps. They're all high enough that it doesn't matter. Certainly so with a speaker like the Sierra that doesn't have ridiculously low dips in its impedance. Damping factor can be an issue with tube amps and class d amps, where the output impedance is often much higher.
Keep in mind that when you're testing amps sighted and non-level matched, you're not really just testing amps - you yourself are now an uncontrolled variable in the test. You're testing yourself and your brain as much as you're testing the amps.
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Re: Integrated Amp Recommendations for Sierra-2
One big difference in amps that is seldom discussed is how the amp handles clipping. It is possible that you might be reaching the power limits of your Hegel such that it is starting to clip or that some form of compression is kicking in... Your Hegel also has quite a bit of digital signal processing - who knows what it is doing to the original source material....