(3x Horizon RAAL) vs. (Sierra 2 RAAL + Horizon RAAL)

Hi,

I was pretty gung ho about going 3x Horizon RAAL across the front stage, but an Ascend owner on AVS suggested I go with Sierra 2 RAAL for L/R and Horizon RAAL for center, saving some money for surround/sub upgrade.

Anyone do this comparison and come to a conclusion?

My room is 1,400 sq. ft., dedicated, treated, so it's small. Objectives are realism, seamless sound stage, and dynamic range. I really enjoy mid-bass slam as well, but that's not as important as the others. I'd like to position my LCR as close to the front wall as possible to make room for additional seating. 98% home theater use.

@FirstReflect, I know you've had both setups (right?), so I'd be very interested to hear your comparison. (BTW, you know who I am via AV Rant.)

I'd like to be awed by my speaker upgrade for the next 15-20 years, so I don't want to wish two years from now that I had made a different decision.

I also don't want to sink extra money into a front stage that would yield no/marginal benefit, and delay upgrading my surrounds/sub.

Thoughts appreciated, thanks!

I was going to say save some money with the S2, but then you said you want midbass slam, and that's where the Horizon and the Tower really change things. The dedicated midrange driver is a dream. I listen to a lot of death metal, so midrange slam is what I crave, and the Sierra Towers and Horizon Center offer that in spades, so I think you should go with the Horizons.

Also, since you want to place them close to the wall, going with Horizons for L/R instead of the Towers or S2 is a great idea because they are front slot ported. You can put them very close to the wall and not lose any bass accuracy or midrange clarity.

1400 sq ft room, or 1400 cubic feet room??

1400 sq ft room is certainly not small!

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Originally Posted by Beave

1400 sq ft room, or 1400 cubic feet room??

1400 sq ft room is certainly not small!

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Whoops 1,400 cu ft!

Thanks for catching that!

That's about the size of my 2 channel space (converted 3rd car garage, treated, etc.).

I have S2's and I find them plenty for my room, though am using it for music only.

Not sure what the definition of mid-bass slam is, but I found that I had to set my sub crossover to 50 hz. to keep the Sierras from competing with the sub in the mid-bass area.

I listened to everything except the Horizons when I made my decision, and if I had the $$ would have gone with the towers.

Personally, from what I know of the Horizon I think you'd be fine with the S2s and have more $$ to put into a better sub, which I think would make a bigger difference for HT.

With the current offer of free returns, you could always give the S2s a shot and upgrade if you really think you need to.

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Originally Posted by Jaybeez

Not sure what the definition of mid-bass slam is, but I found that I had to set my sub crossover to 50 hz. to keep the Sierras from competing with the sub in the mid-bass area.
....
With the current offer of free returns, you could always give the S2s a shot and upgrade if you really think you need to.

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Midbass slam: Gunshots, explosions, collisions: highly dynamic, transient, and spanning the frequency range. They sound most realistic (to me) when the mids/midbass are as clear and punchy as the bass and treble typically are.

Today, Dave told me (via Dina) that the Horizons provide the greatest midbass slam because they are slot ported in the front and will push more air towards you, compared to the S2 and Towers, which are rear ported and will push that air away from you.

He suggested 3x RAAL Horizons for my needs... It's possible that I wouldn't know what I was missing if I went with S2 RAAL instead of Horizons, but I'm also looking at these speakers as the last ones I buy (if I can manage that at this price point).

Totally read you on the sub. Upgrading the sub to two, better subs seems to be the overwhelming consensus.

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Originally Posted by sludgeogre

I was going to say save some money with the S2, but then you said you want midbass slam, and that's where the Horizon and the Tower really change things. The dedicated midrange driver is a dream. I listen to a lot of death metal, so midrange slam is what I crave, and the Sierra Towers and Horizon Center offer that in spades, so I think you should go with the Horizons.

Also, since you want to place them close to the wall, going with Horizons for L/R instead of the Towers or S2 is a great idea because they are front slot ported. You can put them very close to the wall and not lose any bass accuracy or midrange clarity.

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Thanks, sludgeorge. Those were my thoughts exactly. Some people are saying the S2 would be fine for midbass slam but I'm not understanding the physics of that; the Horizons have dedicated mids, greater total surface area, and are front ported, which should equate to more air pushed during any given transient, and more so with mids than S2 which lacks the dedicated mid driver.

Right?

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Originally Posted by TheHorizon

Thanks, sludgeorge. Those were my thoughts exactly. Some people are saying the S2 would be fine for midbass slam but I'm not understanding the physics of that; the Horizons have dedicated mids, greater total surface area, and are front ported, which should equate to more air pushed during any given transient, and more so with mids than S2 which lacks the dedicated mid driver.

Right?

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Definitely that, and also with the woofers covering up to 200 Hz, they allow the midrange to play it's band much more effortlessly and without distortion, and the woofers get to totally focus on bass, and if you cross them to a sub, they handle all of the midbass (edit here). It's the same has setting a speaker to small and running a sub really high, using it as a sub and midbass driver. Just my thoughts. You are on the right track.

I haven't heard the S2, but a couple of guys here that own the Towers/Horizon and the S2 all agree that the Towers/Horizon have more slam. The only thing is that the Horizon is designed as a center channel speaker, so it images right at you, whereas the towers feel much wider, so it'll be really intense in stereo mode. If that's what you're after, I can't imagine a better system.

On the subwoofer front I honestly think most people go way overboard with subs. I bought two Rythmik F12's and tons of people led me to believe that I'd be happier with a ported sub and I might not get all the output I'd ever desier and yadda yadda, all not true. I run my F12's at less than half power and it makes my whole giant living room/kitchen/dining room area filled with deep, rich bass, and it only cost me 1500 bucks for the pair. I've seen people spend 4k to 6k on tiny REL subs or massive SVS subs. It just doesn't make any sense to me. Like I said, I'm also after midbass slam, so I'm glad that I invested as much as I did in the towers and Horizon, as I could be happy with them running music without a sub, and sometimes do run them that way with my Bifrost DAC, although overall I would have to say I prefer them with the subs.

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Originally Posted by sludgeogre

I haven't heard the S2, but a couple of guys here that own the Towers/Horizon and the S2 all agree that the Towers/Horizon have more slam. The only thing is that the Horizon is designed as a center channel speaker, so it images right at you, whereas the towers feel much wider, so it'll be really intense in stereo mode.

...

On the subwoofer front I honestly think most people go way overboard with subs.

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Curious about your comment re: imaging of the Towers vs. the Horizons...

They share the same tweeter so their dispersion pattern should be similar, unless the Horizon's woofers are interfering with its tweeter. If nothing else, I'd imagine the Horizon's cascading driver arrangement to make its dispersion wider than the Towers.

As for imaging, you only get imaging when you have two or more speakers. Are those guys running a pair of Horizons and experiencing a narrower image than running a pair of Towers?

@davef Could you chime in on this one please?

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Originally Posted by TheHorizon

Curious about your comment re: imaging of the Towers vs. the Horizons...

They share the same tweeter so their dispersion pattern should be similar, unless the Horizon's woofers are interfering with its tweeter. If nothing else, I'd imagine the Horizon's cascading driver arrangement to make its dispersion wider than the Towers.

As for imaging, you only get imaging when you have two or more speakers. Are those guys running a pair of Horizons and experiencing a narrower image than running a pair of Towers?

@davef Could you chime in on this one please?

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Dave said this over at AVS ( http://www.avsforum.com/forum/89-spe...l#post44441529 )

"A center speaker is designed to specifically focus any of it's content dead center. It doesn't really "image" per say. Many 2-channel audio enthusiasts hate center channels as they prefer that stereo image center (which would have depth to it) as opposed to the monaural image created by the center (which does not have depth).


Our Horizon center is really an unbelievable center channel, you should not discount it because one customer ended up preferring a phantom center. That is simply personal preference and out of all the Horizons we have sold ( a LOT), the first I have ever heard of a customer preferring phantom center mode. While all of our products have very high satisfaction rates - our horizon is our highest with only 2 customer returns in 3.5 years, which is remarkable. And one of those customers, after trying many other speakers, just came back to us and has re-ordered the same products he returned. That translates to only 1 horizon customer return in 3.5 years, an honest satisfaction rate of over 99.99%, crazy good"

........

He actually only referenced the imaging when used as a center, so you actually are probably right and I probably misspoke. Dave can chime in to speak about it further. I've only used my Horizon as a center channel and I definitely agree with what Dave said, where it feels like the Horizon really puts it's content right in your face and the Towers can throw sound all around the room and behind your head. I don't know if that is because of the design of the speakers or just because the Towers are L/R channels and the Horizon is playing center channel content.

Dave has said before that he listened to the Horizons in Stereo and was blown away by them. Don't listen to me too much. I'm not that experienced in this hobby, I just love my speakers. I don't think the issue that I mentioned is a big one, and I think I used the wrong terminology. Dave will chime in soon.

So I heard the Horizon is a 2 channel setup at Ascend's offices....non-RAAL.

https://photos.smugmug.com/Other/Asc...6494882-XL.jpg

They sound great and do seem to have more slam than the Towers because of the front porting. BTW, midbass slam is in the the frequency area of around 60hz/80hz-120hz/150hz. So it is because of the front slot porting and woofers, not the dedicated midrange.

They don't quite image as well because of the orientation of the front baffle being horizontal.

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Originally Posted by curtis

So I heard the Horizon is a 2 channel setup at Ascend's offices....non-RAAL.

https://photos.smugmug.com/Other/Asc...6494882-XL.jpg

They sound great and do seem to have more slam than the Towers because of the front porting. BTW, midbass slam is in the the frequency area of around 60hz/80hz-120hz/150hz. So it is because of the front slot porting and woofers, not the dedicated midrange.

They don't quite image as well because of the orientation of the front baffle being horizontal.

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Nice, makes sense. Thank you for correcting me, totally mixing up my terminology. Derp.

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Originally Posted by curtis

https://photos.smugmug.com/Other/Asc...6494882-XL.jpg

They sound great and do seem to have more slam than the Towers because of the front porting. BTW, midbass slam is in the the frequency area of around 60hz/80hz-120hz/150hz. So it is because of the front slot porting and woofers, not the dedicated midrange.

They don't quite image as well because of the orientation of the front baffle being horizontal.

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So a mid that can play more efficiently because it's separate won't add to the slam?

If the horizontal baffle won't image as well (I'm assuming because of diffraction), then would it be better to get the tweeters rotated for mains duty?

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Originally Posted by TheHorizon

So a mid that can play more efficiently because it's separate won't add to the slam?

If the horizontal baffle won't image as well (I'm assuming because of diffraction), then would it be better to get the tweeters rotated for mains duty?

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The mid doesn't cover those slam frequencies. Midrange frequencies are around 500hz to 1khz or so there abouts.

Yes, you are right about diffraction/reflection. The tweeters are already rotated to the proper orientation when the speakers are horizontal. Imaging is not bad...it is still good, it is just that in the Tower, it is exceptional...it is an Ascend hallmark on all their speakers.

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Originally Posted by curtis

The mid doesn't cover those slam frequencies. Midrange frequencies are around 500hz to 1khz or so there abouts.

Yes, you are right about diffraction/reflection. The tweeters are already rotated to the proper orientation when the speakers are horizontal. Imaging is not bad...it is still good, it is just that in the Tower, it is exceptional...it is an Ascend hallmark on all their speakers.

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Cool. Would it be ideal to get Horizons for mains and orient them vertically with rotated tweeters?

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Originally Posted by TheHorizon

Cool. Would it be ideal to get Horizons for mains and orient them vertically with rotated tweeters?

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Ideal in what regard? I would just get the Towers.

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Originally Posted by curtis

Ideal in what regard? I would just get the Towers.

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He is limited by placement and was interested in putting the speakers nearly against the wall, so there's a lot of tradeoffs to think of here.

One of the AVRant podcast guys got the custom slim versions of the Horizon and oriented two of them vertically due to the same space constraints.

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Originally Posted by sludgeogre

He is limited by placement and was interested in putting the speakers nearly against the wall, so there's a lot of tradeoffs to think of here.

One of the AVRant podcast guys got the custom slim versions of the Horizon and oriented two of them vertically due to the same space constraints.

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Got it.
The Horizon placed vertically would then not have the ideal midrange/tweeter arrangement, which is why FirstReflect (I think it was him) got the custom slim version made.

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Originally Posted by sludgeogre

He is limited by placement and was interested in putting the speakers nearly against the wall, so there's a lot of tradeoffs to think of here.

One of the AVRant podcast guys got the custom slim versions of the Horizon and oriented two of them vertically due to the same space constraints.

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Originally Posted by curtis

Got it.
The Horizon placed vertically would then not have the ideal midrange/tweeter arrangement, which is why FirstReflect (I think it was him) got the custom slim version made.

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Thanks sludgeorge and Curtis. Yes, I have a space issue (13x12) so I want to put the fronts as close to the front wall as possible, hence the front-firing port of the Horizon being attractive.

And yes, FirstReflect was the one who got the custom Horizons. Just saw them in the photos thread.

What would be the trade off of rotating the ribbon for a vertical orientation? It should gain better dispersion, but would it suffer combing problems or something?

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Originally Posted by TheHorizon

What would be the trade off of rotating the ribbon for a vertical orientation? It should gain better dispersion, but would it suffer combing problems or something?

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The RAAL should always be vertical regardless of cabinet orientation...are you seeing it otherwise in a photo somewhere?
No combing issues.

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Originally Posted by curtis

The RAAL should always be vertical regardless of cabinet orientation...are you seeing it otherwise in a photo somewhere?
No combing issues.

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Nope, just hoping that orienting the Horizons vertically and rotating the ribbon would work.

But you're saying the tweeter/woofers wouldn't be in an optimal configuration.

Wondering what the cost would be of rotating the tweeter relative to the woofers in order to improve imagining as the result of reducing defraction/reflection?

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Originally Posted by TheHorizon

Nope, just hoping that orienting the Horizons vertically and rotating the ribbon would work.

But you're saying the tweeter/woofers wouldn't be in an optimal configuration.

Wondering what the cost would be of rotating the tweeter relative to the woofers in order to improve imagining as the result of reducing defraction/reflection?

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Turning the tweeter doesn't cost anything.

Whether the cabinet is vertical or horizontal, the tweeter is always turned/rotated so it is in the vertical position.

It is the alignment of the mid-woofer and tweeter that I think you are referring to, one on top of the other. That was the reason for the "slim" vertical Horizon. The standard "horizontal" Horizon already has the that alignment. What is not optimal, when compared to the Tower, is the width (horizontal) of the front baffle.

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Originally Posted by curtis

Turning the tweeter doesn't cost anything.

Whether the cabinet is vertical or horizontal, the tweeter is always turned/rotated so it is in the vertical position.

It is the alignment of the mid-woofer and tweeter that I think you are referring to, one on top of the other. That was the reason for the "slim" vertical Horizon. The standard "horizontal" Horizon already has the that alignment. What is not optimal, when compared to the Tower, is the width (horizontal) of the front baffle.

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Ah, I got it now. Since my issue is with room placement, could the tower be front ported?

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Originally Posted by TheHorizon

Ah, I got it now. Since my issue is with room placement, could the tower be front ported?

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That's something you can ask Dave. I would imagine, like the custom Horizons, he could do a custom Tower for the right price. Since the "slim" Horizon is already designed, that might be the best way to go...but not cheap.

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Originally Posted by TheHorizon

Ah, I got it now. Since my issue is with room placement, could the tower be front ported?

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Also, the slim Horizon should give you the same imaging as the Tower since the driver configuration is vertically aligned.

Guys, guys, guys...

I know how easy it is to get excited about Ascend's flagship speakers, believe me! haha. But I'm seeing a lot of overthinking going on here.

Let's not forget that these are going in a 12 x 13 room, so there's basically zero chance you're going to be sitting farther than 12 feet away from your Front speakers.

My current tiny apartment theater room is pretty close to the same size. I do NOT need the custom Horizon RAAL speakers that I have. I don't even come close to needing their output capabilities. The only reason I got them is because I intend to use them in a much larger room one day, and much like TheHorizon, these are my "forever" speakers, so I went ahead and got what will be appropriate for a 16 x 23 foot room with 12 and 18 foot seating distances.

But in my current, very small room, the Sierra-2 and Sierra-2 Center would easily provide all the output capability I would ever need.

There's so much concern about concert-level output levels and mid-bass slam. What exactly is the goal with this mid-bass slam? Is it to have horribly overblown, non-linear response? Of course not! The main reason mid-bass slam becomes a problem in so many setups is because it happens to fall right in the crossover region of the speakers and subwoofers. It's important to remember that even with 24dB/octave slopes, the speakers are still producing significant output down at 40Hz, and the subwoofers are still producing significant output up at 160Hz. So the entire mid-bass region ends up being played by two or more sources of sound. And all of that sound wave interaction is the reason so many people's setups end up either lacking mid-bass slam or sounding bloated and overblown in that region.

So the key isn't to get speakers that can play far louder than you actually need - ie. the Horizon RAAL in this small of a room at these short seating distances. The key is to position and integrate the speakers properly with the room and with the subwoofers. Do that, and the Sierra-2 can provide all the mid-bass slam you could ever hope for in a room this small.

Don't get me wrong, if these are your "forever" speakers, like they are mine, and if you have even the slightest thought that you might move them to a larger room in the future, then by all means get the larger Tower RAAL or Horizon RAAL speakers! It's not as though they will sound worse than the Sierra-2 in your current room. I can attest to that! But it's just this idea that they're somehow actually needed in this particular setup; that's the only thing I'm taking issue with here.

I could easily, EASILY use a pair of Sierra-2 and a Sierra-2 Center as my Front 3 in my current room. The real magic was in setting up my pair of subwoofers (which again, are beyond overpowered for my current tiny space, but they are my "forever" subwoofers intended for a much larger room one day - their volume dial goes from 0 to 100. I have it them at 4 ;) ) at the mid-points of my left and right side walls. That positioning got me incredibly uniform, even response across my entire 3-seater sofa. That uniformity allows me to very easily equalize my bass response to be extremely linear and accurate. And by carefully selecting the crossover frequencies and getting a perfect, seamless blend, NOW I have excellent, delineated notes, and percussive, tactile mid-bass slam that sounds realistic, not enhanced or overblown, but just a very good facsimile of the way bass sounds in real life!

So if that is your goal, and I happen to know that it is ( ;) ), then the worry needs to be far less about the Sierra-2 vs. the Horizon RAAL and a lot more about just ensuring that you get your subwoofers (and yes, there need to be at least two, although four would be even better) positioned properly and calibrated in phase and output properly to produce even, uniform bass across all of your seats. Then have those subwoofers carefully integrated with your speakers so that the blend is truly seamless.

Getting more mid-bass and bass output from your speakers is unnecessary in such a small room with such a close seating distance. And trying to just get your Front speakers to play lower and louder can be detrimental rather than a benefit. We are not listening outdoors in a wide open field. We are not listening in a massive auditorium where the dimensions of the room exceed the wavelengths of the bass sound waves being produced. We are listening in a very small room, in this case, so we should be worried about what is appropriate, not just out-and-out, never-to-be-used capabilities.

Again, if the plan is to eventually move to a larger room, then by all means, get the speakers that will be suitable for those future plans. That's what I did. But if getting three Horizon RAAL speakers means you'll have to postpone getting a pair (or better yet, quad) of excellent subwoofers, then that is a poor choice and trade-off, IMO.

And I agree that many people go completely overboard with subwoofer output capabilities, as well. I mean, I'm hardly one to talk in my current situation - haha! But truly, a pair of SVS SB-1000 subwoofers would be perfectly adequate for this room size, while a pair of PB-1000 could practically blow the door off its hinges.

So I think we all could benefit from taking a breath here. I have zero problem with over-buying when future plans and ideas are involved. Obviously! haha. But if these speakers are going to stay in this very small room, let's not get caught up in capabilities that will never, ever be needed or used.

Sitting as far away as is physically possible in this room, the Sierra-2 would deliver something very close to 82dB of output using just a single Watt of power. And yet, they can utilize 150 Watts of power continuously. So how about something in the range of 102-103dB playing continuously? Is that not enough mid-bass slam for you? And they'll take a short term peak of 300 Watts, so hitting full 105dB Reference Volume peaks is no problem.

So if anything, maybe be more concerned about adding a really solid external amplifier that can deliver a really nice, silent noise floor plus more continuous power and higher peak power than your AV Receiver can likely muster. Again, probably not even necessary, but there's at least a possibility you'll actually use it, unlike the output capabilities of the Horizon RAAL speakers, which will just never come close to being used in your small room.

That's my thinking on this, in any case. And I'm not disagreeing that the Horizon RAAL can deliver more mid-bass slam than the Sierra-2. I'm just saying you really don't need it. The Sierra-2 can already hit 105dB if you feed them enough clean Wattage. Do you honestly believe you need/want 115db+? There's slam, and then there's silly, and then there's downright painful. So let's not worry ourselves too much with capabilities we'll never use. That's all :)

- Rob H. - AV Rant Podcast Co-host

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Originally Posted by FirstReflect

Guys, guys, guys...

...much like TheHorizon, these are my "forever" speakers, so I went ahead and got what will be appropriate for a 16 x 23 foot room with 12 and 18 foot seating distances.

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Rob H. with the clear and practical truth once again! Thanks buddy, as usual 😄

I am thinking of these as the last set of speakers I buy.

I didn't start off that way with this speaker hunt, however. I started with a budget of $2,750 across the front, thinking that in 5-10 years I would upgrade them and move them to surround duty or another room.

But then I started looking into the performance of these Ascend speakers (at least on paper and from owner opinions since--still working on finding an owner in Austin to let me demo them) because of Rob's strong recommendation for what I am looking for.

I saw that the RAAL Horizons, which are above my original budget, met all of my criterion (big soundstage, realism, imaging--mostly anyway but for those horizontal baffles--dynamic range, midbass slam), but also, critically, easy placement against/near the front wall because of their front firing ports, and for a price that was much less than what I thought I would have to pay for similar performance across the front stage down the road.

After a lot of emailing with you (you're very generous), it is clear to me that 3x Horizons are overkill for my room.

Truthfully, my current little two-and-half-way, 5" satellites, can play more than loudly enough in my room, though they don't play very clearly at that volume (or any volume).

The funny thing is that @davef doesn't think they are overkill for my room, but I think that's because he wants me to get the very best experience I can afford to pay for. And I get the feeling that he want to get Horizons into more people's homes because he believes in them so much.

That all said, the Horizons are the only front ported offered by Ascend today (@davef, how about front porting those Towers? 😄), so I have to go with the Horizons or wait until September for the Satellites, but I can't hold out that long.

And anyway, I wouldn't consider the Satellites the permanent upgrade to the front stage as I would the Horizons.

I'm sure you'd all agree to that!

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Originally Posted by FirstReflect

The key is to position and integrate the speakers properly with the room and with the subwoofers. Do that, and the Sierra-2 can provide all the mid-bass slam you could ever hope for in a room this small.

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Got it.

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Originally Posted by FirstReflect

But it's just this idea that they're somehow actually needed in this particular setup; that's the only thing I'm taking issue with here.

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Agreed, they aren't needed in my room. I do worry that I won't get the same kind of mid-range resolution with the S2 that I could get with the dedicated mid-range driver on the Horizon/Tower, but that's a case of future proofing. Because I'm looking at these as the last fronts I buy, I'd rather overshoot a bit than have buyer's remorse later when someone shows off their B&W Diamond 804s 😄

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Originally Posted by FirstReflect

And by carefully selecting the crossover frequencies and getting a perfect, seamless blend, NOW I have excellent, delineated notes, and percussive, tactile mid-bass slam that sounds realistic, not enhanced or overblown, but just a very good facsimile of the way bass sounds in real life!

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You can be sure I'm going to be emailing you about how to get this result, as well, once I get my pair of subs! 🍻 Don't worry, I will walk in with my homework already done.

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Originally Posted by FirstReflect

But if getting three Horizon RAAL speakers means you'll have to postpone getting a pair (or better yet, quad) of excellent subwoofers, then that is a poor choice and trade-off, IMO.

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I get it. But it looks like I'm stuck with the Horizons for the reasons above, so I'll have to wait until end of summer to upgrade the subs. But I'm ok with that--I don't yet know what I'm missing by not having dual subs 😆

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Originally Posted by FirstReflect

So if anything, maybe be more concerned about adding a really solid external amplifier that can deliver a really nice, silent noise floor plus more continuous power and higher peak power than your AV Receiver can likely muster.

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Definitely going to upgrade my AVR to get better and more power, and Atmos. It's in the budget.

So the last issue I'm facing is the imaging of the Horizons placed horizontally doing mains duty.

Waiting to hear from @davef on this and whether he can front port the Towers, in which case I would get imaging and placement!

I appreciate all of you guys' help on this upgrade. It will be my first HT upgrade in TEN years and comes after I feel like I've squeezed every last drop of performance out of my current--and very modest--setup.

Can't wait to see how much performance I can squeeze out of my new Ascend setup, whichever one it might be.

It's an exciting time!

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Originally Posted by curtis

Also, the slim Horizon should give you the same imaging as the Tower since the driver configuration is vertically aligned.

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Yes, but boy is it expensive to get custom cabinets! I checked with Dina.

Hoping Dave will consider front porting the Towers...

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Originally Posted by TheHorizon

Yes, but boy is it expensive to get custom cabinets! I checked with Dina.

Hoping Dave will consider front porting the Towers...

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But that will also be custom cabinets...just not as "custom". Not sure if Dave would have to do anything to the crossover for the front porting as well.

I went totally overboard with my setup for what I need as I don't ever want to upgrade again either, but I still don't feel like it's overkill for my room even though I sit between 7 and 10 feet away from the speakers, and I can't even play them past 50-60% of what my amp can do. I will be getting a better room eventually, but it's not going to be enormous either. I still think that going with the 3 way Sierras for the front stage instead of the (still incredible) 2 way speakers is important. That midrange driver is a real treat no matter how you look at it. Still, can't wait for my Sierra Sats for surround duty.

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Originally Posted by sludgeogre

I still think that going with the 3 way Sierras for the front stage instead of the (still incredible) 2 way speakers is important. That midrange driver is a real treat no matter how you look at it. Still, can't wait for my Sierra Sats for surround duty.

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Yeah, that midrange driver appeals me a lot. I enjoyed the mid driver in the Revel F36 a lot, so I can only believe that I will like the Horizon/Tower's mid, whichever I end up getting based on Dave's advice.

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Originally Posted by TheHorizon

Yes, but boy is it expensive to get custom cabinets! I checked with Dina.

Hoping Dave will consider front porting the Towers...

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We would be happy to offer you a front ported set of towers. It certainly is not a problem... Only issue is that our current production run of cabinets is nearly finished (painting / dying stage). You would have to wait for the next production run of cabinets (estimated lead time of 90 days) else the pricing will be much higher as it would be a true custom pair of cabinets, requiring our cabinet maker to build just the pair as opposed to a high volume run which is much more costly.

Please contact me by email to discuss...

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Originally Posted by davef

We would be happy to offer you a front ported set of towers. It certainly is not a problem... Only issue is that our current production run of cabinets is nearly finished (painting / dying stage). You would have to wait for the next production run of cabinets (estimated lead time of 90 days) else the pricing will be much higher as it would be a true custom pair of cabinets, requiring our cabinet maker to build just the pair as opposed to a high volume run which is much more costly.

Please contact me by email to discuss...

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Dave, have you gotten a chance to read some of the prior discussion regarding the Horizon's imaging when used as mains as affected by its wide baffle?

I appears that the Towers would image better than the Horizons because the Tower's baffles are narrower, of course.

I'd be interested in front-ported Towers if there is a significant enough issue with the Horizon's imaging as mains to warrant going with custom Towers.