PDA

View Full Version : I'm digitizing all my CD's - best way to listen to them?



Blingleberry
08-23-2020, 03:19 PM
I picked up a used Acronova Nimbie CD ripper and am gradually making my way through converting about 1500 CD's to lossless. I chose ALAC format since most of our gear is apple though I could easily convert to FLAC. The music is stored on a synology NAS. Synology has a few medial library servers options including an itunes server.

But what are the best options for listening in the house?

I have an Anthem 720 Receiver with my apple TV connected via HDMI. I'm a bit doubtful of the expensive DAC's on the market. They seem highly overpriced. I 'm not adverse to something raspberry PI based though. I've got a spare with a good quality audio daughter board (pisound) for music making. But the apple TV is probably more convenient.

Any suggestions?

Thx!

curtis
08-23-2020, 04:17 PM
I am not up to date with the options that support ALAC, but I'm pretty sure they are many. FLAC is pretty universal.

If you are looking for something to manage and enhance the experience with your music, I suggest having a look at Roon https://roonlabs.com/. It can do so much with all the metadata that is available for the music. It is a bit much to get started with as it consists of needing a core server and an endpoint(your RPi can be used as an endpoint), and some are put off by the cost, but for me, I find it excellent and can't imagine not using it, but I also got lucky and got a lifetime subscription before the price increase.

Another option, and less costly, is using a device with BlueOS. The Node 2i is pretty popular, but I have no experience with it. It can also be used with Roon. https://www.bluesound.com/products/node/

As you have said, since you are Apple-centric, the AppleTV is easy and convenient.

white_darren
08-24-2020, 05:59 AM
I did something similar except I'm not an Apple guy. I ripped all our CDs to FLAC and, like you, have them stored on a Synology NAS. I run a Plex Media Server on my Synology NAS and a Plex client on my Amazon Fire TV Cube which is connected to a Marantz AVR. I love this setup for music but I also use Plex as an OTA DVR for a few things - comes in handy when the internet is down like last week when ATT sub-contractors cut the fiber to our house.

Blingleberry
08-24-2020, 08:29 AM
I sometimes use Plex for movies but not music. I didn't really like it for music but I could try it again.

So what's the value for Roon? It handles streaming and also organizing your music library, but you still have to have a DAC?

curtis
08-24-2020, 09:01 AM
So what's the value for Roon? It handles streaming and also organizing your music library, but you still have to have a DAC?
It is so hard to describe Roon. It does so many things. There are many articles written about it if you do a google search.

You don't "need" a DAC, but you do need a Roon endpoint.
https://roonlabs.com/howroonworks

curtis
08-24-2020, 09:09 AM
Since you are Apple-centric, this might be a good article for you to read on Roon.

https://www.digitaltrends.com/home-theater/what-is-roon-itunes-alternative/

SunByrne
08-24-2020, 06:14 PM
I have an Anthem 720 Receiver with my apple TV connected via HDMI.

Yep, that has a DAC in it that should work more than fine. I'm not sure why you'd even consider an outboard DAC here.

I have most of my music ripped to ALAC and on a Synology NAS as well. I just run in through my HT receiver.

Blingleberry
08-25-2020, 10:45 AM
Thx!

How do you search and find what you want to listen to? Just browsing the folders?

Do you need to run some kind of librarian management server like itunes or plex?

SunByrne
08-25-2020, 01:41 PM
Thx!

How do you search and find what you want to listen to? Just browsing the folders?

Do you need to run some kind of librarian management server like itunes or plex?

You could do it by browsing folders or whatever, and sometimes I do that, but I also run Plex on the NAS itself. Plex has some oddities but it works well enough.

bkdc
06-16-2022, 08:07 AM
My entire library is digitized. I have a lifetime subscription to Roon. I also run Plex for my movie library and can access my music via Plex on my home theater system. There are many competitors to Roon but none of them can organize a gargantuan library the way Roon can. Given the size of my library, it was the natural choice.

My opinion is that FLAC is wasted space. Drive space is cheap so I understand why people want "lossless", but the human ear cannot distinguish from high quality compressed audio and FLAC. High quality means V2 (APS) or V3 (APX) or 320CBR on LAME encoded mp3 files after extraction of the .wav files using an errorless ripper (like Exact Audio Copy). LAME is the best mp3 encoder on the planet.

Blingleberry
06-16-2022, 08:29 AM
Ah - an oldie.

I committed to roon and completed this project after the start of covid. I sold the Nimbie for near what I paid for it so I was happy about that.

I run Roon ROCK on an old IBM NUC. It has a small 128 GB SSD for the database. But the music is on a synology NAS. Probably about 50,000 files. I also use QuBoz for streaming stuff I don't own.

For end points, I bought a few Blusound speakers for around the house. But my main system has a HiFiberry streamer. I don't see much value in expensive streamers and glad I didn't go that way. The hifiberry cost me < $175 and compares favorably to listening to music in my music studio through Genelecs and an RME interface.

I disagree about lossless vs compressed formats as space is so cheap. And I can tell when mp3's come up vs newer rips. But they're a mix of quality, esp if they're from the napster days.

Overall I'm pretty happy with the setup but Roon did not do a very good job of grouping compilations and I need to probably go through and fix some meta data to straighten them out.

curtis
06-16-2022, 11:57 AM
I also run Roon/ROCK on an Intel NUC. Lifetime subscription.

I use a RaspberryPi 4 running Roon Bridge on VitOS into two different DACs.

Currently have Tidal and Qobuz subscriptions. My local library is all FLAC.

I love the setup and music at my fingertips!

bkdc
06-16-2022, 01:45 PM
I disagree about lossless vs compressed formats as space is so cheap. And I can tell when mp3's come up vs newer rips. But they're a mix of quality, esp if they're from the napster days.


Not all MP3’s are the same even if they are similarly sized in bitrate. There are some CRAPPY MP3 files floating around.

If encoded properly (as I described, an error-free rip to .wav file followed by LAME encoder at higher than V2 setting), your ear won’t be able to tell the difference compared to a hi-res 192kHz/24-bit original. It follows that a CD quality wav is indistinguishable from a 192kHz/24-bit digital master version of the same file. What matters is the recording/master quality. You can learn more from the guys at HydrogenAudio.

One of the members mentioned that he uses a Eugene Rufollo song as a test track for speaker demo’s as the details on the guitar strings tests the tweeter. I own this album (from Stockfisch records… and all modern recordings (mostly folk and acoustic) from Stockfisch are done with painstaking detail to reproduce high quality sound), but the MP3 I ripped is indistinguishable from the original.

You should try an ABX test at home. But as you said, drive space is cheap… until you start pushing thousands to tens of thousands of albums in FLACs.


Curtis and I are kindred spirits. I run Roon Server on an Intel NUC. Because it’s a modern NUC it does not support Roon Rock. I’m have Raspberry Pi4 running into DACs.

Blingleberry
06-16-2022, 03:51 PM
I have a 24TB NAS so I'm not running low on space any time soon. LOL.

I feel like I can hear the diff even between good MP3's - such as when I'm mixing/mastering my own music and am listening super closely, switching between genelecs, auratones or headphones. I make MP3's when I share stuff with my friends using Lame as it's what Reaper uses.

It could be mental bias but since I have the space I don't worry about it. And since I started my whole effort to redigitize my cd's from scratch 2 years ago, it made sense to use flac or alac as my goal was to then get them out of the house and maybe sell or donate them.

My only problems with Roon, other than the occasional crash or stopping, is really two things:

1) I don't think it handled my Compilations very well. I need to look into that further.

2) my old MP3's were a bit of a mess as over the years itunes or attempts to fix the tags just propagated problems.

I tried songkong and other tools many many times and feel like I wasted months of my life trying to get the tags right. So I gave it my best shot last year and then just focused on reripping my CD's and starting fresh.

So I have folders setup like this and let Roon pick the higher quality files when there are dupes. Although I should probably delete the older mp3's that are dupes.

j:\music\olditunes
j:\music\lossless

If I deleted the lower fidelity dupes and cleaned up the compilations, I'd be happier with roon. But that's a project that will have to wait!

bkdc
06-17-2022, 09:18 AM
I find that it’s more a question of recording technique/mastering than sampling.

I was introducing my 3 1/2 year old daughter to IEM’s (got a good fit with small Spinfits) and played Taylor Swift back to back with Sara K. (Made in the Shade album from Stockfisch records). Both are MP3’s encoded in identical manner (as I previously described). The difference could not be so stark. Crappy compressed sound quality from Taylor Swift’s album in contrast to a beautifully recorded uncompressed Sara K in audiophile glory with string plucking details and all. But Taylor Swift’s songs are meant to be listened to by the general public while walking around Manhattan with AirPods or in a noisy car…. Given a background noise of 60-70dB in the car, you are compressing the remaining audible music in a dynamic range of 20 to 30dB. Sara K’s album is for people listening in a quiet home environment.

I can highly recommend Made in the Shade and her other album Hell or High Water as audiophile audition albums.

curtis
06-18-2022, 08:23 AM
Curtis and I are kindred spirits. I run Roon Server on an Intel NUC. Because it’s a modern NUC it does not support Roon Rock. I’m have Raspberry Pi4 running into DACs.
Have you checked lately? How modern? Gen 10 NUCs are now supported.

bkdc
06-23-2022, 07:52 PM
Have you checked lately? How modern? Gen 10 NUCs are now supported.

I'm Gen 11. There is no legacy boot mode on the newer nucs. I was tired of waiting for Roon to release a new OS version. Decided to just run Roon Server it in the background of Windows 11 and use the same NUC for web surfing in my family area.

curtis
06-24-2022, 08:24 AM
I'm Gen 11. There is no legacy boot mode on the newer nucs. I was tired of waiting for Roon to release a new OS version. Decided to just run Roon Server it in the background of Windows 11 and use the same NUC for web surfing in my family area.
Got it.
I have a gen 8 and ROCK has been incredibly solid/reliable for me.

I thought the new OS was going to be available a while ago.

Blingleberry
02-01-2024, 07:43 AM
Save money and buy an older NUC. My old Lenovo is still working perfectly and serves music to the whole house.

curtis
02-01-2024, 11:24 AM
Been running Roon/ROCK on 8th gen i5 NUC since 2019. Still solid!