DVD player suggestions?

[curtis]

So, now that I have a new TV, I am looking to upgrading my DVD-Video capablities.

I currently have the Pioneer 563a universal player. I have been happy with it. For CDs, I use the DACs in my pre/pro, DVD-Audio and SACD's sound fine as well.

But the video side of the 563a is pretty lacking. So I would like to approve upon that.

I can get a new, more expensive universal such as the Denon 2900 or 2910, those are in the price range I would like to stick to. Or I can get an inexpensive unit for DVD-Video only, such as the Bravo or Oppo units.

Any suggestions?

[jeh]

personally, i'm leaning towards the denon dvd-2200, as it's almost as good as the 2900 but a bit cheaper. i've seen refurbs on ecost for under $300

[BradJudy]

Curtis,

Have you looked at the DVD player benchmarks? http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/cgi-bin/shootout.cgi

The Denons, Panasonic S97 and Pioneer Elite 59 get good marks for video.

I have the same player as you and I'm thinking of getting a Denon 2910 when I get an HDTV.

[bikeman]

The Toshiba SD-V592 DVD-VHS combo kicked video butt in the Secrets review. I haven't heard of a comparable DVD stand alone unit from Toshiba.

David

[picasso]

Wait until the end of the year and HD DVD. Even the Playstation 3 will be capable of HD DVD with Blue-Ray. Of course, that means Xbox will be upgraded as well.

Within a year, they'll be everywhere................

[BradJudy]

I have to disagree with picasso. It will be a while before HD DVD or BluRay players are commonplace and inexpensive although the PS3 will drive mass market penetration. The PS3 is at least one year away (early to mid 2006 by most reports) and it is very unclear which format will be dominant. Personally, I expect it to be 2-3 years before there is a clear format winner and I would rather spend money now on a good DVD player than spend money in 18 months on what could be the next BetaMAX. (Probably an unfair statement as I'm sure there will eventually be universal players.)

I'll spare everyone my long thoughts on the topic, but there is little market driver for the HD optical formats outside of the HT enthusiast realm, so expect it to play out a lot like SACD/DVD-A - going nowhere fast because 95% of consumers could care less (a bit unfair as HD definitely has more consumer interest than multichannel ausio).

[Eddie Horton]

I agree with BradJudy. It'll take a while for the format war to shake out, and even longer for the bugs in the new players to be ironed out. DVD is around 10 years old and we're just now seeing players that have the major glitches (macroblocking, etc.) ironed out. Right now, I have a Zenith DVB-318 for DVD playback and an el cheapo Pioneer DV-578A for DVD-A and SACD. I was going to wait and then jump on HD, but have since changed my mind and decided to sell my current units and put a little extra cash with them and buy a Pio Elite DV-59AVi. That gets my vote, Curtis.

[curtis]

I have actually had discussions with other friends about HD-DVD and BluRay, as well as 1080p and beyond. I think all of these are at least a couple of years away from being mainstream, so I am not worried about it. As for the PS3, I have a friend that works at Sony(making games for the PS), so I am hoping to get one of those cheap(probably not cheap...but cheaper).

Anyways, right now, I am addicted to HD and my new TV. Watching and listening to the Grammys last night was GREAT. It has come down to where I do not want to watch SD programming anymore and only seek out HD shows. I think that has a lot to do with the fact that Adelphia's SD service in my area is pretty bad.

Anyways, after reading everything, it has come down to a Denon 2900 or 2910. The Pioneed 59AVi still has some weight too...especially since I have never had a problem with burned DVDs on my current cheapy 563a, but its price may be out of the ballpark.

[curtis]

Well....after some more research, I just ordered a refurbed Denon 2900 from eCost.

Anybody want to buy a used Pioneer 563a?

[BradJudy]

Curtis,

Did they actually have 2900s in stock? It seems like it is always listed, but rarely in stock.

I don't like how Denon did their new part numbers since the 3910 is effectively the replacement for the 2900. I have seen it said that the 480p output of the 2900 is as good as the upscaled output of the 2910, but I imagine that depends a lot on the quality of the scaler in the TV compared to the scaler in the 2910. I have definitely considered the route you picked, but I'm not sure.

[bikeman]

Curtis,
I've seen the 2910 @ ecost but not the 2900. Link?

David

[curtis]

Here is the link...hope to get it sometime this week.

http://www.ecost.com/ecost/shop/detail.asp?dpno=272986

Brad.....I read a lot, and communicated with a couple of people that have seen both in action on their TV's. In everything I have read, in the very least, the 2900 was almost equal to the 2910, but in most cases, the video output of the 2900 was favored. This is the component connection on the 2900 vs the digital connection on the 2910. The build of the 2900 is also more robust, and 2900 is much faster in reacting to menu selections and layer changes.

My new TV has a DVI connector, but I figure I will just use it for my Moxi box when the DVI output is enabled.

[Lou-the-dog]

That Denon sure seems to be "tate of the art!" Also I think, "it heaven on earth!" :D

Congrats Curtis, I think that 2900 will be a fine unit.

Randy

[curtis]

OK....got to play with the 2900 some last night and this morning.

The video quality is noticeably better than my 563a. Colors are more vivid and picture sharper.....better depth. It is not a "night and day" difference...but easily noticeable. Makes me wonder how much different it is than the 2910.

Audio is outstanding. I went back between the DACs on my pre/pro and the 2900......so far I am leaning toward the 2900, but much more listening needs to be done. Played one DVD-A.....again...outstanding.

One downside, it seems to have issues with some DVD-R's that I have burned. From what I have read, it is finicky on the media. I can get them all to play, it is just that some to not start properly. From what I have read, it seems to like DVD+R discs better than DVD-R. Not a big deal.

[curtis]

Really loving the 2900.

Found out it does not like cheap DVD-R media. I re-burned, from copies it did not like, to copies of those copies onto recommended media and have had no problems.

[jeh]

where did you end up getting it from curtis?

[curtis]

I got a refurb unit from eCost.com.

[frankd28]

Curtis, still loving your 2900? I beleive a new source would benifit my setup. Any worries going refurb? Quick update please.

Frank

[curtis]

Yup.....still loving it...and would buy a refurb again.

[cestlavie]

I'm looking for some suggestions for an i-link enabled universal media player (minus LD, and VHS). It is a relatively new technology as of right now, so the prices are pretty expensive, that much I do understand.

I would be matching it with a pioneer elite 56txi, which I got through a great deal for 500 bucks new, and am looking for a DVD player that isn't as expensive, maybe 200-300 at most, though I really like the elite line, and think it would be nice to have matching elites.

I'm wondering if anyone has any suggestions on paritcular models? I was looking at the 47ai, but the price is pretty expensive, and it did or still does exhibit the chroma bug problem, and if I'm going to drop 500 bucks on a dvd player, when I can just pay 30-40 for a not so great but gets the job done DVD player, it doesn't make much sense to me.

The other option is to wait, which is probably what I'm going to do unless convinced otherwise.

I'll probably be mating this with Ascend 340-cmts all around, in a 5.1 or maybe a 6.1 with an onix rs 650 sig for fun/movies, unless somehow it is relatively matched with the ascends.

TIA,

C'est

[curtis]

I don't think an iLink or firewire enable universal player exists in that price range.

I wouldn't mix a Rocket RS750 in with a 5.1 Ascend setup......the timbre will be off. Would be much less expensive to get another CMT-340 with a stand.

I can tell you that the refurb Denon 2900 does everything better than my Pioneer 563a....it was also 5 times the cost. If you want to sample hi-rez/multi-channel audio, a Pioneer 578a is a good way to go....it can be found for less than $150.

[cestlavie]

Thanks for the reply

Yeah I guess I was just hoping something would come up but of course it didnt. But I already bought the rocket, probably goin to use it for movies, and if not for movies, probably try to sell it. The price I bought it at actually puts it cheaper than getting ascends, which is why I bought it in the first place, despite not really liking it all that much.

Thanks again for your help,
C'est

[curtis]

You were able to get one RS750 for under $400??

[cestlavie]

yessir

[jimsiff]

Anybody want to buy a used Pioneer 563a?

Curtis, I'm looking to jump into hi rez audio with a light hit on the wallet. I've got a Panny DVD-S97 for video, but since it doesn't support SACD I'm looking for a reasonably priced entry into the universal player realm for audio only.
If you've still got your 563a available for sale, and it's well cared for, PM me.

[curtis]

Jim...got your PM and replied.

I have decided to use the 563a in my bedroom for video.

[gr1m]

how does the 563a compare to the samsung hd-841? i saw the 841 earlier today for $99 @ costco

[jimsiff]

They're comparable as far as being a universal player. The 841 upconverts video over DVI but has black crush issues. Shadow detail and dark scenes look worse compared to other upconverting players. Black crush doesn't occur over component, but the 841 won't upconvert via component. I don't believe that the 841 is a true DSD playback machine for SACD. It always converts it to PCM before output. If I didn't care about upconverting, the 841 is the best bang for the buck universal player available new. There were playback issues with some DVD-A discs but I believe these issues have been fixed with a firmware update available on the website.

The 563a doesn't convert DSD to PCM if you turn bass management off and use an Outlaw ICBM or your receiver for bass management. Note that most receivers don't do bass management for the multichannel analog input. Whether or not this is a big deal is debatable, but the signal is not altered between the transport and the DAC. The 563 doesn't upconvert, but has nice progressive scan PQ over component. The 563 is no longer available new, but can be had refurbished from Pioneer on eBay. The going rate for a 563a refurb was around $90 + shipping about 3 weeks ago. There have been numerous firmware updates to the 563a and they're only available by dropping the player off with Pioneer service.

With either player, I'd recommend an Outlaw ICBM for bass management if you plan to use DVD-A or SACD. I recently bought a refurb 563a from Pioneer. The total price was $104 including shipping... just over the 841's cost through Costco. I'd almost rather have the 841 with Costco's return policy and Samsung's firmware availability, but my gut and research says the 563a is a slightly better player for audio. If you're looking for a cheap universal player that has good PQ on component, you can't go wrong with either. If you're looking for a cheap universal player that upconverts, move up to the Samsung 941, but only if you have HDMI on your display. The 941 has black crush issues if you run HDMI>DVI but works fine if you go HDMI>HDMI.

[gr1m]

thanks for the response jimsiff...yes i'm considering an inexpensive dvd-a player

[fastnee]

I had the 841 for a short while...returned it because the sound would cut out on a regular basis when I listened in DTS. FYI.

[boxand1]

If you can find one out there... I would fully recommend the Denon 1600. It doesn't play SACD, but otherwise the audio is quite acceptable and the video is unbelievable--no chroma bug! I purchased mine for $250 at ecost.com... but I think they are $600 list price.

[jimsiff]

I had the 841 for a short while...returned it because the sound would cut out on a regular basis when I listened in DTS. FYI.

I understand why you got rid of the 841. Since that time, the DTS dropout bug has been resolved with a firmware update available at samsung.com.